The Towers : The Elder Scrolls Series Discussion

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 10:42 pm

2) It is shaped like a tower, and thus gains a small mythic force simply by being shaped that way, even if that was not the intent. A crazy telvanni could make his tower absurdly powerful, just by cultivating a few additional pods around it, in tribute to the universe, the same way that White Gold does.

No it won't.

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 1:43 pm

No it won't.

And just why not?

Mythotecture is just reinactment, and grand theatre.

Cyrrodiil became the center of the universe, because the Ayleids MADE it that way.

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 1:25 pm

I have an absurdly powerful mythic force IN MY PANTS! :woot:

That could be why towers have a mythic force; because of their similar shape.
[/Freud]

Probably not the case, but I like giving a Freudian interperetation; its fun.

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 7:13 pm

No it won't.

Maybe if it imulated the Wheel, it could.

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 8:09 pm

And just why not?
Mythotecture is just reinactment, and grand theatre.
Cyrrodiil became the center of the universe, because the Ayleids MADE it that way.

Indeed. Much of whatever major happens in the Aurbis is essentially reenactment.

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 1:39 pm

And just why not?
Mythotecture is just reinactment, and grand theatre.
Cyrrodiil became the center of the universe, because the Ayleids MADE it that way.

Sure, but those little pods won't make it like White-Gold.

Cyrodiil is the center. But, the city ain't just part of the Tower.

964000: ya' that's the point.

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 10:05 pm

Sure, but those little pods won't make it like White-Gold.

Cyrodiil is the center. But, the city ain't just part of the Tower.

964000: ya' that's the point.

The towers built into the city are only approximations, and tributes to the actual mythostructure of the universe.

Spore pods arranged in the same way, with the same intent, would have the same effect. However, there can't be TWO centers. It would cause a dischord of very bad stuff. White Gold is older, and more powerful as a result.

» Thu Aug 20, 2009 2:10 am

The towers built into the city are only approximations, and tributes to the actual mythostructure of the universe.
Spore pods arranged in the same way, with the same intent, would have the same effect. However, there can't be TWO centers. It would cause a dischord of very bad stuff. White Gold is older, and more powerful as a result.

Location, location, location...

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 3:01 pm

Location, location, location...

I think I just explained that---- Cyrrodiil BECAME the center of attention, BECAUSE of white Gold----

Not the other way around.

"like above, so below", and, conversely through association:

"So below, so above"

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 7:19 pm

I think I just explained that---- Cyrrodiil BECAME the center of attention, BECAUSE of white Gold----

Not the other way around.

Would this also explain why the Nords, Dwemer, and Chimer settled around Red Tower?

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 11:28 am

I think I just explained that---- Cyrrodiil BECAME the center of attention, BECAUSE of white Gold----

Not the other way around.
"like above, so below", and, conversely through association:
"So below, so above"

And conveniently, where is it at?

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 10:13 pm

And conveniently, where is it at?

Given the mythostructure basis of the universe, and the material world-- The better question is, why is white gold the center.

The tower makes it so.

Not the other way around. Why do you think white gold is so important?

Adamantine cemented the world in reality, and Red Tower cemented it's stability without the presence of the divine, but the other tower's set it's physical shape.

Is it any coincidence that Orihalc tower went bye bye, and Yuku sank?

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 11:56 pm

Given the mythostructure basis of the universe, and the material world-- The better question is, why is white gold the center.
The tower makes it so.

Not the other way around. Why do you think white gold is so important?

Because it forms a center for the ring around the other towers of Tamriel.

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 2:02 pm

Because it forms a center for the ring around the other towers of Tamriel.

Why is it on THIS side of Nirn, and not the other, smarty pants?

;)

What I am saying is--- If White Gold had been built in some other place on Nirn, Nirn itself would have changed to accomodate the tower, and it's intent. Hence, "Shaping reality."

Towers shape reality. Reality does not shape the tower. Thus, the "location" argument is a non-sequitur.

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 2:55 pm

Why is it on THIS side of Nirn, and not the other, smarty pants?
;)
What I am saying is--- If White Gold had been built in some other place on Nirn, Nirn itself would have changed to accomodate the tower, and it's intent. Hence, "Shaping reality."

Except it wouldn't have the power where its location would be. It forms a wheel in its location.

I'm beginning to think you don't see the true size of a tower until you see the bigger picture. The Imperial city itself is merely a portion of what you see, relative to its location around eight "lesser" towers to form a gigantic Wheel or ring.

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 11:58 pm

Except it wouldn't have the power where its location would be. It forms a wheel in its location.

I'm beginning to think you don't see the true size of a tower until you see the bigger picture. The Imperial city itself is merely a portion of what you see, relative to its location around eight "lesser" towers to form a gigantic Wheel or ring.

No, YOU are not understanding what I am telling you.

White gold CHANGED the SHAPE of the world, so that what you are saying is true.

The Ayleids wanted to be at the center of the world, and they MADE it so.

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 1:35 pm

No, YOU are not understanding what I am telling you.
White gold CHANGED the SHAPE of the world, so that what you are saying is true.

The Ayleids wanted to be at the center of the world, and they MADE it so.

The center gives it power. Building an image of the wheel from a Telvanni tower won't grant it exact power like White-Gold.

Because White-Gold is much bigger in scale due to the huge image it creates.

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 2:30 pm

The center gives it power. Building an image of the wheel from a Telvanni tower won't grant it exact power like White-Gold.

Because White-Gold is much bigger in scale due to the huge image it creates.

I'd say the world would reconcile the two images, and would place said Telvanni's tower on the opposite end of the planet, so that the same illusion occurs for both places.

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 3:46 pm

Why is it on THIS side of Nirn, and not the other, smarty pants?
;)
What I am saying is--- If White Gold had been built in some other place on Nirn, Nirn itself would have changed to accomodate the tower, and it's intent. Hence, "Shaping reality."
Towers shape reality. Reality does not shape the tower. Thus, the "location" argument is a non-sequitur.

If the network of towers looked like a scatterplot graph, it would have no power. White Gold's (recent) construction painted the mythical imitation of the wheel- during linear time.

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 2:47 pm

If the network of towers looked like a scatterplot graph, it would have no power. White Gold's (recent) construction painted the mythical imitation of the wheel- during linear time.

How can you be so sure?

Tower Making is like Myth Making; Being at the center is central to the myth that White Gold generates.

Much like Vivec and friends were "Always gods" even though they used the tools to become such, White Gold was 'Always' at the center, even though it's creation placed it there.

» Wed Aug 19, 2009 5:18 pm

How can you be so sure?
Tower Making is like Myth Making; Being at the center is central to the myth that White Gold generates.

Much like Vivec and friends were "Always gods" even though they used the tools to become such, White Gold was 'Always' at the center, even though it's creation placed it there.

Anything with the power of myth behind it adheres to a precedent. And that precedent comes from an earlier time. Agreed, time is changeable, but what if the precedent comes from a higher subgradient?

Mimicking the interplay of a higher subgradient can grant you temperoral, earthly power. But to replace the interplay of a higher subgradient with your own is a loftier goal. I'm not sure which White Gold qualifies as.