Why the new direction is the right direction : V - Skyrim

» Mon Jun 27, 2011 7:54 am

I don't understand this "I can't roleplay with or with out this one feature"
Seriously, if you need to have or not have something to imagine (which is required to role play) what your character is like, then RPG's are not for you.
The taking out of attributes doesn't bother me. Why, because I am an old school RPG'r.... I don't need any verification on who my character is. I can do just fine using my RPG skills and my imagination. I don't need a attribute to limit what I can do, because as an old DM I do fine managing what my character can do just fine, all by myself. My character won't be acting like a muscle man, not because his strength is low... but because I've made my character an agility based character. I didn't need attributes to tell me that...... I told myself that......

Attributes are for people who can't imagine and can't role play their character without some outside force telling them what to do. Is this a problem?? NO, I don't mind people like that. That is why we have DM's with pen and paper RPG's. But Skyrim is for those of us who played RPG's before they got popular. Back when you had to make the stuff up, and self restraint was a requirement.

You can think however you want to think, and Rp however you want to Rp, but for a game that runs on numbers, is comprised of numbers, I really cannot see the logic in such statements . YES the game needs to tell YOU the PLAYER how your CHARACTER in the GAME can and cannot DO in the GAME. the GAME does not care what you THINK. it does not care if you walk all the time because your roleplaying and old fart, it does not care, so yes to understand how your CHARACTER in the GAME will function yes you need to be told the Stats, this is not 2022 gaming isnt so far advanced that it can make up whatever you think. Your playing in the World of TES you follow its Rules just like all the other npcs.

» Mon Jun 27, 2011 2:12 pm

The OP almost sounded like an Evangelist Sermon...

M

Nope. Definitely did not.

OP is why RPG fans can't have nice things.
Fans of those scary stats and classes used to have our games, and you had yours. They're called action games. You're getting your action all over my RPG.

TES games are officially classified as "Action - RPGs" Did you miss the memo?

Morrowind and Oblivion are night and day different. Morrowind actually allowed you to explore and use your head for something other than a hat rack. Oblvion handed everything to you with the GPS compass. There was no role playing.

Role Playing is more than just leveling up and picking stats. Role Playing means you immerse yourself in the game, into the role of the character you create. How can you immerse yourself when the game gives you everything?

:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:

You're totally right, the immersion, roleplaying, stats, exploration, and the games are broken. Thanks so much for reminding us all why we hate and despise Bethesda for making TES games.

» Mon Jun 27, 2011 5:19 am

My only disappointment with the direction of TES games (since it seems they did learn their lesson on level scaling) is the shrinking pool of options from game to game. Morrowind had a robust list of skills, NPCs, clothing, weapons, and armor (I really miss clothes with armor). You used to be able to play most fantasy archetypes: knights, monks, wizards, pikeman, thieves, archers, even a bar brawler (never quite there on Bards). All of those options had skills that you could work on to make your character better.

At this point you get to play Warrior, Wizard, Thief, and Archer or a hybridization of those four. Sure, they've invested time into making each of those playstyles better, however anything else is out to dry. No more running around in a robe and destroying enemies with my bare hands or a big stick.

Hmm, you do know that say every single style that you come up with is a sort of "hybridization" (if this is even a word) from those 3 major archtypes (archer is a pure thief or a hybrid between thief and warrior,btw). Like a monk is a mix between Warrior and thief, Spellsword is obviously a mix between warrior and mage, etc... It's like RGB color system, for classes! We could call it WMT! If you seriously think you'll become more limited in this sense, I fear for your imagination...

» Sun Jun 26, 2011 11:09 pm

Now before I say anything, just let me say that i agree with you on the whole but i'm going to touch on a point.

Like one person has pointed out, even though it is difficult to achieve, it would be great if we could tell the stength of an enemy through his animations. This would add a whole new layer of complexity and immersion. Oh well, I can dream.

Why do we need to be able to tell an enemy's strength through animations when we can't even tell an enemy's strength through numbers? Unless of course you open up the CS and look at the actual numbers used by the game engine. That's irrelevant though because this isn't about gauging the NPcs it's about gauging the PC.

» Mon Jun 27, 2011 9:37 am

Now before I say anything, just let me say that i agree with you on the whole but i'm going to touch on a point.

Why do we need to be able to tell an enemy's strength through animations when we can't even tell an enemy's strength through numbers? Unless of course you open up the CS and look at the actual numbers used by the game engine. That's irrelevant though because this isn't about gauging the NPcs it's about gauging the PC.

I just used it as an example how the genre can move forward without relying on statistics and attributes, a direction that i think the genre is going in.

» Mon Jun 27, 2011 3:13 am

I think that Oblivion found the perfect balance between RPG and action elements. Skyrim seems not too different from Oblivion so I'm not worried at all.

I wouldn't say OB found the perfect balance, but it was pretty darn close. Skyrim seems to be refining those action elements and enhancing the RPG elements. Skyrim just might strike that perfect balance, I'm pretty excited for 11/11/11.

» Mon Jun 27, 2011 2:36 am

OP is why RPG fans can't have nice things.
Fans of those scary stats and classes used to have our games, and you had yours. They're called action games. You're getting your action all over my RPG.

:cryvaultboy: This is exactly how I feel.

» Mon Jun 27, 2011 5:30 am

LOL!

I roleplay when I play FPSs. Ive never needed a bunch of numbers or stats to tell me who I am. :shrug:

Unless the numbers and stats PREVENT you from roleplaying, then that's a moot point and is obviously only included to heap a bit of scorn on people who might not be blessed with the profound imagination you claim to possess.

Some people like the numbers and stats. They certainly don't get in your way - if you can "roleplay" playing Pong, then I don't believe that a set of numbers on an entirely separate screen is going to suddenly make it impossible for you to roleplay, so why not just get over it and accept the fact that other people like a thing that doesn't create any hardship for you?

» Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:01 am

Uhm, yeah, this can go both awys.

"You have the Fable Series. Why ruin our series?"
"You have classics such as Zelda, while we have Morrowind"
"Old time TES is the ONLY open world rpg that continues with a classical gameplay in a unique world"

I honestly don't care enough to debate, but your points are completely invalid.

P.S. - I don't hate Skyrim's system, FYI. I am worried that they might screw up, obviously (anyone who doesn't is a tad bit of an idiot [BLIND FAITH <3]), but I remain hopeful.