I had a little brush with death a couple months ago (in real life of course) and i was doing the dark brotherhood quests, but after being confronted with my own mortality i didnt want to do that anymore and i havent played it since. I've thought about making a new character and trying it again, but for some reason even though i want to do it i also dont.

I just tried to make a thieves guild character, but for some reason i dont want to do it.

It doesnt make any sense, i want to do something, but i dont bc it's immoral.

But what else is there to do in the game? all the 'good guy' stuff appears to be religiously based (something i cant stand) and even though the mages guild is secular and non-evil, i just cant resist the idea of making an all-powerful evil mage so i'm actually reluctant to play it.

I've tried the main quest, but i gave up on it very very quickly bc it's just too blooming hard. I've only ever gotten past the first oblivion gate thing once, and that was after a week of trying over and over again for several hours each day (i died every minute or two pretty much). Essentially i just did it until i got lucky. I dont enjoy that.

I've thought about doing the shivering isles thing, but from what i've seen of it that's also doing evil things and ontop of that you're working directly for a god of all things.

What can i do? i'm starting to think i need to just abandon this game bc i'm getting no enjoyment at all out of it anymore. all it's doing is making me feel like a monster.

My condolences..

Your still mourning about the death of (...), but if you give yourself time to mourn things will and shall be different in the future.

Put Oblivion aside for a while and.........

actually i meant i came close to dying myself. or at least i thought i did. my father accidentally elbowed me in the face as hard as he could while we were trying to start an old chainsaw (my face was just in the wrong place at exactly the wrong moment). i bled out of my nose, had a huge headache for several days, and felt sick and thought i was going to die. luckily for me i didnt and apparently most of my symptoms actually came from a bug i just so happened to catch at the same time. no noone in my family died, i just thought i was going to die for a while.

Bummer. Did your dad buy you ice cream? I've made an character just about a week ago, the Honorable Ronin. He is pure good. Will not do anything evil. Which means certain guilds are not joined, certain quests are not done. I do things that feel good morally....
Although KOTN, has religious tones, (I'm not religious by any stretch, though inexplicably, have prayed to God in life or death situations.... go figure) I don't see a problem for one taking on this quest line.
The Main Quest also is good vs. evil. There's nothing wrong with turning down the difficulty if you're having problems, like dying a lot. Some Daedric Quests have evil undertones, some do not. Pick and choose.

My two septims.

edit: I agree, that doing the SI involves questionable deeds. Perhaps a roleplay would be in order.

Hm, that's something completely different, my apologies for misunderstanding your post.

Just some thoughts. . .

Start a character with the same values you expess. Don't plot his course or plan his future or tell him information that he would not know. Explore Cyrodiil. People will ask him to do things. He should evaluate those requests as he gets them. If a quest seems unpalatable, don't do it. If a quest, once started, becomes unpalatable, he can walk away. Kind of like life.

Example (w/o spoilers): My character has talked with every Daedra Lord that has a shrine and learned what task they want accomplished. She has completed almost half of them, flat rejected almost half and walked away in the middle of a few of them. She is curious and talks with lots of people. She helps those that stike her fancy and declines those tasks that she does not want to do. She has more quests in her log that she will not do than ones she will, and you know what? Having quests in her log that she will never finish doesn't bother her a bit.

There are plenty of noble tasks that need doing in Cyrodiil. Since it seems your char may be rejecting any with religious overtones, that number will be reduced. If that proves too restrictive, try a different game.

^This.

I was formulating a response as I read through the thread, but Acadian already said most of what I would've said. (Hardly the first time that's happened).

So-- just for emphasis, and as long as I'm typing anyway-- don't stress in advance about what you think a character might or might not do or can or cannot do or should or should not do and don't try to map out a path for the character. Just create a character who appeals to you, for whatever reason, start the game up, and see what happens. When the game presents you with a choice, stop and look at it through the eyes of that character-- try to envision the character's values and beliefs and fears and interests and figure out what the character would do in that situation, then just do it. If you do that with every choice-- base the decision on your perception of that character's personality and thus on what s/he would do rather than what you would do, the character will start to grow and take on a life of its own. Next thing you know, if you just keep concentrating on the character's personality and figuring out more about it, you'll just be an observer and button-pusher while the character makes its own way through the world. And that, to me, is the most fun that can be had in this game.

I rolled Angel as a child who had been orphaned. I usee the console to reduce her size. I saw her as frightened and alone. For the first week She was compulsive about talking to everyone she met in the Imperial City. Everybody came to like her but nobody took an interest in her situation and slowly she realized she would have to take care of herself. Pilfering from the barrels and crates, she scurried around in the shadows as she upgraded her cloths and bought the apparatus and ingredients for her first tentative potions. At last, she drew up her courage and ventured out onto the road.

In time, Angel came to be a powerful mage but she used her magic primarily to avoid killing. I no longer play that character because I play dead-is-dead and I couldn't stand it if she died so she formally retired to the Arcane University as a researcher where she still occasionally tests experimental spells.

For me, the pleasure in the game is about an interesting character and how they personally will grow over time, how they view their own life and the world around them. The game can be treated as a sandbox where you make up your own stories and do your own thing. The best part is the feeling of creativity that comes from coloring outside the lines.

i dont mind killing in self-defense. i happily kill bandits and highwaymen and goblins if they get in my way. though now that i think about it, i also enjoy caving where i kill people and goblins and w/e else just for money and items (btw, in one cave i found at a low level like 3 or 4 i found a staff with a 20 damage ranged shock spell with over a 100 uses on it, it was worth several thousand gold. i loved that thing). how is that any different from being hired to kill civilians in cities and villages?

what sickens me is now it sounds ok to me bc its no different from everything else i do....

Sounds like you might need to take a break from video games for awhile.

[to the creator of the post]
You might need to think about how to play good/evil characters.

For example, and the traditional Dungeons & Dragons style char gen, you have Good, Neutral and Evil.

Furthermore, you have True XXX, Neutral XXX, Chaotic XXX (XXX represents G/N/E)

Thus, you can create (like me) a Dark Elf "Black Blade" (Custom Class), who is Chaotic Good. That is, he does righteous tasks, helping people etc, but he is prone to dip into "dark" acts. He summons Daedric monsters, and doesn't care much for anything that gets in his way. He goes into the zone and focuses on his task.

As another example, you could create a True Good char, that is pure and holy. He could use Restoration, Blade (use a katana maybe), and a holy shield.
Unfortuantely, the entire Elder Scrolls series is religious, so you'll have to bear with it, or change games.

Obviously, you have played Chaotic Evil (ie, a vicious Murderer) but you could adapt that to Neutral Evil (a thief perhaps -- he doesn't kill [Chaotic Evil], but isn't twisted by Evil ways [True Evil], but still what he does isn't good either)

This isn't written in stone of course, but as a general rule;

[True] anything is the epitome of that Morality. True Evil is black and wicked, True Good is holy and righteous and True Neutral is more of a mercanary, come and go type person
[Neutral] anything are in the middle. Yeah, they might dip into either end, but at the end of the day, they sought of just stick to the middle road, unphased by either pull.
[Chaotic] anything don't care about consequences. Wether they are evil is questionable; they might be Good, but they get in the bad books often. Chaotic Evil chars are usually killers.

That's my whole take on good/evil characters.

Getting elbowed was a turning point in your life?

Wow.

I could understand this, when a power tool is being revved up and some random instance you get knocked off your feet from some force and your thinking maybe I got sawed by the chainsaw.

But, I was in a car wreck a few weeks ago, luckily people only had a few cuts and scraqes, I was zoned out for a bit with my car in the heap. Airbag punched me right in the face and lost my glasses. Not really a death experience but still, 'wtf just happened?', kind of thing.

Don't worryI think in a few days or weeks you'll be fine, the mind has a great way of forgetting details(for me anyways).

Hmm, let me try this again regarding playing a character that is basically good - not perfect mind you, just on balance, good. You do not have to do things in the game that don't suit your character. This time, let my character, Buffy try to explain. Here is an excerpt from her journal that displays her attitude towards killing:

* * *
"If that is true," I replied, "why do you not slay me? For that matter, why do you not kill everyone in Bravil?"

"Bravil is where I choose to live. I need the services the town offers, and I have. . . grown to know some of the people that live here. And what of you, Buffy? Your skills and equipment attest that you are no stranger to killing."

"I have a doctrine that I live by. It's written in blood."

"A doctrine that tells you when to kill?" The assassin flashed a smile. His look of boredom was now one of mild amusemant. "I'd love to hear it."

I recited The Buffy Doctrine: "If you are kind to me, I will love you dearly; if you are mean to me or my friends, I will likely kill you."

An eyebrow arched. "Buffy, what a deliciously fascinating creature of contradictions you are!"

"I have learned to survive in a harsh land, and I lay no claim to goodness." Defiantly returning his gaze, I continued, "killing with my bow is exhilarating, and I do not apologize for that. When my friends are threatened, I freely admit to rage, vengeance and even cruelty. I - I simply do not kill innocent people. Aradroth, I'm sorry you feel no kindness. I hope someday that will change for you." Holding up my goblet, I initiated a toast to change the mood, "Here's to a lot more understanding of each other than we had an hour ago."
* * *

As odd as it may sound, it starts with respect for your character. If he/she is a crash dummy you push around within the game, then their deeds will always be despicable and their deaths ignoble.

I play dead-is-dead meaning that if a character dies in the game, I will never load that character again. Their mortality weighs down on them and colors their choices. When they do something truly heroic It can give me chills but I have seen then run away in craven cowardice from battles I am sure they could have won.

Once, Sarrah stood over a fallen traveler on the side of the road and refused to move despite the fact that she was being attacked by a bear. She demanded that I use the console to resurrect the man and stood still so that I would have a perfect view for using the console. She knew that if she died it would be a true death but she was willing to risk it to save a life. Nevertheless she had the heart of a Valkyrie and reveled in the adrenalin rush of combat. She closed 38 O.B. gates by killing everything that moved inside them. On the other hand she was a prankster with an outrageous sense of humor but never mean spirited.

it wasn't a tap. i went from bending over at 90 degrees (i was supposed to be holding the throttle while he pulled on the cord as hard as he could, that typically works) when he suddenly tried to pull the cord and hit me in the upper teeth. I went from bending over to flat on my back in less than a second. i wasnt too happy about it and i started to panic when i realized that i was bleeding out of my face. the issue was the symptoms i started feeling later, i thought i had a hemorage or something.

No, it's Good/Neutral/Evil and Lawful/Neutral/Chaotic.


Chaotic doesn't imply "dark," it implies disregard for laws.


Lawful, not True, and it's not the "epitome" of anything.

Lawful Evil is not necessarily "black and wicked," it is someone who performs their evil completely within the restrictions of local laws. Or perhaps subverts the laws to their own bidding.

This is the two-axis morality system that D&D has had since AD&D.