Items jump when entering a room : IV

» Thu Aug 25, 2011 4:34 pm

When I enter a room with lots of stuff sitting out, I usually see things jump, fall over or roll off a counter. If I take an item off a dining table, everything on the table moves, as though I pulled the tablecloth out from under it.

Is this normal? Or caused by certain mods?

» Thu Aug 25, 2011 4:11 pm

Not sure I can explain briefly why this is but my bet is http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=15677 solves it.

Load dead last - after all other mods - leave active ... do not merge into bash.

» Thu Aug 25, 2011 6:53 pm

Yes, it's normal. It's part of Oblivion's Havok physics implementation, which really isn't very good.

Nothing can be done through mods to fix this, it's an engine level bug.

» Thu Aug 25, 2011 10:45 am

Yes, it's normal. It's part of Oblivion's Havok physics implementation, which really isn't very good.

Nothing can be done through mods to fix this, it's an engine level bug.

This. It's caused when the designers press "F" in the CS, which makes the objects fall to the next surface with collision. Which ends up in the colision meshes/boxes touching each other, which causes things to bounce around. Perhaps if ShadeMe added something into the CSE that altered this behavior it would help for future mods. But short of moving every single Havok'd object in the game slightly upwards you won't find a proper solution.

» Fri Aug 26, 2011 12:02 am

This. It's caused when the designers press "F" in the CS, which makes the objects fall to the next surface with collision. Which ends up in the colision meshes/boxes touching each other, which causes things to bounce around. Perhaps if ShadeMe added something into the CSE that altered this behavior it would help for future mods. But short of moving every single Havok'd object in the game slightly upwards you won't find a proper solution.

Actually, I am wondering now if my other problem is related to this. When I go outside, some crazy things happen like my horse falling from the sky into the middle of a lake, and animals being drowned in a cluster in water. Maybe creatures get dropped/bounced when the area's loaded? Although the range is much further in that case.

I might try the spell script thingy in any case to see if it makes any difference.

» Thu Aug 25, 2011 7:22 pm

Not sure I can explain briefly why this is but my bet is http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=15677 solves it.

Load dead last - after all other mods - leave active ... do not merge into bash.

I am curious Psymon, why not merge into the Bashed Patch? I have always merged that exact mod into the bashed Patch and as far as i can tell it works and nothing bad happened so far? As a matter of fact WB shows it as green which means it is mergeable(Is that even a word. ) according to WB. That does not mean i or any one else has to i know, i am just curious as to why it is advised not to merge?

» Thu Aug 25, 2011 6:25 pm

If you use Duke's other mods the instructions are to load after the bashed patch.

For this then to work it cannot be loaded before them.

» Thu Aug 25, 2011 5:32 pm

Actually, I am wondering now if my other problem is related to this. When I go outside, some crazy things happen like my horse falling from the sky into the middle of a lake, and animals being drowned in a cluster in water. Maybe creatures get dropped/bounced when the area's loaded? Although the range is much further in that case.

I might try the spell script thingy in any case to see if it makes any difference.

No, I don't think that's related, because a lot of creatures are either spawned, or not placed in such a way that their collision would make them bounce. Indeed I'm not sure about the collision of NPCs and such, but I'm fairly sure it's not similar to the way objects have collision and havokable behavior.

» Thu Aug 25, 2011 6:10 pm

If you use Duke's other mods the instructions are to load after the bashed patch.

For this then to work it cannot be loaded before them.

I hate to disagree but this is my current load order...

Spoiler

Masters for: SavedBeforeWaiting.ess
00 Oblivion.esm
01 All Natural Base.esm [Version 1.3]
02 Waalx Animals & Creatures.esm
03 VASE - core.esm
04 Progress.esm [Version 2.2]
05 Unofficial Oblivion Patch.esp [Version 3.3.6]
06 Oblivion Citadel Door Fix.esp
07 DLCShiveringIsles.esp
08 Unofficial Shivering Isles Patch.esp [Version 1.4.3]
09 SM Plugin Refurbish - SI.esp [Version 1.30]
0A All Natural.esp [Version 1.3]
0B All Natural - SI.esp [Version 1.3]
0C Enhanced Water v2.0 HD.esp
0D All Natural - Real Lights.esp [Version 1.3]
0E Books of Console v1.esp
0F ChaseCameraMod.esp
10 FOV Modifier.esp
11 More Effective Enchantments.esp
12 More Effective Enchantments SI.esp
13 MoveQuestItems - OBSE.esp
14 Raestloz Auto Reset Emotion.esp
15 WAC - Crowded Roads Revisited.esp [Version 1.1]
16 AutoEquip.esp
17 DarNifiedUI Config Addon.esp
18 Display Stats.esp [Version 1.3.1]
19 DS Time Manager.esp [Version 1.1]
1A kuerteeAutoSaveAndTime.esp
1B kuerteeCleanUp.esp
1C Quest Log Manager.esp [Version 1.3.2]
1D Map Marker Overhaul.esp [Version 3.9]
1E Map Marker Overhaul - SI additions.esp [Version 3.5]
1F Enhanced Hotkeys.esp [Version 2.2]
++ MaleBodyReplacerV4.esp
20 Akaviri Elements Bow v1-2.esp
21 BaronArmor.esp
22 CV - Kilij.esp
23 Dedicated.esp
24 True Skullcrusher.esp
++ VASE - Vanilla Cyrodiil.esp
++ VASE - Vanilla SI.esp
25 OWC - Mannequin.esp
26 OWC - Seaworld.esp
27 OWC - New Dimension.esp
28 WAC.esp
29 WAC - OverSpawn.esp
2A WAC - Dead Knights.esp
2B WAC - Player Summons.esp
2C WAC - TCOS.esp
2D WAC - TCOS Shops.esp [Version 03]
2E WAC - Magic.esp
2F Ivellon.esp [Version 1.8]
30 Lem - Predators Nest.esp
31 StopDarkBrotherhood.esp
32 VHBloodlines 1.2.esp [Version 1.5.5]
33 Auto Repair.esp
34 Auto Update Leveled Items And Spells.esp [Version 1.2]
35 Automagic Bags.esp
36 CalyndStone.esp
37 HUD Status Bars.esp [Version 4.2.1]
38 Dungeon Actors Have Torches 1.6 DT.esp
39 Toggleable Quantity Prompt.esp [Version 3.2.0]
3A Alternative Beginnings.esp [Version 1.2.1]
3B MQSDone.esp
3C SetEssentialActors.esp
3D EnchantmentRestore.esp
++ EnchantmentRestore_Wells.esp
3E StolenItemOwnership.esp
3F SM Combat Hide.esp [Version 1.2]
40 Lem - Bounty Reduction Over Gametime.esp
41 Enhanced Grabbing.esp [Version 0.5]
42 Duke Patricks - Combat Archery.esp [Version 5.5.3]
43 Duke Patricks - Fresh Kills Now Alert The NPCs.esp [Version 4]
44 Phitt's Phighting Phixes.esp
45 Duke Patricks - Melee Combat NO RECOIL.esp [Version 2.9.1]
46 nGCD.esp
47 ProgressMBSP.esp [Version 2.0]
48 ProgressSBSP.esp [Version 1.0]
49 ProgressRBSP.esp [Version 1.0]
4A ProgressArmorer.esp [Version 1.0]
4B JCN_AV Uncap.esp [Version 1.01]
** Cava Obscura - Cyrodiil.esp
** Cava Obscura - SI.esp
** Cava Obscura - Filter Patch For Mods.esp
4C Stat Restore.esp
4D SPAWN.esp [Version 0.3]
4E kuerteeDetectLifeEffectNightEyeShader.esp
4F GW71_Life_Detect.esp
++ LightSpellWhiteDimmer.esp
50 MiniMap.esp
++ Duke Patricks - BASIC Script Effect Silencer NIF REMOVED.esp
51 Bashed Patch, 0.esp

As you can see BOSS placed the DP mods as you see them in that load order, with 3 DP mods loaded before the DP script silencer. The only DP mod that i merged in the bashed patch is the script silencer, as you can see in this part from the Bashed Patch html...

Spoiler

Active Mods
? 00 Oblivion.esm
? 01 All Natural Base.esm [Version 1.3]
? 02 Waalx Animals & Creatures.esm
? 03 VASE - core.esm
? 04 Unofficial Oblivion Patch.esp [Version 3.3.6]
? 05 Oblivion Citadel Door Fix.esp
? 06 DLCShiveringIsles.esp
? 07 Unofficial Shivering Isles Patch.esp [Version 1.4.3]
? 08 SM Plugin Refurbish - SI.esp [Version 1.30]
? 09 All Natural.esp [Version 1.3]
? 0A All Natural - SI.esp [Version 1.3]
? 0B Enhanced Water v2.0 HD.esp
? 0C All Natural - Real Lights.esp [Version 1.3]
? 0D WAC - Crowded Roads Revisited.esp [Version 1.1]
? ++ MaleBodyReplacerV4.esp
? ++ VASE - Vanilla Cyrodiil.esp
? ++ VASE - Vanilla SI.esp
? 0E OWC - Mannequin.esp
? 0F OWC - Seaworld.esp
? 10 OWC - New Dimension.esp
? 11 WAC.esp
? 12 WAC - OverSpawn.esp
? 13 WAC - Dead Knights.esp
? 14 WAC - Player Summons.esp
? 15 WAC - TCOS.esp
? 16 WAC - TCOS Shops.esp [Version 03]
? 17 WAC - Magic.esp
? 18 VHBloodlines 1.2.esp [Version 1.5.5]
? ++ EnchantmentRestore_Wells.esp
? ++ LightSpellWhiteDimmer.esp
? ++ Duke Patricks - BASIC Script Effect Silencer NIF REMOVED.esp

And all the DP mods are working without problems.

» Thu Aug 25, 2011 1:30 pm

While logically, you should be able to load things before Bashed Patch, the reason certain highly script intensive mod authors recommend loading it last even after Bashed Patch is more pre-emptive since some things are time critical I imagine and any slow down in script execution could cause a theoretical issue. But this is just a guess.

» Thu Aug 25, 2011 2:22 pm

I tried the patch mentioned above but it doesn't make a difference in items spontaneously jumping. Haven't tried it for outdoor animals.

Tamriel is becomming a very messy place. I almost want to go around and put things back in their place, but cleaning is illegal.

I first started modding because I wanted to play the game with all of these bugs fixed, but modding still leaves a lot of problems (or creates more). It still feels kind of like a beta to me.

» Thu Aug 25, 2011 4:51 pm

Well that patch is for when one mod uses a script effect that has multiple effects and then another mod access the same effects and therefore causes a variety of effects which can include: Green fog like light, gunshot sounds, havok on items moving about.

Illius-
I've already been over it in the BOSS thread. How risky it is to have the mods loaded before bash depends on what other mods are loaded. You should be fine with all that. They are largely load order independent, but again it depends on what else is in there.

What is the nif removed version though?

PracticalShutIn-
You might want to check out http://tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=19847 if you really want to pick things up. Great mod!

Also on cell reset things will be back to where they belong.