The NPC/Creature Split - Why?

Post » Wed Aug 26, 2009 9:13 am

Or, more precisely, why are some characters in the game, like Vivec and Yagrum Bagarn, creatures rather than NPCs? It strikes me as a little weird for them to be considered as such when they would function better (in my opinion) as NPCs.
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Shelby McDonald
 
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Post » Wed Aug 26, 2009 4:21 am

Or, more precisely, why are some characters in the game, like Vivec and Yagrum Bagarn, creatures rather than NPCs? It strikes me as a little weird for them to be considered as such when they would function better (in my opinion) as NPCs.


This way you can soultrap them and can't influence them.
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Taylrea Teodor
 
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Post » Tue Aug 25, 2009 9:23 pm

... And Almalexia.

Function better in what way?

It's a good question, and I'm not sure as to the 'why'. Perhaps it was just a design constraint with time to create one single model (well two actually if you count the kf) vs. the various other art, body parts, etc. or maybe single nif models were just simpler to assign unique animations.

:shrug:
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IM NOT EASY
 
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Post » Wed Aug 26, 2009 12:47 pm

OK, maybe "function better" wasn't quite the phrase to use. They're clearly sentient, so what makes them so different from other sentient beings that they need to be like beasts? If it was time constraints then there's no real answer, but if not it's still strange. Why should you be able to Soul Trap the Tribunal (ok not Sotha Sil, but if he was alive in-game it'd probably be the same)?
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Ashley Campos
 
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Post » Wed Aug 26, 2009 12:01 am

Dunno, just because they're divine I guess. Different from normal NPCs. They are kind of parts otherworldly, like Daedra, and you can soultrap them as well. I'm having more hard time on wondering why could you soultrap Yagrum, for he is of a humanoid species fully. Well, not fully, having built himself (?) legs, being last of his kind and all... :P But could you have soultrapped any Dwemer in time they existed? Hmm... don't think so. Maybe he's just a creature because of game mechanics - maybe Beth couldn't bother to create a new race just for him. And you can also choose to play from every race available, so they should have had to block you from starting with a Dwarf. And maybe the same goes with Chimer as well.

There are also numerous Daedra you can talk to that are creatures, just to add something to the list.
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Doniesha World
 
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Post » Wed Aug 26, 2009 12:15 am

it may have in part been for technical reasons I suppose, if you look at Yagrum, he is very different from any NPCs in the game in the way he is set up. He is a bloated figure that can't move at all without the help of mechanical legs, constrast to the NPCs in the game, who look pretty fit to me, for the most part, and if Yagrum were an NPC, he'd be able to wear armor, which wouldn't make sense for someone of his physical state. Almalexia and Vivec are a harder question, since they're pretty close to the playable races in body structure and even use some of the same animations, I think, but perhaps there was some sort of technical reason behind the design. Primarily, the distinction between "humanoids" and "creatures" is a technical one anyway.

As for the Daedra you can talk to, I'd imagine it's simply because it was easier to just have them be "creatures" then create new races just to account for them.

I'm having more hard time on wondering why could you soultrap Yagrum, for he is of a humanoid species fully


One could also just as easily question why you can soul trap corprus beasts, since Yagrum also has corprus disease, granted, Yagrum hasn't lost his ability to reason, but I'm not sure that has much to do with it.
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Oyuki Manson Lavey
 
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Post » Tue Aug 25, 2009 8:16 pm

It is merely for technical reasons. They are, by all means, "people". They are creatures because of their unique models. If they were NPCs, then their appearance would not be able to achieved.
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Chase McAbee
 
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Post » Wed Aug 26, 2009 12:35 pm

Oh, so NPCs have to conform to standard templates and creatures don't? That makes out-game sense, at least.
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Kelli Wolfe
 
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Post » Tue Aug 25, 2009 10:39 pm

It's also to avoid unwanted dialogue showing up on those characters, as creatures only have dialogue topics that are specifically assigned to them.
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Latino HeaT
 
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Post » Wed Aug 26, 2009 12:17 pm

Oh, so NPCs have to conform to standard templates and creatures don't? That makes out-game sense, at least.


What does it even matter? We've gone 9 years without it bothering us, who cares?
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Jessica Colville
 
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Post » Wed Aug 26, 2009 2:58 am

Oh, so NPCs have to conform to standard templates and creatures don't? That makes out-game sense, at least.

I believe that all of them have totally unique meshes and textures, and having him as a "creature" allows Yagram Bagarn to utilize different animations, required by his "condition". They can't use the "normal" equipment and clothing either. Like creatures, they can be assigned items to be "looted", like Alit hides, Racer feathers, etc., but don't use those items themselves. I'm not positive as to the actual "reason" the others (Vivec, Alma) weren't made as NPCs, but there are plenty of oddities and quirks in the differences between creatures and NPCs, and any one or several of them may have resulted in the devs making the choice they did in each case (Vivec's could even have been due to his/her/its unique "sitting" pose).
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NIloufar Emporio
 
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Post » Wed Aug 26, 2009 11:51 am

Or, more precisely, why are some characters in the game, like Vivec and Yagrum Bagarn, creatures rather than NPCs? It strikes me as a little weird for them to be considered as such when they would function better (in my opinion) as NPCs.

No speechcraftery (i.e. taunting), easier models.
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Scott
 
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Post » Wed Aug 26, 2009 5:05 am

I believe that all of them have totally unique meshes and textures, and having him as a "creature" allows Yagram Bagarn to utilize different animations, required by his "condition". They can't use the "normal" equipment and clothing either. Like creatures, they can be assigned items to be "looted", like Alit hides, Racer feathers, etc., but don't use those items themselves. I'm not positive as to the actual "reason" the others (Vivec, Alma) weren't made as NPCs, but there are plenty of oddities and quirks in the differences between creatures and NPCs, and any one or several of them may have resulted in the devs making the choice they did in each case (Vivec's could even have been due to his/her/its unique "sitting" pose).


These are good beliefs. :) Note that Almalexia, too, has her own unique animation. Still, I believe the main reason is that they aren't from playable races, and thus aren't game-mechanically races at all.

I didn't mean anything by mentioning some Daedra you can converse with. Just mentioned that there are more than these three (Tribunal/Bibunal :P+Yagrum). Oh and forgot about Mudcrab Merchant at least.
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Nikki Lawrence
 
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