Well Nexus is down at the moment, but when it's back up...

DLL v4.1 Release

WARNING I'm not 100% certain, but better safe than sorry:
DLL versions 4.0.4.2 up until this patch -may- have introduced "invalid/unstable" actors. If you experience any on-save crashes. I recommend doing a full cell reset (wait in an interior with NO enemy actors for 7 or so days) before continuing your game. Very, very sorry if it's true!

Changelog:

• Introducing the new DLL http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/9162/newguio.jpg! Enjoy a much more organized interface for changing settings, all while DLL imports your mods and creates the patch in the background!
  The GUI only features basic ini settings and patch creation, but will be expanded upon in the DLL v4.1 series to contain a great deal more features.
  
  
• Fixed a bug introduced in 4.0.4.2 with the .esm/.esp detection code. ESP files should now be recognized correctly and added to the list (they were being skipped over before)

If the new GUI doesn't work for you, PLEASE LET ME KNOW!
I'm brand stinking new to GUIs, and this one is made from scratch -> All typing, no GUI editors used
There's multithreading, and lots of other fancy stuff that's new to me, so if your specific OS has issues, please inform me so I can improve upon it. 8)


Next on the list:

• Invent a system to prevent dummy creatures from being saved in your savegame file -> reducing its size and save/load times
  
• Add GUI exception managing
  
• Add a detection system that will only create a patch if you -need- to create a patch. (so if you're just changing settings you wont have to wait for the patch creation every time)
  
• Add GUI tool that will let you pick any LList in your game, and see what creatures can spawn on it, and what the probabilities will be with your settings.
  
• Helpful descriptions of each setting right next to the GUI settings
  
• Redo the in-game probability calculating to eliminate the last remaining DLL background processing.
  
• Other GUI stuffs
  
  • Readme Link / Integration
    
  • Excel sheet integration into the settings area
    
  • Presets Area to pick from several different setups
    
  • DLL update notifier (will be togglable)
    
  • Wrye Bash multiple Oblivion profile support
    
  • For-sure Upcoming Features pane to replace this list
    
  • Wishful thinking / todo pane with future hopes and dreams of DLL
  
  
• Items!
  
• Hypothetical FCOM/WAC/OWC-ND merger patch

So I've got a few ideas in my head for how to eliminate dummy save-game data.

After the dummy has done its scripts:

• Move the dummy to a very frequently visited place. Whenever the user visits there, hopefully the cell will have reset, and all the dummies inside will be wiped from the savegame.
  
  Not the most reliable, but a decent option.
  
  
• Move the dummy to an empty, dark, void cell. Whenever the amount of dummies in the void cell reaches X amount, the PC is teleported to/from the void cell in a split second. The cell will be reset upon the PC entering, and all the dummies inside will be wiped.
  
  Most reliable, but perhaps unsafe for other mods? I don't know if other mods would necessarily care if you teleported to a different cell and back within a single frame.
  
  
• Same as above, except user activates the teleport wipe when he deems it safe/convenient
  
• Don't do anything, and let the dummies make your savegame bigger than it has to be. Some people might not care?
  
• User could also do a DLL clean-save if they wanted.

Any ideas for what the most frequently visited place is? My guess would be the market district? But perhaps that's too over-visited as to never allow the cell to reset? Not quite sure.

#1, not reliable as you said.
#2, could get ugly to script. When is it safe to teleport the player? And I bet you'd get complains of CTD's sooner or later.
#3, something automated is better, most players won't like to fuss with it like this
#4 and #5 seems most appealing at this point. o.o

Sorry this is too technical for me, would it be possible to just use OBSE's deletereference command to get rid of the rat though? Or something similar.

In the end, I'll probably end up offering options in the GUI to pick which method the user wants.

Yeah, not liking #1 myself.


#2, I'd deem it safe when the PC is not in combat. And maybe even tack on the additional requirement that the PC be in town, or some other such "safe area". This would pretty much guarantee the PC wasn't in an area where it wouldn't matter that they bliped to another cell.

The only dangerous part about this option that I see is if/when quests or other scripts check to see if the PC has changed cells. They could do the check in the split second the PC was in the void cell? Which is why I'd tack on that second condition.

The latest package isn't being recognized as a BAIN-ready archive by the SVN Wrye Bash Maybe it's the absence of the .ini now. A dummy DLL.esp - prolly just DLCShiveringIsles.esp renamed - in the archive (that does nothing unless the patch is actually built) would probably rectify that (if the .ini NEEDS to be absent )

PS: You mention doing a cell reset before continuing - I've always done the "clean save" trick when upgrading DLL (deactivate DLL.esp, save, build new .esp, activate, load save and PROFIT! ) ... Would that fix whatever plagued the old version? (haven't experienced the CtD you mention though) Or would I still need to wait 7 days (awfully long time)

Not exactly sure what is supposed to happen when clicking the exceptions and help/tools button, as nothing seems to happen. Patch built when I exited the program to see if relaunching it would help. Weird.

Win7 x64

could you use "http://tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=24606" by kuertee to clean dummys somehow? Have the dummy flaged actorRef.Disable?

Manage exce[tions and tools buttons do nothig for me either.

I like the config buttopn, nicer than ini. However, how do I turn off patrols? Set percent to 0?

Was confused to realize I need to close GUI to generate esp. I suggest putting that instuction on the GUI or making a build button.

Also, when I started the GUI and went t0o tweak settings it froze for a bit. I then realized I needed to wait for all mods to load. Perhaps a better way to handle that? I realized it when I saw the mods loading in the bottom left corner of the GUI.

I am at level 2 (9 hours of game time) now and my save is 5MB. A clean save without DLL is only 5kb less. When checking for bloat I have 3 null refernces but can't say that is DLL related or not.

I can just rename the DLLsource as an .esp. I took the .esp tag off as a was to shepard people away from just moving it to their data folder and activating it. Hehe

No, if what I -suspect- is correct.. then there would be actors wandering around your game that cant be saved correctly -> non-DLL actors that wouldn't be wiped on a DLL clean save.
However, this is just a theory I have from some people's bug reports... which is why I've said to do it if you've experienced the on-save crashes. 8)



Yes, all the dummies are flagged as disabled. I'll look into that mod and see what I can see. 8)





Yup, the changelog states that only the settings work.. and the upcoming features list states adding exception managing is #2. 8o



I quickly removed the checkboxes before release (because some code wasn't ready yet, but I wanted to get the fix out). You can just set the % to 0 if you want. 8) Otherwise, open up your DynamicLeveledListsFiles\DLLProgramFiles\SaveFIle (edit with notepad) and change DLLpatrol to 0, and the same for DLLini.
Sorry for the inconvenience. 8( The main checkboxes will be ready soon.

I can make a message about it. 8)

Hmm, about the freezing: I made the mod importing function on a separate thread (if you know what those are), which should be running in parallel to the GUI... allowing you to make changes while the mods import. Is this not the case for you? Does it freeze completely until all your mods are imported, or just choke up for a little bit while things get started? What OS/rig are you running?

As for the 5MB savefile.. like I said before.. my savefile from a year ago without using DLL was 9MB... and that character was only level 3 (granted I have slow leveling activated). 5MB doesn't sound too over the top for me? I feel like most savefiles with a lot of mods get to be large. But I could be wrong.
What size are you used to?

I had to exit gui and go back in to get it to let me make changes again. I have Win7 Pro 64 bit on a dual core processor. No big deal from what I can tell.

I guess I should have more thoroughly read the changelog about the other buttons

Anyway, I updated and rebuilt the esp. However, I have gone into three locations and have found minimal creatures. Makes me think some spawns are not spawning. I will do a wait for 3 days and see if things improve. I am enjoying the break.

One thing to note, when opening my console I see these messages:
[DLL Main} Next to spawn on the buffer:
[DLL Main} Spawning dummies in the buffer.

Over and over. This is new to see the console messages.

But how cool is it, that in all the years I have played with OOO and FCOM, I have NEVER seen a "Bog Ogre Youngling" from OOO! This is a greenish ogre half the height of a human (showed level 14 when I did a getlevel - yeah, I am level 2 but I increased my high tier )

It's like a whole new game!!!

My largest saves were about 15MB but that is at high level and after 80+ hours. This is close to the usual I would think at the start IIRC. So I am not concerned about this at all, more thinking about the save time, although save time is not a deal breaker to me at all, not with all the things I get with DLL.

Regarding the packaging of DLL, think it should be treated like how BOSS or WB are currently, it is a third party tool after all. Just have all of DLL's file in its own folder, including the .jar (should be easy to change where it looks for the esp files right?). Manual unzip to the Data directory or even Oblivion directory, just delete the whole thing when you need to upgrade. Having dummy files so you can install with WB is misleading and less than ideal I think.

My only request for future archives is move everything down one directory level (eliminate data and put the jar file and DLL directory in the root of archive). Then it is BAIN ready like all the others!

Waited out 5 days in testinghall, went back to my home, slept, went to cave, was empty, no spawns. I have been there before in a previous DLL game and had bandits.

Saw a setting for ingame debug, will turn off to see if it stops the messages in console. Just checked, it di not.

I think I will go back to previous version for a bit. I can try it again later once more peole post about their experience with 4.1. It could be just me.