Modders Rejoice: New Official Tidbits : V

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 5:44 am

SmkViper was kind enough to chime in on one of the other threads, I think modders in general will be happy to hear to this, I know I was. It is not on topic with the other thread so I figured I would start this one so people can discuss.

Thank you SmkViper !

Original Thread: http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1242373-is-modding-difficult/

I certainly hope this is the case i really do but there is no point speculating one way or the other really, we are going to just have to wait and see. But systems like Radiant Story and AI are new / greatly modified so that's going to be a hurdle to overcome regardless of how much has changed, I also read several places that the scripting has been completely re-written (though i was never able to find official confirmation on this) aside from that everything is going to be a big ???????? until we can dig in and and see for ourselves.

I also read several places that the scripting has been completely re-written (though i was never able to find official confirmation on this)

Consider this your official confirmation.

If you're used to modding Fallout 3 or Oblivion, then you should be able to acclimate to the CK without too much trouble (some things, like scripting, changing more then others). If you haven't modded either of the above before, then it will take some effort to learn. But start small, get some cool stuff in the game, and you'll get addicted! (And legions of fans to worship at your feet... or so I've been told)

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:03 pm

"If you're used to modding Fallout 3 or Oblivion, then you should be able to acclimate to the CK without too much trouble."

I like the sound of that. *dances* Thanks, Daphne.

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 3:48 pm

I want (even more, because Skyrim already seems to have a lot) Unique Landscapes. N.O.W!

And little Tweaks for every aspect of the gameplay. Please... Please... I need my MODS noooow!

I need to make one of the greatest games even greater. *hysteria*

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 12:49 pm

"If you're used to modding Fallout 3 or Oblivion, then you should be able to acclimate to the CK without too much trouble."

I like the sound of that. *dances* Thanks, Daphne.

Don't thank me, thank SmkViper :bowdown:

But I will dance with you :dance:

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 1:47 pm

This is such good news! Thanks for letting us know Daphne!

A little off-topic: I really hope there's more unity in the modding scene this time around, more collaboration and less competition so we can avoid another FCOM situation. Less lone-wolf modders and more large teams working together.

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 6:16 pm

nice - will be enjoying some mod action.

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:19 am

Similar, reassuring tidbits from SMJL:

Hehe. I can't go into too much detail. If/Else/Endif is a pretty common programming pattern and you'd see it in any scripting language. We haven't revealed a whole lot about it other than that it's new. When we get closer to release of the editor I'm sure we'll be talking about it more -- it's similar in syntax to the old script, but a lot more modern and closer to a "real" programming language.

In terms of "making the game do stuff" there won't be too much of a learning curve (at least there wasn't around here, but hey, we're pros :-)

), but in terms of hacking in things like the script extender... yeah, I don't even know how/if that would work.

Hopefully that means we can extrapolate what we've learned with TESIV and the Fallouts, but that there are just more possibilities. I'd bet the devs were/are as resistant to things changing completely as modders are. They wouldn't divulge anything when asked, but I'm hoping the plugins will be similar too *must have TES5Edit*.

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:37 pm

A little off-topic: I really hope there's more unity in the modding scene this time around, more collaboration and less competition so we can avoid another FCOM situation. Less lone-wolf modders and more large teams working together.

Not sure I'm in the loop, what was the FCOM situation?

But yes I agree people working together is the way to go (when the scope of the project warrants it).

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 7:23 pm

Not sure I'm in the loop, what was the FCOM situation?

But yes I agree people working together is the way to go (when the scope of the project warrants it).

Well FCOM was the solution to the situation of all these separate Oblivion overhaul mods that overlapped in incompatible ways but were all awesome. The main ones being OOO, Frans, MMM and Warcry. The FCOM team, however, did not help with the complexity of the install, and their attitude was that if you couldn't figure out the incredibly complex and under-documented install process for yourself, you didn't deserve to play it. But if Fran, Oscuro and Mart had just come together at first it wouldn't have been necessary in the first place.

I hope, at least, for some kind of built in standardization or conflict-checking system similar to what Wrye Bash accomplished. I also hope that people/teams who are wanting to build new lands announce their cells so that there are less conflicts here as well. Everything always works better when people coordinate and work together (Bananasplit and the UL guys are a great example).

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 5:45 am

I wonder if scripting will be harder or easier? I'm not a programmer, so whenever I wanted to change Neeshka's behaviors to suit my preferences it took a lot of trial and error.

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:58 am

"Dislike :down: "

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 11:12 am

"Dislike :down: "

Uhhhh OK. Care to elaborate?

@Reymas Thanks for clearing that up. That one never hit my radar but I never used the overhauls either which is why i probably missed it. I was around for the great FO:NV soap opera massive Nexus ban incident, that one had my head spinning.

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 6:38 am

I'm more interested in whether or not skills, for example, are hardcoded. If they're not then it will be easy to add new skills and make some really awesome, game-changing mods in the long run.

What I'd like to see from the modding community? Less drama. Less immaturity. Less ass-kissing and self-absorption and hostility and people leaving the internet forever because they're told that they're unusual for making Dremora schlongs. But I sincerely doubt we'll see that.

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:54 am

Great news to hear. I can't wait to get my hands on the creation kit.

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 6:57 am

I'm more interested in whether or not skills, for example, are hardcoded. If they're not then it will be easy to add new skills and make some really awesome, game-changing mods in the long run.

What I'd like to see from the modding community? Less drama. Less immaturity. Less ass-kissing and self-absorption and hostility and people leaving the internet forever because they're told that they're unusual for making Dremora schlongs. But I sincerely doubt we'll see that.

I miss Slof's stuff, they were different. :sad:

I don't expect things to be incredibly different from Oblivion, to be honest. The animation system and scripting have been overhauled, but to what extent? Graphics are still using the same .nif file extension as Oblivion (Because of this, I expect the majority of "new" armors we see will be ports from Oblivion mods). The Creation engine is still based on the old engine, so I'm keeping my modding hopes strictly in line with what was possible in Oblivion. :ermm:

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:36 am

What I'd like to see from the modding community? Less drama. Less immaturity. Less ass-kissing and self-absorption and hostility and people leaving the internet forever because they're told that they're unusual for making Dremora schlongs. But I sincerely doubt we'll see that.

I've always had very positive experiences within the modding community, people tend to be very helpful and kind. Of course there is a bad apple here and there. In my experiences at least, maybe it is just who i chose to deal with.

I consider the modding community the people actually creating the mods. What you describe to me sounds more like everyone else that visits Nexus downloads every mod, [censored]es about them, but never contribute anything to the community, i.e. never published a file in their life. That is the half of the community that always makes me ask myself "why am I doing this?" It's also why I would never give a developer the grief some people here do because they think that $59 USD entitles them to do so. However it is my passion so I chug on choo choo

DISCLAIMER: Your experiences may vary, but that has been mine.

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 6:51 pm

Well now I feel better about reading up on Oblivion's CS instead of waiting for the new one to come out.

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 7:27 am

I've always had very positive experiences within the modding community, people tend to be very helpful and kind. Of course there is a bad apple here and there. In my experiences at least, maybe it is just who i chose to deal with.

I consider the modding community the people actually creating the mods. What you describe to me sounds more like everyone else that visits Nexus downloads every mod, [censored]es about them, but never contribute anything to the community, i.e. never published a file in their life. That is the half of the community that always makes me ask myself "why am I doing this?" It's also why I would never give a developer the grief some people here do because they think that $59 USD entitles them to do so. However it is my passion so I chug on choo choo

DISCLAIMER: Your experiences may vary, but that has been mine.

There's a number of people who steal (this is true in every online art community), a lot of trolls in comment boards, and a lot of people with very thin skins who don't know how to handle those situations. Fortunately, the Nexus has just started up a forum exclusively for modders, and entry requires 1000 unique downloads to your name -- I think it'll get a lot of use when Skyrim starts up!

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 1:55 pm

There's a number of people who steal (this is true in every online art community), a lot of trolls in comment boards, and a lot of people with very thin skins who don't know how to handle those situations. Fortunately, the Nexus has just started up a forum exclusively for modders, and entry requires 1000 unique downloads to your name -- I think it'll get a lot of use when Skyrim starts up!

I agree theft gets out of hand sometimes, FO:NV launch anyone?

Haven't been back there since I stopped supporting my FO:NV stuff, I didn't know that about the forum but that's awesome. Looking forward to that. Does the 1000 unique DL requirement need to be for Skyrim specifically or just on the Nexus network?

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 6:12 pm

The Bethesda official boards are also not too bad. I've never once seen someone refused support over that way, and everyone there is quite polite. Maybe a bit blunt at times, but polite.

There's also http://tesalliance.org/forums/ a very friendly board whose purpose is to help those who wish to learn to mod, as well as assist the already accomplished makers out there with any issues they might have from time to time.

The Elder Scrolls probably has one of the best community followings of all the games in production today.

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 12:38 pm

Well now I feel better about reading up on Oblivion's CS instead of waiting for the new one to come out.

http://geck.gamesas.com/index.php/Main_Page should also help. I'd bet most if not all of the changes after Oblivion will be in Skyrim, like ShowMessage vs. MessageBox, NavMeshes vs. PathGrids, FormLists, "Constant" flags for Globals, ONAM lists in ESM headers, etc. Some of the TES4 CS stuff might be deprecated/inapplicable in Skyrim.

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:07 am

I miss Slof's stuff, they were different. :sad:

You can still find it on her site, if you're willing to navigate through Xenomorph porm. I liked some of her stuff too. Her horse replacers were great, as were some of her robes, and she did the work to put together the Better Beasts mod, and honestly, I'm not knocking her for making "advlt" mods at all. What I'm complaining about was that when a bunch of fifteen year olds said "you make dong mods for oblibvion you're weird and gross" she made a big huff and pulled all of her stuff off the modding sites forever rather than ignoring them or better yet saying "yeah, I guess it is weird, deal with it" and going on her merry way. "Professionalism" isn't the right word for what is essentially a hobby, but really, people need to learn to handle this stuff better.

I've always had very positive experiences within the modding community, people tend to be very helpful and kind. Of course there is a bad apple here and there. In my experiences at least, maybe it is just who i chose to deal with.

I consider the modding community the people actually creating the mods. What you describe to me sounds more like everyone else that visits Nexus downloads every mod, [censored]es about them, but never contribute anything to the community, i.e. never published a file in their life. That is the half of the community that always makes me ask myself "why am I doing this?" It's also why I would never give a developer the grief some people here do because they think that $59 USD entitles them to do so. However it is my passion so I chug on choo choo

DISCLAIMER: Your experiences may vary, but that has been mine.

That's life. If you make something purely out of love and do it in your sparse free time and craft it and mold it and edit it so that it's as good as it can be, and it's completely original and, in your eyes, the best you can do and something to be proud of, and then you put it on display for all the world to see, I guarantee you that you will hear this:

"This svcks. What worthless trash."

And if all it takes is a chorus of stupid people making noises at you to indicate their displeasure (or more often than you'd think just trying to get a rise out of you) to make you stop doing what you're doing, you might as well have never bothered in the first place. People are jerks. Period. There's no avoiding it and no escaping it. All you can do is manage the jerks and shut them out.

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 1:04 pm

http://geck.gamesas.com/index.php/Main_Page should also help. I'd bet most if not all of the changes after Oblivion will be in Skyrim, like ShowMessage vs. MessageBox, NavMeshes vs. PathGrids, FormLists, "Constant" flags for Globals, ONAM lists in ESM headers, etc. Some of the TES4 CS stuff might be deprecated/inapplicable in Skyrim.

Thank you! Much appreciated!!

» Tue Oct 18, 2011 2:53 pm

I agree theft gets out of hand sometimes, FO:NV launch anyone?

Haven't been back there since I stopped supporting my FO:NV stuff, I didn't know that about the forum but that's awesome. Looking forward to that. Does the 1000 unique DL requirement need to be for Skyrim specifically or just on the Nexus network?

I don't know. I reached the threshold with Oblivion mods.

EDIT:

All mod authors get put in to a secondary member group especially for them when their unique download count across all their files on one Nexus site has reached 1,000 downloads or more.