Do people know the CoC became Sheogorath : The Elder Scrolls Series Discussion

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 12:22 pm

So do the people of skyrim acknowledge the fact that the CoC became Sheogorath or is like one big mystery

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 5:16 pm

i dont see how they would know.

» Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:25 am

i dont see how they would know.

He could have told people who came to his shrine

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 4:58 pm

I haven't read all of the new books, but I'd guess this isn't common knowledge - and probably isn't known outside of the daedric princes and a few people who were close to the situation, like Haskill. Of course when pretty much everyone aware of the matter is associated with madness it's unlikely they're considered reliable sources.

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 9:16 pm

I wouldn't see how they would know the CoC became Sheo but the thing is...did the events of SI really happen? I have said it a few times and tried searching for it, but failed...there was a theory that stated the events of SI (lore wise, disregard the whole portal back into Cyrodiil and whatnot) was in the CoC's head. Makes sense, as Sheo is the prince of madness and all...

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 10:17 am

But Sheogorath with the same voice as SI was in a quest called "Mind of the Madness"

» Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:39 am

But Sheogorath with the same voice as SI was in a quest called "Mind of the Madness"

It was said that as the CoC spent time as the Prince of Madness he would start to look, sounds and act like him.

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 12:32 pm

Oh yeah...

I forgot about that :wacko:

Makes sense as well, since in the end of SI, Jyggalag mentions how he would turn into Sheo, so I don't see why not with the CoC

» Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:45 am

There is nothing that says the Champion of Cyrodiil that ended the Oblivion Crisis with Martin was the one to enter the Shivering Isles. It could just as easily have been some nobody.

I wouldn't see how they would know the CoC became Sheo but the thing is...did the events of SI really happen? I have said it a few times and tried searching for it, but failed...there was a theory that stated the events of SI (lore wise, disregard the whole portal back into Cyrodiil and whatnot) was in the CoC's head. Makes sense, as Sheo is the prince of madness and all...

And that theory totally undermines the story and the events that transpired. It has always seemed like a lazy theory to me, based solely on the fact that Sheogorath is the Prince of Madness.

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 8:58 pm

Sheogorath does

Spoiler

summarize many of the events of Oblivion quite well, and mentions how his name (Sheogorath) is a family name, passed down from himself to himself every couple of thousand years or so.

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 12:01 pm

Also, while not great proof, Sheogorath in Skyrim has no pupils.

In Oblivion old Sheo makes a vague threat or two to the PC about stealing his eyes at one point.

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 4:52 pm

Some of the comments Sheogorath makes indicates strongly that it is actually the CoC, that has turned into Sheogorath.

Just play the quest for yourself.

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 4:31 pm

Some of the comments Sheogorath makes indicates strongly that it is actually the CoC, that has turned into Sheogorath.

Just play the quest for yourself.

Or you know, that he was a Daedric prince that actually paid attention to what was going on in Cyrodiil at that time. I'd assume most, if not all of the princes would be able to make the exact same comments and would have pretty much the exact same information.

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 10:59 am

The expansions from what I know are supposed to be 'cannon' like Bloodmoon and Tribunal. Weather we played through it or not cannon wise the CoC became Sheo.

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 10:13 pm

The expansions from what I know are supposed to be 'cannon' like Bloodmoon and Tribunal. Weather we played through it or not cannon wise the CoC became Sheo.

I like to think it's a little more open-ended than that. The events of the games (including general plot lines of the various factions) all happened. Whether it was the player character, or one of the many off-screen "others" is usually left deliberately vague.

Fishy's CoC may not be Sheogorath. Mine certainly became so, and is apparently settling into the role quite nicely.

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 5:43 pm

Don't forget that as far as SI was concerned, everyone perceived the CoC as Sheogorath.

We'll always be guessing whether SI really happened or if it was all a delusion Sheogorath inflicted on the CoC to drive him mad.

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 9:52 pm

My character in Morrowind never became the Neverine, but that doesn't make it so. The games themselves attribute our characters to the events within game and the story will assume we did all those things weather we actually did them or not. Theres nothing stopping us from saying that our characters didn't do these things, but when it comes down to it I don't think it matters really.

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 5:16 pm

Some of the comments Sheogorath makes indicates strongly that it is actually the CoC, that has turned into Sheogorath.

Just play the quest for yourself.

I did the quest, but I don't remember any such comment. In fact I was disappointed that he didn't address the issue.
Can you enlighten me?

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 11:36 pm

I did the quest, but I don't remember any such comment. In fact I was disappointed that he didn't address the issue.
Can you enlighten me?

Are... are my posts invisible?

Spoiler

Some more detail:

Sheogorath does reference "a severed head" (Dark Brotherhood), "a fox" (Gray Fox), and Martin being one of the best Septims, but turning into a dragon, so it's really not a fair competition (the, uh... main quest?). He then explicitly states that his (Sheogorath's) name is a "family name, passed down from me to myself" every thousand years or so (Shivering Isles). In fact, to my memory, the only things He fails to reference are maybe the Mages and Fighters Guild quests, and Knights of the Nine. 3/6 isn't bad, and if I were rounding to the nearest whole, I would have to round up and say "Yes, Sheogorath is, or at the very least holds intimate knowledge of the adventures of, the CoC and the events that took place during the course of Oblivion".

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 9:37 pm

Are... are my posts invisible?

Spoiler

Some more detail:

Sheogorath does reference "a severed head" (Dark Brotherhood), "a fox" (Gray Fox), and Martin being one of the best Septims, but turning into a dragon, so it's really not a fair competition (the, uh... main quest?). He then explicitly states that his (Sheogorath's) name is a "family name, passed down from me to myself" every thousand years or so (Shivering Isles). In fact, to my memory, the only things He fails to reference are maybe the Mages and Fighters Guild quests, and Knights of the Nine. 3/6 isn't bad, and if I were rounding to the nearest whole, I would have to round up and say "Yes, Sheogorath is, or at the very least holds intimate knowledge of the adventures of, the CoC and the events that took place during the course of Oblivion".

Spoiler

I also recall him specifically mentioning when talking about Martin's transformation "I was there." Sure, with the barriers as weak as they were then maybe he just kind'a strolled in all invisible and such, I think it would make more sense, combined with the other examples of evidence, to conclude he was (is?) the Champion of Cyrodiil. Not that anyone even remembers who that was...

» Mon Nov 28, 2011 1:39 am

Spoiler

I also recall him specifically mentioning when talking about Martin's transformation "I was there." Sure, with the barriers as weak as they were then maybe he just kind'a strolled in all invisible and such, I think it would make more sense, combined with the other examples of evidence, to conclude he was (is?) the Champion of Cyrodiil. Not that anyone even remembers who that was...

Spoiler

That's the thing - he didn't just comment on the events in general, he commented on them as if he was there, just as we were as the CoC in Oblivion.

» Sun Nov 27, 2011 10:34 am

Spoiler

That's the thing - he didn't just comment on the events in general, he commented on them as if he was there, just as we were as the CoC in Oblivion.

SPOILER (idk how to make the tab)

He said he was there during the oblivion crisis so its confirmed that someone from that time period became sheogorath weather it be the CoC or not is up to you same for every quest line.