Hi,

Has anyone looked very closely at the racial bonuses afforded to each race in Skyrim yet? It looks like Beth has been changing some things up, and I don't think for the better.

Some minor things that I disagree with

• Nords have no heavy armor bonus, yet they do have a bonus to smithing, which I consider heavily connotates heavy armor. Yes, I know light armor stuff can be done with smithing, but the actual word -Smithing- has nothing to do with tanning leather on a rack - it means forging things using metal.
  
• Redguards get a bonus to Alteration and Destruction? What the heck, where did that come from? I understand that by progressively eliminating the amount of skills in successive games you need to find new bonuses to award to races losing those skills, but still. A Redguard is better served with thief-aligned skills like sneak. They also have a Smithing bonus...but no heavy OR light armor bonus.
  
• Argonians have pickpocketing as their +10 skill, and no weapon skill bonuses. Maybe if we still had spears...

Major things I consider worth including in a patch

• Dunmer Racials: http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Dunmer - No. No. No. Alteration, Illusion, and Alchemy? What are they, mages? Dunmer need bonuses to Archery and 1h weapons, like they've always had. They're one of the few races I always considered 'Hybrid' in that it had bonuses to Mage, Thief, and Warrior skills, especially in Morrowind.
  
• Imperial Racials: http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Imperial - Enchanting and Destruction? Really? What happened to the cosmopolitan, high personality, sweet talkers we've always had with bonuses to speech, mercantile, and powers that increased disposition. I know that, with the character creation overhaul, most of those things I just listed were axed, but still. Imperials were always the 'personality' race, and Skyrim gave that a kick in the pants. Now the only two races with even a +5 bonus to speech are Bretons and...Nords...

I love Skyrim, but this was something that irked me for some reason. You've already redone the class system (which you either love or loathe), did you have to screw with racials too? Some of the racial choices, I think, seem to go against lore altogether - especially the Imperial stuff. Bethesda could've put more thought into the racial choices here.

Bump because it got pushed back really fast with no replies.

Am I just being peevish, or does anyone else think I have a point/agree?

*shrugs* frankly I pick race based on the racial powers and/or rp purpose, starting skill matters not to me.

what he said.

It's been 200 years since Oblivion. Their cultures could have changed. For Dunmer, the Telvanni were the last house to be destroyed. So mages could be more predominant with their survivors.

They may also be taking local characteristics into account. Such as Nords having the speech bonus.

Starting skill layouts, to me, are perfectly irrelevant. In 4-5 levels (or 3 ingame hours including the intro) it levels out. Race powers - I honestly haven't even used them, heh. The only thing I remotely am bothered about are the passive constant bonuses, which are better for some than others (e.g. Altmer, +50 magicka. wow.)

So far my Argonian characters have excelled perfectly as assassins and 2-handed berserkers. The mage... not so much, the Altmer was better, but got scrapped anyway because of lacking destruction - but that's not the fault of the race, really.

I guess that for me, I'm a person that liked the old class system. It was about defining a character when I first created him, and then roleplaying it from then on, and the game sort of kept me to it by what I picked for major skills. Race, and the bonuses they'd confer, were just part of that I suppose.

I agree with OP. Some of the changes are very arbitrary. But it doesn't matter much to me though.

Very true, I choose for the RP It does not bother me since I use my Imperial.... back in the days of OBLIVION!!! STOP RIGHT THERE CRIMINAL SCUM!

meh each to there own, me I love the elder scroll games becuase my actions defines my character, not some class or other pre done frame.

one of the reasons in my mind Skyrim > Oblivion

Game mechanics above all

That aside,

Nords, very Conan the Barbarian
Redguards; their desert seers and mystics culture. Still huge on Swordsmanship tho, +10 Onehand
---I'd counterargue that they stole the Dunmer role.

Dunmers. Yes, they've always been balanced for mages, as they have for warriors and archers. Except here, the more dominant "warrior cultures" outshine them.
Argonians. Past editions had the males balanced toward Rogues and females balanced toward mystics. Still feels like that.
Imperials. Charm and Coinluck. Still the moneygrubbers as ever. Skyrim's version reminds me of Knights of the Nine and the Imperial Cult.

I was just hoping that races would have real differences... I mean is anyone swayed by stuff like +5 Alteration?

Hm. I'm actually glad how easy it is to make-up the differences. Older editions, customize the wrong class, and my char is inflexibly gimped forever. Maybe it's a matter of personal taste though. The flavors may be a bit too light in Skyrim. Here, we just have adjustments to early-game play.

Then again, I may actually be talking about the leveling system.

but yeah, +10 or +5 isn't gonna kill anyone ...
Still gotta describe the races somehow. Magical redguards is a bit new, i must say. http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Trayvond_the_Redguardmust have gotten around.