How can future lore handle a binary outcome of the civil war

Post » Fri Dec 09, 2011 8:06 pm

Warp Of the North's going to happen, I'm calling it early.
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lydia nekongo
 
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Post » Fri Dec 09, 2011 5:50 pm

I think it would be the best if they say that the Empire wins the civil war but eventually (after the happenings of the game) the Stormcloaks make it independent. Or vice versa
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Kayla Bee
 
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Post » Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:31 pm

A volcano will destroy Skyrim, problem solved!

If one thing should be noticed here, its that in the TES games you save the world, and then regardless the world goes to hell anyways in between games.
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saxon
 
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Post » Sat Dec 10, 2011 2:22 am

A volcano will destroy Skyrim, problem solved!

If one thing should be noticed here, its that in the TES games you save the world, and then regardless the world goes to hell anyways in between games.


Kinda depressing tbh. Except when I'm RP'ing an evil character. My current assassin dude loves the chaos boiling around him.
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xemmybx
 
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Post » Sat Dec 10, 2011 2:47 am

I hope there will be a Thalmor-centric DLC, although it may be too large to fit in, especially seeing as Beth don't focus that much on story.
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Roanne Bardsley
 
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Post » Fri Dec 09, 2011 9:20 pm

The lore will simply say that the Dragonborn ended the civil war in Skyrim, which led to the eventual reunification of the Empire. If the Empire wins in Skyrim then obviously reunification happens right away; if the Stormcloaks win then Skyrim rejoins the empire on its own terms afterwards.


This. Skyrim will end up part of the empire as did Morrowind. Morrwind were able to continue slavery even though it was abolished by the empire as part of the deal for them to join. Same as Valenwood was left almost untouched even though it is under the empire, the emperor decided it would be too costly to fully conqure the vast forrests. I do like this in the lore, diplomacy, its nice when its not all wipe out one place then make it part of the empire, shows writers have really thought about each land.

But as someone else mentioned, it will only get a small mention here and there. Such as if you read the novels, umbriel only gets a small bit of dialogue, and now and then you find sap fo the tree in game.
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Megan Stabler
 
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Post » Fri Dec 09, 2011 10:22 pm

A Dragon break.
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Barbequtie
 
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Post » Sat Dec 10, 2011 12:25 am

200 years from now no one remembers this civil war because in the grand scheme of things it just didnt matter. No one remembers Tullius. No one remembers Ulfriic.
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ZANEY82
 
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Post » Fri Dec 09, 2011 2:44 pm

Spoiler
You find out Ulfric is a Thalmor plant



Spoiler
We've been over this a hundred times on these forums. He's not a Thalmor plant. He was manipulated by them for a while, then he broke free of their influence

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JD bernal
 
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Post » Sat Dec 10, 2011 12:25 am

Spoiler
We've been over this a hundred times on these forums. He's not a Thalmor plant. He was manipulated by them for a while, then he broke free of their influence



Spoiler
Debatable. It's clear the Thalmor do not control him in any direct way, that he's not a plant and that he is acting outside of their interests, but there still appears to be some dialogue between them, and given their involvement in the Markarth Incident, it's likely that one of the biggest catalysts of the Civil War was a Thalmor plot, my opinion here. Ulfric used the Thalmor for his own goals as much as they are using him, he had every reason to want the Thalmor to crack down on Talos Worship, and he very much initiated it. That in itself makes him look very suspicious.

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Jack Bryan
 
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Post » Sat Dec 10, 2011 2:37 am

Ulfric is an Elder Scroll.
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Jeffrey Lawson
 
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Post » Sat Dec 10, 2011 2:25 am

Ulfric is an Elder Scroll.


DUDE! Spoilers.
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MatthewJontully
 
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Post » Fri Dec 09, 2011 11:47 pm

I didn't find the decision to be a difficult one. The more I played, the less I sympathized with the Stormcloaks.

I suspect the canon resolution will be an Imperial victory.
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Cayal
 
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Post » Sat Dec 10, 2011 12:45 am

I'll tell you what I tell everyone else who asks, Dragon Break. Rinse, repeat and move on.

Ulfric is an Elder Scroll.


I like this idea.
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BEl J
 
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Post » Sat Dec 10, 2011 6:23 am

So it comes down to an independent Skyrim kicking the [censored] out of Thalmor out of Skyrim, which is a VERY attractive outcome.
Though having a less than fully weakened Empire to one day [censored] the Thalmor in WW2 is also VERY attractive.


Or it could come down to

The Thalmor conquer an independant Skyrim and go on to dominate the already weakened and increasingly destabilized Empire.
Or the Empire stays together but in the end it is for naught and the empire ceases to exist as it is know under the Thalmor.
Or Skyrim gains independance for a time but the Empire eventually retakes it (perhaps Ulfric creates own division). Then the Thalmore gets involved.

Next game takes place in Thalmor dominated province/home province or in Hammerfell.

Or Skyrim becomes independent and the Thalmor avoid it and take down the Empire.
Or Skyrim stays with the Empire but can't save the Empire so becomes independent after it falls.

Though Hammerfell is likely to aid the Empire in a war against the Thalmor, would Skyrim do so as well? The Empire didn't outright make war with Hammerfell, and Stormcloak is the rightful high king of Skyrim in accordance with the old nord ways.


Apprently a lot of Nords disagree he is the rightful High King in accordance with the old Nord ways - it wouldn't be much of a civil war if Ulfric was obviously in the right.

Oh and the Empire tried to cut off his head. So if Skyrim became independent, how would Bethesda write that into the lore, unless the next great war happens in a few generations after Skyrim takes place?


How detailed does the Lore need to be?

Also which one is more likely to be written as what officially happened? Its not like one is more obvious than the other. Unless the next tes game just doesn't mention much about the civil war other than a vague footnote?


Hard to say - of course some people would complain - "I did this, why doesn't future game recognise what I decided to do (my cannon character sets all lore!). But not me.

The last three ES games haven't really been about the PC redefining the politics of the age or vastly changing the political/cultural structure as such (Skyrim has come closest to that). You have a big picture objective (stopping Dagoth Ur, stopping the invasion through the Oblivion Gates, stopping the world being eaten by dragons) - in the course of doing that you move through the culture and politics, perhaps have an immediate impact in that immediate time/place and immediate future but you don't take over Morrowind, don't get put on the throne or any of that.

You stop Dagoth Ur in Morrowind, the rest is personal detail. You help close the Oblivion Gates, the rest is personal detail. You save the world from Dragons, the rest is personal detail. In Morrowind regardless of which house you put on top through your actions or who you kill the fate of Morrowind is the same.

Maybe the easiest thing would be to have it set far enough in the future where the outcome's ripples have died down. Just have a conversation early in the game that will set a limited number of lore related objects. While a prisoner someone asks you something and mentions the Skyrim civil war. You have an option of saying something about Imperials or something about Nords. Depending on which you select the lore books switch over and relate to one side winning or the other. Whoever won doesn't have much impact on the game at hand though (though again I imagine cannon obsessives not liking that).
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Euan
 
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Post » Fri Dec 09, 2011 5:55 pm

History has a way to repeat itself and we all know what happened the the earlier Aldmeri Dominion. It would be great if the Thalmor win this battle and the next TES game will be about a revolution in the Dominion. A bit like how the Nerevarine broke down the Tribunal.

TES games are always great in impact but after that your character disappears and things move on. You always set things in motion but how it will all unfold isn't really up to us and hopefully it stays that way. Though I'd like to know more about what happens to our heroes, Nerevarine simply vanishing ticks me off, I think people will be upset that they can't identify with what they played or the choices they feel they made. I'd much rather prefer a more open-ended ending they can work with than somebody filling in the blanks for me. Up to this point I haven't felt that they forgot about the chars I played, though they are unnamed and seem to be fond of disappearing suddenly :P
I'd hate to have another Warp in teh West...North/whatever.
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Lil Miss
 
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Post » Fri Dec 09, 2011 6:32 pm

Doesn't matter which side wins the civil war. A simple sentence will suffice:

"Eventually the province was brought under control of _________."

They needn't explain the details.
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Jessica Nash
 
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Post » Sat Dec 10, 2011 1:15 am

Falmer invasion happens..... Skyrim falls to the Falmer....
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Claire Jackson
 
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Post » Fri Dec 09, 2011 10:19 pm

The game draws many parallels between Tiber Septim and the player character. Enough that it strikes me as blatantly telegraphing that the future lore will involve this new Dragonborn following in Septim's footsteps to re-unify the shattered Empire, perhaps even ascending to join (or replace?) Talos among the Divines.

Given this projection, there will clearly be no need to specify an outcome to the Stormcloak Rebellion. They can simply say, "After the Great War, the Empire fragmented and provinces broke away." They don't need to specify whether Skyrim was among the provinces that broke away or not. This doesn't even require the PC to be the founder of the new Empire, just that the Empire falls apart and re-forms.

Another possibility would be for canon to state that the Rebellion was winding down (again without specifying which side was dominant in Skyrim) when the Thalmor resumed hostilities, forcing the warring factions in Skyrim to set aside their differences in order to face the greater common threat. Given that the ban on Talos worship and Imperial subservience to the Thalmor seem to be the Stormcloaks' major issues, the dissolution of the White Gold Concordat would make it much easier for the Empire and the Stormcloaks to join forces even without the Dominion resuming open hostilities.
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Stace
 
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Post » Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:10 pm

Dragon Break. You killed an aspect of Akatosh. You tore open a hole in time with the Elder Scroll. That would distort the timestream enough to make both endings canon.
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abi
 
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