sorry if this question is a repost, i tried searching but to no avail...

just wondered if anyone has put destruction spells costs to the test in finding what does the maximum amount of damage vs the cost to cast, taking duel casting into consideration. probably doesn't matter much when you're fighting one on one but when you see five potential victims and you're a mage, it's a little tough to wipe out the whole crew without resorting to potions.

in the same breathe... i'm wondering about regen on armor /clothes... like if anyone has put to the test what effects wearing the Morokei mask vs the Nahkriin has on your casting cost/regen. is the archmage's robe the final solution for perfect mage armor if you have regen in mind? is there a best combination-solution at all to apparel for mages?

From testing with one of my poor huscarls in the basemant of a house I think flames is by far the best bang for your buck if you can survive the extra time it takes to kill something. Specifically for when you have more than one enemy attacking you at a time. Something I learned, ironically from Torchlight, was to drag any melee attacking you to the nearest ranged/caster and using it as a cone AOE. Flames hits everything in front of you in a cone. Another thing to note, and the reason I tested in the first place, is casting the spell singly from both hands does WAY more damage than dual casting with the perk. Part of the trick seems to be not holding the buttons down but casting left right left right etc. It has a slightly larger burst of damage when it's first cast so it is better to not just hold the buttons down. Dual casting doesn't do as much damage per mana.

(It took me a full bar of mana to drop Lydia when dual casting, not even half when using the above method)

wow! good info... thanks for the heads up on that.

It actually does more damage dual casting however you did by the looks of things accidentally stumble on how to flash the spells for maximum efficiency. Effectively you cast for a fraction of a second, just enough to "hit" with the spell then turn it off for a second(it continues to do damage for 1-2s) then keep repeating this. Dual casting this will do more damage though although not by a lot. The other side of this is since you aren't constantly casting it you are basically get 2s worth of damage for 0.5s of casting time further enhancing the already very efficient spell.

Mana regeneration in battle is slowed so significantly that I have chosen to go with more magicka, instead of faster regen.

I suppose it all depends on the kind of mage you are playing too. If you like to conjure the biggest, baddest zombie or atronach before each battle, regen probably works better for you. If you want to blast everything to dust, I think the magicka is the way to go.

Even when I had magicka regen on all my items, I was still svcking down potions. As I mentioned before, regen was so slow during battle I couldn't wait for it to recharge on its own, even with regen gear on.

I think I am drinking fewer potions now, because my inventory is stocked with them...or I am just making more at the alchemy table since I've discovered new ingredients. =)

When I can enchant 2 effects per item, I still may not go with regen. I think I'll add health where I can, and use my leveling increases for more magicka!

I do this too, when I can. It's more efficient damage/mana/second than dual casting.

However, the biggest advantage to dual casting, in my opinion, is not the 'bonus' damage, but the stagger effect if you have the perk.

When that bandit is charging you with that axe, the stagger stops him in his tracks. Melee fighters seldom touch me. It's the darn archers that drop me most of the time.

Even dragons aren't immune to the stagger. If you time your shots right, you can keep one on the ground, unable to fly away.

I had a bit different of an experience. When dual casting, it charges your spell into doing an extra 25% damage, at the expense of extra 20% mana cost. So if that is true, dual casting will give you an extra 5% damage boost. Very little but its still there. the best way that I have noticed to do damage with destruction magic, is to use bursts. For example, I will use the flame spell. The basic flame spell. I never hold it down as a continuous stream. I do small bursts for greater mana conservation. Just burst it for about 2 seconds then release, after you release their health will still go down for a second or two. Then burst again. I keep up this same process. If you don't dual cast, its the same thing, just blast them with a second or two of heat, wait until their health bars stops going down from the residual damage, then blast again. I think I'm saying pretty much the same thing as you did but with using dual casting. If dual casting does what its supposed to by adding the damage of both spells into one, for example 8 fire damage spell dual casted should be a 16 damage spell + 25% damage boost from dual casting (in this case that's an extra 4 damage, 16 divided by 4 or 25% is 4). So if everything is correct with the programming, then dual casting flames would result in a 20 damage per second spell. I'm fairly certain it turns out that way, but hey I could be wrong. and don't take offense that I showed the numbers in the equation, I wasn't trying to imply you needed the numbers. I just added them because some of the newer players may not understand how the dual casting works and numbers was the easiest way to show. But other than that I think we both have the right idea of bursting with the spells. The only difference is I use dual cast. But like I said, I could be very wrong. Also, nice point on telling him to line up targets for the cone effect. That's a good tip for conserving mana and killing faster.

Actually by default dual casting is 2.8 the magicka cost for 2.2 times the damage; that's why its crap. :laugh:

Archamge Robes are generally better choice for pure mages but if you find yourself using mainly one school it would be better to get master level robes for that one ( better reduction for one school + 150% regen bonus ).

Overcharging destruction spells is quite ineffective as the ratio of cost to efficiency is very poor. Only good thing is impact perk BUT you can achieve even better effects by using Staff of Chain Lightning as it will stagger ALL normal enemies that it hits ( chain lightining spell will stagger only first target ) and staves are also taking advantage of damage perks so if you have +50% damage to shock spells then your lightning staves will also have that bonus.
I have been using potions only in the beginning but since I started using staves as an addition to spells I no longer need to use potions constantly but only once in a while during very heavy fights so staves are a way to go when playing as a pure mage and not using alchemy.

Base magicka regen in combat is around 2.3 per second ( very slow ) when you have 300% bonus ( quite hard to get ) you will have around 9 points per second ( good but still too slow for higher level spells and when you add overcharging it is just tragic ).

The higher the level of the spell the LESS effective it will be when compared to it's magicka cost. So low level spells are always more cost effective than higher level spells but on the other hand those spells will allow you to kill things faster.

I've played two Mages to over level 40. Best gear is easily ones that reduce spell cost. Don't bother going for +Magicka regeneration if you want the most optimal build.

Also a tip about Flames, don't hold it. Fire it in bursts and let the DoT deal the damage. It increases damage output and reduces cost/second. So fire for half a second, stop for half a second, fire for half a second.. just enough to keep them ignited.

Great tips, and thanks for the clarification about what Staff of Chain Lightning does – I was wondering why I was getting staggers with that. Does Staff of Fireball not have the same effect?

Also, I find it interesting that folks are recommending using Flames so much. I haven't used it in a while (at level 42 now) because it took so long to take down enemies, even with the +50% perks. Are we talking about Flames from one hand and a melee weapon in the other, or are those of you who are casting just really good at dodging charging opponents until they finally go down?

(Side note: I'm so glad to see a thread actually discussing Destruction strategy instead of yet another rant about how bad it is as a skill. I don't care about balance; I want to shoot freaking fire from my hands.)