New character, sneak mage.

Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:12 pm

So basically I want to start a new game after the 1.3 patch is out for xbox 360, my assassin illusion character (level 60+) on master, is riddled with bugs and I hope some will be fixed, I also want a change.

So I think I will go with an altmer sneak mage on master. I realised that with my previous character I don't actually get hit that often, therefore I don't need armor. Plus if I do get hit I will probably die without armor, so its higher risk. I will also use the become ethereal shout for survival.

I will use:
  • Sneak, I will go for the perks up to silence on the left tree, and all the perks on the right tree. I will only get the first perk once though.
  • Destruction for damage, even though its underpowered in terms of damage at high levels, it will be a challenge.
  • 1h daggers for sneak attacks, I won't use the DB gloves for x30 sneak attacks though, to overpowered. I will probably get the armsman perk 5x for the extra 100% damage.
  • Illusion for invisibility, also for dual casting calm/fear/fury.
  • Conjuration for sponging damage and dealing damage, dremora lords and storm atronachs/thralls. Possible dead thralls, but I don't really use them to much on my character now though.
  • Dabble in enchanting and alchemy a bit, to fortify magicka cost of spells and destruction damage potions, not smithing though.
  • Alteration for the magic armor spells, not sure how effective they are as I have never used them.


I might cut down on the perks in the left sneak tree, as without armor they problems don't really affect me. How effective are the alteration armor spells with the right perks, and how long do they last with the right perks? Might just go with light armor and scrap alteration though.
Not sure about restoration as I don't think I will need it, maybe for the +50% magicka regeneration rate.
I'm also tempted to be a dunmer, for the fire resistance, I can then be a vampire straight away.
Thoughts?
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Lalla Vu
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:09 pm

I would personally forget sneak + daggers or you just have a variation on the same character.
You can walk (sneak!) through the whole game naked with nothing else, so it will be more fun imo to fully try something different.

Imo an Altmer mage would enter a dungeon and proclaim his presence, then proceed to melt the faces of those who dared to oppose his will! ;)

I don't really like the alteration armor, it doesn't last very long and is not very strong compared to improved real armor. It just adds another thing you need to do before/during combat.
Enchanting is pretty much required to have much fun, otherwise you will run out of mana and spend most of the game running away like a Benny Hill sketch or guzzling potions, good +mana & +regen for me rather than zero cost spells as that is a bit cheap (though some -destruction cost is a good idea.
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Rudy Paint fingers
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:32 pm

I would personally forget sneak + daggers or you just have a variation on the same character.
You can walk (sneak!) through the whole game naked with nothing else, so it will be more fun imo to fully try something different.

Imo an Altmer mage would enter a dungeon and proclaim his presence, then proceed to melt the faces of those who dared to oppose his will! ;)

I don't really like the alteration armor, it doesn't last very long and is not very strong compared to improved real armor. It just adds another thing you need to do before/during combat.
Enchanting is pretty much required to have much fun, otherwise you will run out of mana and spend most of the game running away like a Benny Hill sketch or guzzling potions, good +mana & +regen for me rather than zero cost spells as that is a bit cheap (though some -destruction cost is a good idea.

I like sneaking though, hmm. I won't be enchanting to get 0% magicka consumption for destruction, takes the fun away. I will probably aim for around 80-90%. Might have to look into the alteration armor to see if its any good, I think the master spell gives you 100 armor rating, and the perk triples that. Along with the stone that adds 50 armor rating, isn't to bad. The problem I think would be the duration for the master spell, I bet it's only like 30 seconds.
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Nicole Elocin
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:13 pm

Just had a look, the master alteration spell gives you 80% armor rating, its the expert spell that gives 100 armor rating. You can dual cast the expert spell to get double duration, and you can get a perk that adds 50% duration. Doesn't look to bad now tbh.
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Emmanuel Morales
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:56 pm

You definitely need the silent casting perk (in Illusion) if you're making a sneak mage.

I only bring it up because I didn't see it mentioned in the OP.
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Cat Haines
 
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Post » Fri Dec 16, 2011 1:09 am

You definitely need the silent casting perk (in Illusion) if you're making a sneak mage.

I only bring it up because I didn't see it mentioned in the OP.

Ah yeah, I was planning to get all illusion perks apart from the master 100 illusion spell perk, which I wouldn't use. Otherwise fury/calm/fear would be useless at high levels. Thanks though :smile:
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lydia nekongo
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:57 am

Ok, definitely illusion is your best friend here. You're first spell you should work on getting is Muffle. This muffles your footsteps making it very easy to sneak. It also causes your illusion level to increase a lot. Dualcasting perk is actually very good for illusion since you'll need some extra oomph to calm or fear higher level enemies in the beginning.
Alteration is extremely important since you don't want armor. I would focus on getting the "flesh" spells and all of the magearmor perks. You can get a max of 300 armor this way. Dualcasting perk is good here too because it increases duration of the spell
Oh and regeneration might be useful for repel undead spells since draugr and skeletons aren't affected by normal fear spells
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Multi Multi
 
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Post » Fri Dec 16, 2011 1:37 am

Ok, definitely illusion is your best friend here. You're first spell you should work on getting is Muffle. This muffles your footsteps making it very easy to sneak. It also causes your illusion level to increase a lot. Dualcasting perk is actually very good for illusion since you'll need some extra oomph to calm or fear higher level enemies in the beginning.
Alteration is extremely important since you don't want armor. I would focus on getting the "flesh" spells and all of the magearmor perks. You can get a max of 300 armor this way. Dualcasting perk is good here too because it increases duration of the spell
Oh and regeneration might be useful for repel undead spells since draugr and skeletons aren't affected by normal fear spells

The restoration spells don't work at a high enough level when you are a high level, so most undead will be unaffected, can't see restoration being that useful either. Illusion spells work on undead if you get the master of the mind (90 illusion) perk. I use it on my character now, level 60+ and I can calm/fury/fear pretty much anything.
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stephanie eastwood
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 8:15 pm

The restoration spells don't work at a high enough level when you are a high level, so most undead will be unaffected, can't see restoration being that useful either. Illusion spells work on undead if you get the master of the mind (90 illusion) perk. I use it on my character now, level 60+ and I can calm/fury/fear pretty much anything.

Yea I know but for early levels since you're just starting off with this character I thought it'd be useful :happy:
Oh and btw, Undead don't level with you in case you were wondering. Dremoras do though...damn dremoras <_<
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R.I.p MOmmy
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:43 am

Yea I know but for early levels since you're just starting off with this character I thought it'd be useful :happy:
Oh and btw, Undead don't level with you in case you were wondering. Dremoras do though...damn dremoras <_<

What levels are draugr scourge and deathlords? I imagine they are at least 40+, yeah its useful at lower levels, but at lower levels destruction is strong ha. Hm, don't want to plan it to much, ill probably change a few bits of what I said.
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YO MAma
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 8:07 pm

So basically I want to start a new game after the 1.3 patch is out for xbox 360, my assassin illusion character (level 60+) on master, is riddled with bugs and I hope some will be fixed, I also want a change.

So I think I will go with an altmer sneak mage on master. I realised that with my previous character I don't actually get hit that often, therefore I don't need armor. Plus if I do get hit I will probably die without armor, so its higher risk. I will also use the become ethereal shout for survival.

I will use:
  • Sneak, I will go for the perks up to silence on the left tree, and all the perks on the right tree. I will only get the first perk once though.
  • Destruction for damage, even though its underpowered in terms of damage at high levels, it will be a challenge.
  • 1h daggers for sneak attacks, I won't use the DB gloves for x30 sneak attacks though, to overpowered. I will probably get the armsman perk 5x for the extra 100% damage.
  • Illusion for invisibility, also for dual casting calm/fear/fury.
  • Conjuration for sponging damage and dealing damage, dremora lords and storm atronachs/thralls. Possible dead thralls, but I don't really use them to much on my character now though.
  • Dabble in enchanting and alchemy a bit, to fortify magicka cost of spells and destruction damage potions, not smithing though.
  • Alteration for the magic armor spells, not sure how effective they are as I have never used them.


I might cut down on the perks in the left sneak tree, as without armor they problems don't really affect me. How effective are the alteration armor spells with the right perks, and how long do they last with the right perks? Might just go with light armor and scrap alteration though.
Not sure about restoration as I don't think I will need it, maybe for the +50% magicka regeneration rate.
I'm also tempted to be a dunmer, for the fire resistance, I can then be a vampire straight away.
Thoughts?


if you are not playing in master that could work.
destruction doesnt mix with sneak at all tho, even with illusion talent to silence it, same with alteration, that lights you up like a xmas tree, and paralyse is reduntant with the entire illusion tree.

also, destruction is NOT underpowered in terms of damage at all, thats just what the silly propaganda been yappin when they didnt know how to play.
its by far the most damaging tree untill you invest 100 skill and perks in at least 2 crafting trees at least wich will not happen before lvl50-60 (when the game is pretty much overand beyond) and at the cost of many perks in other trees,
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Vicky Keeler
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 6:33 pm

if you are not playing in master that could work.
destruction doesnt mix with sneak at all tho, even with illusion talent to silence it, same with alteration, that lights you up like a xmas tree, and paralyse is reduntant with the entire illusion tree.

also, destruction is NOT underpowered in terms of damage at all, thats just what the silly propaganda been yappin when they didnt know how to play.
its by far the most damaging tree untill you invest 100 skill and perks in at least 2 crafting trees at least wich will not happen before lvl50-60 (when the game is pretty much overand beyond) and at the cost of many perks in other trees,


Destruction works great with the silent cast perk, assuming that your sneak skill is sufficiently high. I was able to kill entire rooms of baddies on my sneak mage without them ever even detecting me (It was even taking 2-3 casts to take down each enemy).
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Jesus Duran
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:46 am

Destruction works great with the silent cast perk, assuming that your sneak skill is sufficiently high. I was able to kill entire rooms of baddies on my sneak mage without them ever even detecting me (It was even taking 2-3 casts to take down each enemy).


with me they always come straigh at me... if I cast muzzle and move after every cast I may get away with a boring looong hit+run away aproach but... meh...
it does work if I can use the enviroment to mess up the AI's detection, like for exemple shoot them from a high place that makes them have to run a long time and climb stairs and stuff before getting to me.

2-3 casts? not on master m8, most groups of mobs will have at least 1 leveled mob that will expose you, not to say multiple ones.

having that said, I didnt get any perks in sneak, needed them elsewhere. (alchemy pots :DDD )
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Tracey Duncan
 
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Post » Fri Dec 16, 2011 2:08 am

The sneak might not work with destruction that well, but it does with illusion, conjuration and 1h, all of which I'm using. :smile:

I am defo going with alteration now, it sounds more fun to me, a bit more risky ha, less weight as well considering I won't invest much into stamina.

About the destruction damage, the shock master spell if you have the shock+ perks does insane damage. Its just the stupid charge time and if you hit it usually cancels that makes it less appealing. But it won't do as much damage as 1h, 2h or archery if they are maxed out.
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Helen Quill
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:45 pm

Just realised, that I only ever see a head piece, chest piece, necklace and a ring that is non armor with enchantments. Do you have to use normal boots and normal gloves if you don't enchant them, or can you find good enchanted non armor gloves and boots. I remember the clown apparel you can get during the DB questline, in the kill cicero quest, has enchantments on the boots + gloves, any others?
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GabiiE Liiziiouz
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 4:57 pm

So basically I want to start a new game after the 1.3 patch is out for xbox 360, my assassin illusion character (level 60+) on master, is riddled with bugs and I hope some will be fixed, I also want a change.

So I think I will go with an altmer sneak mage on master. I realised that with my previous character I don't actually get hit that often, therefore I don't need armor. Plus if I do get hit I will probably die without armor, so its higher risk. I will also use the become ethereal shout for survival.

I will use:
  • Sneak, I will go for the perks up to silence on the left tree, and all the perks on the right tree. I will only get the first perk once though.
  • Destruction for damage, even though its underpowered in terms of damage at high levels, it will be a challenge.
  • 1h daggers for sneak attacks, I won't use the DB gloves for x30 sneak attacks though, to overpowered. I will probably get the armsman perk 5x for the extra 100% damage.
  • Illusion for invisibility, also for dual casting calm/fear/fury.
  • Conjuration for sponging damage and dealing damage, dremora lords and storm atronachs/thralls. Possible dead thralls, but I don't really use them to much on my character now though.
  • Dabble in enchanting and alchemy a bit, to fortify magicka cost of spells and destruction damage potions, not smithing though.
  • Alteration for the magic armor spells, not sure how effective they are as I have never used them.


I might cut down on the perks in the left sneak tree, as without armor they problems don't really affect me. How effective are the alteration armor spells with the right perks, and how long do they last with the right perks? Might just go with light armor and scrap alteration though.
Not sure about restoration as I don't think I will need it, maybe for the +50% magicka regeneration rate.
I'm also tempted to be a dunmer, for the fire resistance, I can then be a vampire straight away.
Thoughts?

Sounds like you plan to play like I do.
You want to be a master of Illusion and Destruction. Illusion is your primary defense and a source of great entertainment if you want to watch a boss's minions kill the boss for you.
Destruction is actually fantastic damage. It doesn't compete with sneak attacks ofc.

Don't use daggers and backstab if you want to level destruction as you will still 1-shot everything. And calm/pacify allows chain backstabbing. If anything just get backstab for 6x 1-handed damage, you'll still 1-shot trash and damn near kill everything else in 1 hit.
Get steel smithing, thats all you really need then buy a skyforge steel sword and use alchemy and enchanting potion/gear to improve the sword to something like 70 damage. This will allow you to avoid perking 1 handers completely.
This gives you pretty ridiculously awesome 1-handed sneak damage for 2 perks in sneak, 1 perk in smithing, and no perks in 1-handed, saving you many perk points.

For sneaking you really don't need any perks in sneak tree AT ALL. You definitely want quiet casting, muffle, and invisibility. Sneaking will level automatically while you approach things invisible, muffled, and in sneak mode. Oh and don't wear armor cause they're more likely to hear that.

Basically perk the entire Illusion perk tree except mana reducing perks. With properly enchanted items your mana cost will be reduced enough already.
Similarly for destruction, its not too important to get the mana reducing perks if you're properly enchanted but it still helps if you want avoid using potions in longer fights.

You want the necromage perk in the restoration tree as most things are undead and it increases your destruction damage against them.

Alteration actually offers by far the best defense over the other armors at highest level. I literally have every alteration perk, and between it and the Atronach Stone I need no other magical or physical defenses via potions or enchantments.

Destruction http://skyrimcalculator.com/#20413 deep freeze and intense flames aren't really worth it imo, cause they're usually on the floor begging for mercy by then anyways. Disintegrate simply doesn't offer them the opportunity to beg at all and turns them into a nice little pile of ashes. And runemaster is pointless because it is a pre-battle spell anyways and you won't be using it beyond level 35 anyways.

Umm other than that, I have an enchanting and alchemy guide for this stuff in my signature.

Welcome to the beginning of divinity! Be nice to the mortals.
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Kelli Wolfe
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 9:10 pm

Oh additionally don't make the mistake of putting all points into magicka! 50/50 magicka/hp is actually a really good way to go about it. If you run out of magicka, you can always use a magicka pot. If you run out of health, you die!
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Josephine Gowing
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 9:12 pm

That looks like a lot of sound build advice, Hoki.

Thanks for the tips!
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Beth Belcher
 
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Post » Fri Dec 16, 2011 1:06 am

Sounds like you plan to play like I do.
You want to be a master of Illusion and Destruction. Illusion is your primary defense and a source of great entertainment if you want to watch a boss's minions kill the boss for you.
Destruction is actually fantastic damage. It doesn't compete with sneak attacks ofc.

Don't use daggers and backstab if you want to level destruction as you will still 1-shot everything. And calm/pacify allows chain backstabbing. If anything just get backstab for 6x 1-handed damage, you'll still 1-shot trash and damn near kill everything else in 1 hit.
Get steel smithing, thats all you really need then buy a skyforge steel sword and use alchemy and enchanting potion/gear to improve the sword to something like 70 damage. This will allow you to avoid perking 1 handers completely.
This gives you pretty ridiculously awesome 1-handed sneak damage for 2 perks in sneak, 1 perk in smithing, and no perks in 1-handed, saving you many perk points.

For sneaking you really don't need any perks in sneak tree AT ALL. You definitely want quiet casting, muffle, and invisibility. Sneaking will level automatically while you approach things invisible, muffled, and in sneak mode. Oh and don't wear armor cause they're more likely to hear that.

Basically perk the entire Illusion perk tree except mana reducing perks. With properly enchanted items your mana cost will be reduced enough already.
Similarly for destruction, its not too important to get the mana reducing perks if you're properly enchanted but it still helps if you want avoid using potions in longer fights.

You want the necromage perk in the restoration tree as most things are undead and it increases your destruction damage against them.

Alteration actually offers by far the best defense over the other armors at highest level. I literally have every alteration perk, and between it and the Atronach Stone I need no other magical or physical defenses via potions or enchantments.

Destruction http://skyrimcalculator.com/#20413 deep freeze and intense flames aren't really worth it imo, cause they're usually on the floor begging for mercy by then anyways. Disintegrate simply doesn't offer them the opportunity to beg at all and turns them into a nice little pile of ashes. And runemaster is pointless because it is a pre-battle spell anyways and you won't be using it beyond level 35 anyways.

Umm other than that, I have an enchanting and alchemy guide for this stuff in my signature.

Welcome to the beginning of divinity! Be nice to the mortals.

Oh additionally don't make the mistake of putting all points into magicka! 50/50 magicka/hp is actually a really good way to go about it. If you run out of magicka, you can always use a magicka pot. If you run out of health, you die!

Thanks for the detailed response!

I'm fine with illusion, as I used it at a high level on my other character, I had the entire right tree of perks, which allowed me to use the manipulation spells on anything even at level 50+. Being a vampire buffs this further.

Alteration doesn't offer more defense than heavy/light armor unfortunately, the cap is 80% damage resist, which is around 570 armor rating. Alteration master perk gives you that 80% resist, for a base duration of ~30 seconds I think. The expert spell ebonyflesh gives you 100 armor rating, 300 with the 3x perks, which isn't to bad, considering you could use the lord stone to for another +50.

Swords aren't good for sneak attacks, because other enemies will detect you when you slash, daggers on the other hand are silent even if you miss. I think I will just buy a daedric dagger (thieves guild women) or use one of the unique daggers for my sneak attacks. So it's not so overpowered it can one hit ancient dragons.

For destruction, I don't think I will bother with ice spells, the shock master spell is superior and the fire expert spell is superior IMO. Also remember there is a link between the fire destruction perk which cause enemies to flee and the illusion perk that increases the effect of fear spells. This increases the damage of the fire spell IIRC, it doesn't look like it on the stats of the spell.

I think I will still go for a few sneak perks, as I like the silent roll, also the silence perk will still help with me no armor. I won't bother with shadow warrior.

I will probably go with something like 5 magicka : 3 health : 2 stamina, but I don't really plan that tbh.
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Nicholas C
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 3:17 pm

I am playing a sneak mage and haven't put any points into health yet. Got 400 magicka and 260 stamina.
I figure if you are going to be sneaking around all the time, it's better to have more carrying capacity and a bigger mana pool than health.
It's up to you though.
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Chrissie Pillinger
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 6:42 pm

I am playing a sneak mage and haven't put any points into health yet. Got 400 magicka and 260 stamina.
I figure if you are going to be sneaking around all the time, it's better to have more carrying capacity and a bigger mana pool than health.
It's up to you though.

Good point, you can also enchanting any of the fortify health/magicka/stamina, but if you take stamina when leveling up you get the +carry capacity as well.
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Arrogant SId
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 3:21 pm

why would you want alteration shields if you don't get hit much?
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YO MAma
 
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Post » Fri Dec 16, 2011 1:18 am

why would you want alteration shields if you don't get hit much?

Meaning I do still get hit sometimes when I attack, so I can use the alteration armor when I need it.
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Kelli Wolfe
 
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Post » Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:31 pm

sure, just seems like alot of points for what is basically an "oh sh*t" button in your gameplay.

Now, I will admit that until i recently (from level 35) started going into conjuration my pure sneak/illusion mage had big problems taking down some enemies. And as said before, no dragons at all - but the game is totally playable regardless. Use calm on single enemies and frenzy on multiple ones. Keep stealthed and/or invisible. It's fun =)
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Leah
 
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