I think the best argument for "Billy is not pedo" is that why, oh why on earth would Bethesda include pedophilia in one of its games? I'm quite certain that the game was screened over and over again in case of harsh realities such as love, mothers and bad guy victory.

I am guessing Bethesda intended to generate exactly this type of controversy. I am quite sure the game was screened to ensure there was no overt proof of molestation, but I am also betting that the Billy/Maggie issue was included to make the game seem more edgy and advlt.
My feeling though is that a youngish, single man living alone with an unrelated pre-teen girl is way more than a bit dodgy. Billy definitely doesnt strike me as either the monk or the good samaritan type, either
In any case, its probably useful to consider the context; most wasteland dwellers would be more likely to eat little girls or decorate their homes with bits of them.
Given the alternative, Maggie probably considers herself fortunate, even if uncle Billy does get a bit 'friendly' sometimes.

Probably best to let this thread die...

I like it. Good stuff dude. The image of Creel yanking off Maggie's dad's boots, only to see the poor dude's daughter watching him from beneath the bed made me lol. I buy that. I still think Creel is capable of killing the parents himself, though, everybody who ventures outside of settlements in the Capital Wasteland... they're aallllll killers.

I thought I was the only one!


I agree on the trophy thing though. I think Raising Maggie is Creel's way of trying to be a normal responsible Megatonian.

(normal in comparion to a rapist, a blackmailer, a hoker, a drug addict, a former slaver, a guy worshiping a bomb and a woman that gives you endless bottles of filthy water)

If Billy Creel IS a pedo, and Moriarity IS telling the truth then you might want to check with the whether bureau, 'cuzz I think Hell just froze over.

Here's what some digging in the GECK dialogue tree turns up:

Billy: "Oh! Sorry, I guess I got ahead of myself, huh? Maggie's nine, sweetest little girl you'd ever care to meet. We take care of each other."
Billy: "I ain't never had a daughter, but if I did, I'd want her to be Maggie. I took her in when her parents got killed by Raiders. That was two years ago."

She was seven when he found her. Also, his conversation implies that he was riding with the caravans for years, including before he found Maggie.
In fact: "Me? I deal with the caravan suppliers. I used to ride with those guys, so they cut me some good deals. Helps keep the town supplied."
Combined with: "It was a pretty bad scene. Small settlement up north. I'd stopped in to trade some salvage, and the whole place had been wiped out." - implies he was still working with the traders when he found Maggie.
Probably settled down in Megaton to raise her, since a traveling caravan can be a bit tough to raise a kid in, especially in the wasteland.

Maggie is also aware who it was that killed her parents, as her conversation includes:
"Billy does! Have you met Billy... Billy Creel? A long, long time ago, he saved me from Raiders!"
"They... killed my real parents. But Billy showed up before they got me, and now he's like my daddy... sort of..."
(Hey, when you're nine, two years ago is long, long ago. )


Here are the conversations they have, which indicates Billy likes Moira (either as a friend or something more, or perhaps both) and Maggie has a crush on Harden.
The later especially argues against Billy molesting or even being attracted to Maggie beyond a father-figure level.
And would you really take Moriarty's word over Billy's? "Oh he seems nice, he must be hiding something." or what? That's pretty sad.
I can post Moriarty's conversations if you like, so you can see what a nice and caring individual he is. :rolleyes:

Alternately, you guys have been watching too much porm.


Maggie greets Billy:

Maggie: "Billy, I want to talk to you..."
Billy: "Anything for you, honey?"
Maggie: "You said we could have that talk sometime. You know. About boys. I'm ready! I'm ready now! There's some stuff I need to know. Like, really bad."
Billy: "Whoa! Whoa now, honeybun! Let's ah... Let's slow down a little, okay? You got a lot of time left before that stuff is important. All right?"
Maggie: "*Sigh* All right, Billy. But you can't avoid the subject forever, you know..."
Billy: "I know, I know, sweetheart. Now you run along, okay? Billy's got some thinkin' to do."

and

Maggie: "Billy, can I talk to you about something?"
Billy: "For you, sweetheart, anything. What do you need?"
Maggie: "It's about Harden. I think I want to... kiss him. But I don't know if I should. Well, I think I should, but I don't really know HOW. What should..."
Billy: "Oh! Well... Well, now, you know Maggie sweetheart that boys and girls, umm... Aw hell, girl, can't you talk to Moira about this stuff?"
Maggie: "Geez, Billy, you're so timid with this stuff. I won't be a kid forever, you know."
Billy: "Hey, would you look at the time! Sorry sweetheart, I've got, um... somethin' to do..."
(This one is hilarious to listen to. )

Billy greets Maggie:

Billy: "Hey, Maggie! How you doin', darlin'?"
Maggie: "Yeah, Billy?"
Billy: "Well, I was thinkin', Sweetie Pie... Sometime soon, we should take a trip. Just you and me. Maybe visit Rivet City or somethin'. Would you like that?"
Maggie: "Oh, yes! Please, please, please! Can we Billy? We could have so much fun. More fun than we could in Megaton, that's for sure!"
Billy: "Ha ha! I just love seeing you happy, sweetheart."
Maggie: "You're the best, Billy!"

and

Billy: "Hey! Sweetie-pie!"
Maggie: "Yes, Billy?"
Billy: "You know, I got to thinkin'. You and I should do some scavengin' sometime soon. See, we find us an old bike, and get Moira to help us fix her up!"
Maggie: "You mean it? Oh Billy, thank you! Thank you so much! I can't wait!"
Billy: "Well all right then! It's settled! I'll set my affairs in order, as they say, and we'll sit down and plan this thing out."
Maggie: "Thank you, Billy. I just... thanks."

(This last implies she's really flattered to be included in such a grown-up thing as a scavenger hunt and fix-up. )

Case closed. Billy Creel is just another ordinary, awkward, wasteland male

*watchs as all logic in this thread flies out the window*

WHAT HAVE YOU DONE!?!?!?

anyhow now that thats cleared up and Billy is definately not a pedo guess its time to leave this thread behind.

Hey Suntiger you mind posting the chat between Jericho and Jenny Stahl about him apoligizing for attempting to molest her? Dont have the geck or I would myself i always catch the buttend of it and havent heard the entire convo.

Sure. I did it once before in a thread which discussed whether Jericho was a rapist or not but I think that thread got deleted eventually.


Convo 1:

Jericho: "Hey, Jenny. Lookin' good. What've you got for me today?"
Jenny: "Food, Jericho. It's all I had for you yesterday. It's all I have for you today. It's all I'll ever have for you."
Jericho: "C'mon, Jenny, why you gotta be like that? I'm just trying to be nice to you."
Jenny: "I'm not going to discuss it, Jericho. You know good and [censored] well why I'm like this and don't you dare play dumb with me."
Jericho: "Jenny, baby. That was a long time ago. I've left all that behind me now."
Jenny: "People don't change, Jericho. Now order something and leave me alone."


Convo 2:

Jericho: "Well, hello there, sweetie. What's on the menu today?"
Jenny: "Jericho, you're disgusting. Are you going to order something or not?"
Jericho: "Dammit, Jenny. Why do you have to embarrass me like that, out here in front of all these people?"
Jenny: "Don't play stupid with me, Jericho. You know what my problem is."
Jericho: "Look, Jenny, that was years ago. I'm a different man now."
Jenny: "No, Jericho. Just no. Now leave me alone."

Good stuff dude. but to be fair to the majority of posters in the thread, they thought that he wasn't, but that Billy Creel was a dodgy character and there may have been more to the meeting with Maggie. If he's had her so long you can think of it as reform, even if he did kill her parents, or was somehow loosely involved, scav becomes scav and is easier to come by when you remove the owners of whatever it may be. But yeah, for the OP question of sixual preference you've deffo proved that he is not. Unless he's far smarter than he appears and he's arranged what Maggie can and can't talk about outside of the house. lol S'a stretch.

Maybe I don't like him because he wears an eyepatch, and I associate that kind of clothing with pirates and bad people, and when the owner still has both eyes, I associate it with psychos and people with no friends... or no friends older than eleven, anyway. :shrug:

In reply to the "billy had 12 years to make good with the traders" argument, Billy must have been one crappy raider if the traders trust him enough to work with him. Or maybe map transitions wipe their memories. Perhaps billy just waited for 24 hours in the next town O-o

dun dun DUUUUUUUUUUUUUUN

Oy... Are the "Billy Creel is a Pedo" crowd gonna be as immune to reasoning as the "Fawkes is Female" crowd? :facepalm:

He couldn't possibly be a "reformed raider". Look at how harsh raiders are to their bodies; Drugs out the wazoo, heavy tans, rarely bathing. He doesn't have the worn-down look like Jericho, or the residual urge to raid craziness in him like Jericho either.

Moriarty's diary entry on him is just the ravings of a paranoid sociopath. He talks about the Jericho/Jenny incident more as if it were a fact instead of a suspicion like Billy; taken in context with Jenny's strong dislike for Jericho, it's far more likely than Billy being a pedo who killed Maggie's biological parents.

I don't think he is a paedo. But a rational individual could easily surmise that an eleven year old girl being raised in a town with a grand total of three kids, and no expected norm in a post-apocalyptic world for the practise of raising kids... that she might think Billy Creel's methods are normal... whatever they may be, or involve. Be that perfectly normal childrens stories at bed time and scating around the issue of birds and bees, or... the darker stuff that others are suggesting. I doubt it, but y'know, spishus, people are. Address their spishuns, we must. :shrug:

Also, most posters aren't implying he was a Raider, just that he was involved in the murders of the families somehow. The only person in the game that has mentioned Raiders is Billy Creel, and he's also the only person who really knows what happened. Since he's the accused we can't really take his word. Maggie can't know because she was allegedly hiding at the time. Hearing shots and screams is one thing, seeing the killer(s) is quite another. Between the incident beginning, and seeing Billy's face as he's pulling or coaxing her out of hiding... anything could have happened.

Anything including a sawn-off shotgun toting Creel barging in and gunning down the parents for some easy scav. I'd be interested to know if he went ahead and picked up the salvage even as he was rescuing Maggie. Might be good to know that if he did, why there was anything still there worth taking if the place had allegedly been ransacked during the murders. Guess we'll never know since we can't put the NPC on trial. lol :twirl:

This thread makes me rofl.

Why? lol I wanna get it to the mod lock limit's worth of pages. *shifty eyes* :talk:

Edit: Mod limit, lock... worth. Limit, mod, locks... lod mimit mock's worth. Lod mock mimit. :shrug:

Because it's a bloody game character lmao, I don't know, I just saw the title of this topic and giggled a bit.

Did you miss the little post with the dialogue from the actual game?
- Maggie is nine.
- Billy says: "I found Maggie hiding under a bed, in the same room where her parents had been butchered. We've been together ever since." (emphasis mine)

Maggie likely knows perfectly well who it was that killed her parents and tells you in conversation that it was raiders and that Billy rescued her. She was seven at the time.
Why should we doubt her? She would have heard and probably partially saw what happened to her parents and who did it.

For that matter, in all his conversations Billy comes across as a friendly, decent guy.
In his conversations with Maggie he:
a ) suggest they make a trip to Rivet City
b ) suggest they go on a scavenger hunt for a motorcycle
c ) exhibit surprise and awkwardness when Maggie starts talking about boys and kissing Harden Simms
That's does not suggest to me any suspicious or bad parenting by Wasteland standards, hardly even by our world's standards.

Also, if he had lied about being with the traders or butchering his customers, don't you think the traders would have found out and talked to the people of Megaton about it? Something like that wouldn't stay a secret for long.

Now, he might have picked up some things from the settlement, since resources usually aren't common enough that you can afford to waste something just because the previous owners have been killed, including their clothes and shoes.
However, given what is usually left of the raider victims there probably wasn't anything usable left from Maggie's parents. Alternatively, Billy might have looted them, though I think he'd do that out of Maggie's sight, or tell her to look away.


Oh, and a note about the number of people in Megaton. They are so few because the game engine and our computers limits things, meaning they become symbolical representations as well as individuals. For a reasonable guess Rivet City, which is cited as the largest and most successful settlement in the wasteland probably have somewhere around 2000 people living in it, while Megaton probably have about 500-700.
Obviously, our computers can't handle a realistic amount of NPC's for every city and settlement (not to mention how much development resources that would take from Bethesda), so they do it another way.
Each person is someone we can talk to and such, but they also represent about two dozen (or so) other people who can't be shown, like in many strategy games. Heck, even Arefu would realistically have at least a dozen to 20 people or so. Instead we get four to six (depending on if you count the West family or not).

Yes but he did tell you the truth about not being born in the vault and about where your dad was going.

lol... your name... XD

I love the idea that people new to the game visit the forum and see this dodgy title on the first page. lulz! :lmao: "Is Billy Creel a... wha!?"


I know some nine-year-olds who would swear blind that Santa Claus drops their presents in a sack at the foot their beds, not their parents. A seven to nine-year-old, impressionable. Whatever Billy told her from the day he took her in would be what she'll likely believe. Regardless of what she actually saw, if anything, and what she remembers. Not speaking from her own experience so much as repeating what her guardian told her was true. Show me a nine-year-old and give me twenty minutes and I could probably convince him that Shigeru Myomoto is a close personal friend of the real-life Super Mario and that's where he got the idea for the game. lol Kids are dumb.


I said it was a stretch, but consider the fact that a lot paedos can be anything from school teachers to policemen... being nice isn't off the paedo agenda. They don't skulk around with hunched backs talking about peeing in peoples flower beds and kicking over garden gnomes. lol They appear perfectly normal, and in a lot of cases as perfectly normal care givers. Sometimes beyond normal, above and beyond, fantastic people to everybody including the children they abuse. Prime target would be an impressionable kid who wouldn't know any better, and who wouldn't suspect any wrong. But like I said, I don't think Creel is a paedo. :shrug: Nor do I think he'd be given custody of Maggie now, in our timeline. The fact that some people playing the game look at him and the girl he took in, and suspect anything at all... could be an indication that there is something suspect there. It's those people who usually expose the paedos, probably. Heh.


I don't think he lied about running with the traders, but you're talking about traders, and a scavenger. Billy Creel isn't a trader, he doesn't have stock. My understanding was he was a successful scavenger, he knew what the traders and settlements needed and he went out of his way to get it. I don't think Maggie's parents were his customers, I think they were some unlucky Wastelanders who found themselves the victims of a crime that would open up some easy caps and trade. The fact that they had a daughter hiding nearby wasn't part of the plan.


Yeah I know, gone are the days when the foreground was our playground and the background was a reeling city we'd never see. But still.... next you'll be saying there's an intricate infastructure and school system in every settlement, we just can't see it. Three kids wandering around a settlement all day out of sight of their parents and guardians, represent twenty kids wandering all day out of sight of their parents and guardians. There isn't one settlement in which the kids are constantly in the presence of a guardian. So does that mean there are no kids, even the ones we don't see but that those we do, representing them, are never really supervised, too?

Billy Creel and Maggie, once at home, are out of sight and mind. Moriarty makes a living from his dirty dealings, and me thinks he probably knows how to spot a mark for balckmail, and no doubt goes out of his way when the opportunity arises to confirm his suspicions, gathering info, making notes, until he can get his mark on his knees and begin the lucrative business of threatening to share what he knows, or keep it schtum for the right price. Info is power and all that.

No, Billy doesn't seem to be the type. Then again, I didn't get to know him very well. I set him on fire, stabbed him to death, looted his house, and ate him all in front of Maggie as one of my first evil acts on my (Evil) character.

Now people, off to that little town in the north in search for skeletons, do a little CSI!

Yes very much so , He shows much concern for Maggie and protects her. I think he is lonely and wanted to settle down with a daughter of some sort. I think they work great as a father and daughter idea.

Me too.

I think this thread is a little unsuitable for the age range (13+) of this forum, so I'm going to give it a lock.