I'm working on a 'little' project that I'd like to eventually release to the general public. However, I'm having a problem learning how to perform some tasks I'm sure some of you find easy.

What I'm trying to do is basically re-texture some wall/ceiling/floor segments with a more appropriate look.

I have Nifscope, Blender, and Gimp - and I know how to make the texture I want. The problem I'm having is editing the .nif to remove the debris/ruined look and extracting a uvmap that I can then edit appropriately.

If anyone has a link to a good tutorial that would show me how to work with the meshes and uvmaps, I'd be greatly appreciated. I have run several tutorials on how to use blender and seen some of the work these guys do, but for whatever reason I can't get their techniques to translate directly to my project since they are general blender and not working specifically with the GECK or editing existing /nif's.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance!

- Thraxus

Nifskope can import .nifs and export .obj or .3ds, or you can just use the Blender plugins. I suggest going through Nifskope though, because the plugins are VERY specific about what you must be running to use them (32-bit Python 2.6, 32-bit Blender 2.49b or earlier, etc) and that is a crime against humanity. If you absolutely have to use the plugins, I would see about installing two different versions of Blender, because frankly, 2.49b or earlier is ass. For ten years, Blender was pretty much "by coders, for coders". A year ago they finally started pushing 2.5+ which is a huge step forward, and one plugin is not a reason to learn an obsolete UI.

Personally, I've had issues getting animations to import into various programs but models have all come through easy as pie. I haven't actually checked the UVs, but I'm confident they won't be a problem for you.

(Edit: Correction, Nifskope doesn't export .3ds, only import. .obj should still work since all you want is the UVs, or you could go the plugin route with the caveats I mentioned)

I have the export part down np.

Basically - here is what I'm doing, and where the disconnect happens:

I'm taking a wall segment (offrmwall05b.nif) and, while trying to keep the same dimensions, editing out the destroyed bits (some ceiling, some upper wall). Next, I reconnect the vertices, reface the new parts of the wall, then go to unwrap the UVmap so I can add textures based on the new layout.

My problem comes with getting the UV map to unwrap properly so I can edit it in GIMP.

I've tried following the tutorials on this, but for some reason it just isn't working as intended.

Ah, I see. If no one else chips in, I'd recommend posting on a more blender-centric forum. Just to get some more information for anyone reading though, are you getting partial UVs, or are they all gone? Do you care at all if the UVs are the same as the old (For the parts that haven't changed) or are you making entirely new textures? I'm not personally experienced with Blender (always used other programs, my opinion about Blender should have been clear in the last post ) but hopefully someone else can point you on the right path.

Honestly, I'm game to use any program to redo these textures. I have access to the entire Autodesk Suite (student 14 month lease), so even 3Ds would be fine. The only reason I chose blender is it seems to be the most popular among the FO modder crowd.

I can get the original UV maps to show - but I'm attempting to completely redo them, with the new, undamaged walls (the damage and decay of the standard FO universe doesn't quite fit with the theme of my mod), cleanish carpet, and a strong ceiling. So, unfortunately for me, the textures are going to be completely new. What is apparently happening (I've been experimenting all night, pretty much feels like I'm hitting myself with a sledge hammer at this point) is I have no grasp, at all, on how to actually texture a mesh once I have it defined and faced. I can import a texture and unwrap my mesh to show on top of the dummy texture, but I can't get the program to actually export a UVmap that I can edit properly.

For example:

http://www.theonslaught.org/fallout/blender1.png

http://www.theonslaught.org/fallout/blender2.png

I have no defined lines =(

I know there is some fundamental instruction I'm missing, but I can't for the life of me figure out what it is.

Well if you had it in Max, I would tell you to go Modifiers -> UV Coordinates -> Unwrap UVW, which will add that modifier to your model. Then you would go to the sidebar and click "Edit" which brings up a window, where you can select Tools -> Render UVW Template, which will give you another window where you can save the template out to a proper image file. I'm sure Blender has an equivalent that's just as buried, but that should help you do some searching (or just take it into Max and do that).

While I am still looking for help with the above problem, I'll give Max a try as well. Just need to find an importer for the .nif files.

Thanks for the help! If nothing else, it's given me a good place to start.

If you already have a complete model in Blender, don't import a .nif to max. Export the finished model to Max via .obj or any other format that holds UVs. Then you can render out your UV template and get working on the texture.

Combined post below... please delete this one.

It looks like your UV's are mirrored (flipped).

Are you asking for the wire mesh of the model to be exported?...
There are two ways to the same result.
In the Image editor, you open the UV menu and choose http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj125/Gizmojunk/Clipboard03.gif. Another way is from the Scripts Panel... Choose http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj125/Gizmojunk/Clipboard06.gif.

This will export a wire frame image of the UV mesh and save it where you tell it.

I have to disagree about that... I love the UI of Blender 2.49b, and was kind of annoyed with 2.5+... [Not so much that I won't use it when its done], but once you learn the UI, its a dream to use...(even elegant).
Its quite similar (in a way) as it is to learning to use the command prompt in windows (for example); once you learn how, you can do a heck of a lot, in a very short bit of time.

There is quite a lot of truth to the notion that artists make crappy user interfaces (that look great), where as engineers often make it a bland affair that really works well once you learn it... Kind of like Vi.

I don't want to get into a whole off-topic thing here, so I'll simply have to agree to disagree. I do wonder though if you've ever used other 3d programs, because they are very much not "pretty but shallow" interfaces. They're complicated-yet-orgnaized and all generally share an internal logic that makes Blender a PITA for anyone who learned on anything else. Regardless, 2.49b is outdated and I would not suggest a new user put any additional effort into learning it instead of 2.5 because of one plugin.

(Oh, and god why are they still using that stupid 3d cursor? They stole it from what? TrueSpace, I think? There are far better ways to set manipulation centers.)

Edit: Sorry, I kind of failed at the "not getting into it" part ^^; I'm just kind of a UI nut and have used most of the common 3d art programs since ~Max 2.5, including various versions of Max, Lightwave, Maya, Motionbuilder, XSI, Modo, zBrush, Mudbox, Silo, Wings3d etc, so when I say that I've tried to use Blender's old UI and it vexes me, I don't say so lightly.

Wings3d actually has my favorite basic modeling interface of all of them. It's far from pretty but was based on Mirai, which was a bit before my time but pretty much where we got lots of our modern poly-modeling tools like edge-loops and such. Unfortunately the scripting language Wings was written in is rather slow and clunky and it lacks additional features and integration, so I stopped using it a long time ago.

Truespace hasn't got a 3d cursor, but TS and Blender both use (several) 3d icon/widgets to ease manipulation of the objects ~these are optional, and the data can be entered manually/numerically. (The 3d cursor ~in Blender, is where the next object will be created, or a point at which you can reference, say to re-center an object to the cursor).

I agree that it screws it up if you learned on something else ~but that doesn't diminish it :shrug:
(I have used Soft Image, Gmax, Rhino, and some lesser knowns, and started out on truespace around version 2 through 7.6)
*I switched to Blender because TS has no Nif Scripts version and I wanted to mod FO3.

Yeah, I know what the 3d cursor does in Blender. Like I said, I've tried to get into it. My experience with TrueSpace is much much older, so if they're not quite the same then my apologies. Still, my main problem with the 3d cursor is that it's a niche tool that they've gone and assigned to your left mouse button and if I recall, made impossible to hide. It's irrelevant to 80% of the work you'll be doing in a 3d program, and 90% of the remainder you'd be better off just using a default center for anyway either because most modeling operations are best done relative to the surface of the mesh, or just because the damn thing takes two or three clicks and several movements of the camera to get placed where you want it. It's fine to use when it has a purpose, but it shouldn't be in the way of everything I try to do.

[/rant] .-.

TS is Icon heavy (and confounds some types), Blender is the opposite (Hotkey dependent, and totally loses other types). Both modelers employ context sensitive tools that confound anyone not aware of their effects (in context).

The Blender 3d manipulators are optional and can be hidden (but I never would ~too useful :shrug:).

Figured this out on accident - but thanks for reinforcing my accident.

Now, I can export the map, properly skin it - I just need to learn how to make the object visible in FO. It looks good in blender, and shows up in Nifskope, but is invisible in game.

I'd check the shader flags (BSShaderXXXProperty) in NifSkope first; I recall other members having issues with default values out of blender. Failing that, There's always the fun time of comparing your .nif to a comparable vanilla asset, line by line.

Also, I agree on the whole 3d cursor thing. If they felt it was that important of a tool to be top-level like that, at least use a modifier key+click to manipulate it IMO. Not being too Blender savvy, is it used for anything other than where to place a new object? (now that I think about it, it would be kind of handy to use as a temporary locator node for aligning objects, but again, that's an uncommon function; not worthy of holding up left-click.)

Ensure that you enable the http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj125/Gizmojunk/nifscripts.jpg when exporting. (found in the Nif script options.) I haven't done much modding yet that doesn't require it. I know (or at least assume) that there are times when its not needed, but when its disabled, clothing and armor mods disappear.

I have not done my tile set yet... so I don't know offhand if they require the shadow map, but others here do... Someone will say.

After pretty much perfecting making the wall segments I need - I still can't figure this part out.

When I compare the original wall model to the new one, Nifskope shows a huge difference in values (25 entries in the original vs 12 in the new model - http://www.theonslaught.org/fallout/nifcompare.png

I did notice that the original uses 3 different pieces to form the whole (1 wall, 1 ceiling, 1 floor - counting for 12 of the extra entries), while mine is mapped to one object (the wall segment (floor/wall/ceiling) is one complete entity).

The steps I've taken are:

• Create the desired mesh in Blender
  
• Make the Diffuse Map
  
• Make the Normal Map
  
• Add the Alpha Channel to the Normal Map
  
• Locate them in the proper directory (data/textures/a52 - both maps are .dds)
  
• Setup the textures in Blender
  
• Export the .nif, ensuring the Shadowmap is exported as well (didn't do this at first, but made sure to do so after Gizmo's post - http://www.theonslaught.org/fallout/nifexport.png)
  
• Use Nifskope to adjust the locations of the maps
  
• Load GECK/my project
  
• Import the Wall with the same settings the original wall uses

The result is a viewport that shows a textured ground, but nothing else.

I appreciate all of the help thus far, it has been extremely beneficial - unfortunately though, it seems I still have a little ways to go.

Just to be on the safe side, I'm including a .rar of the original .nif (named .orig), the exported .nif, the .blend, and the 2 maps. http://www.theonslaught.org/fallout/a52.rar

I've since looked at the official file, and it seems that for tiles the Shadowmap is not set.

(For instance, see here that it is also not set on the http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj125/Gizmojunk/flags.jpg)

I'm fairly certain the (Blender) export leaves out a lot of key data. The problem is figuring out what that data is, and how to replace it properly.

the shadow map shader is only used on meshes that will cast shadows. which is harded coded to only be actors. If you enable that shader on anything other than creatures, body parts, outfits ect, they will not render.

Problem fixed! Using http://www.theonslaught.org/fallout/workingblenderexport.png with Blender, and only using Nifskope to change the texture file locations (and extensions), I was successfully able to import the all to the GECK. It works in game (already tested) completely - including collision and sound!

Ghogiel, thanks for the input, it helped a lot!