ok so I recently played Honest Hearts again, this time I had wanted to learn what "The Burned Man" was all about.

So, Joshua goes on to explain how he got to be where he's at.
He was originally a young man who sent out on a missionary journey, where he finds Edward and some other man. Now Edward and the other(who's name I forgot) were also missionaries and eventually team up with Joshua to spread the word of the New Caananites.

So after they group up, they decided to spread the word into the Grand Canyon?(this I'm very unsure of) Then start their missionary work with the "hostile" black foot tribe? All is good then suddenly, their fighting the black foot tribe, why? Joshua was supposed to be a translator, right, but even he didn't fully understand why they attacked(as told in Honest Hearts)

So they fight, and this is where I'm having trouble understanding what happened.
Now Edward goes on to become Caesar and form the Legion, Joshua becomes the Legate, but ultimately pisses off Caesar which is why he's set on fire and thrown into the Grand Canyon, which he survives and becomes "The Burned Man"

So I generally understand the NV version of Joshua, but my question is, how is this different from the "original" story?
Iv heard(mostly from "dinosaurs") that this story is completely wrong.... Why?

So I just wanted to see or hear the original origins of Joshua, if you have any insight on the matter I'd love to hear it(including what I got wrong about it above)

Let's keep it friendly!!

Basically Caesar was a Follower Of The Apocalypse (this is one reason why FOTA hates Caesar's Legion), and along with several other members, they went out to meet up with Joshua Graham to learn about tribal dialects. They get captured by the Blackfoot tribe, who are at war with seven other tribes. Edward/Caesar steps up and teaches the tribals how to fight like real men. They become impressed, he rises to become the tribal leader, and lo and behold the Blackfoots start kicking some major [censored]. Soon enough Caesar has an army made up of like 88 tribes (I can't remember the exact number, but it's pretty big).

For some unknown reason (at least to my knowledge), Joshua Graham decided to stick with Caesar (the other members of the FOTA were against Caesar's idea of training the tribals), and stuck around as a translator, and later to barking orders. Soon enough Joshua was leading Caesar's men, and became his right hand man; The Malpais Legate.

Cut to the First Battle of Hoover Dam (the ending of NV is the second battle), and Caesar gets his [censored] kicked. Needing someone to take the fall, and because Joshua lead the battle, Caesar had Joshua set on fire and tossed down the Grand Canyon as an example to the rest of his troops that no matter the rank, if you fail him, you will suffer for it.

For some reason instead of seeking revenge, this gave Joshua a wake up call (I forgot to tell you that he did some terrible, terrible atrocities as the Malpais Legate), and went to a life of peace and faith. Of course he wasn't completely pacifistic, as when he joined back up with the New Canaanites they were attacked by one of Caesar's tribes, and Joshua along with a few other survivors escaped to Zion National Park as a place of safe refuge (but again, Joshua wasn't all pacifistic because he knew the tribe, The White Legs, would return to finish the job).

Does that make any more sense?

The original design of Joshua Graham was 'The Hanged Man', when you found him, he would be on a gallow of some kind, hanging by his neck and still alive. If you cut him down, he would become a companion. He wronged the Legion some way (Dont recall how) and is not liked at all by the Legion, if you took him with you to some settlements he'd pick a fight and kill while quoting scripture or something. Point in short, The Hanged Man was basically what New Vegas's incarnation of Graham was when he was the Malpais Legate. If I can find the wiki for the original design, I'll link it.

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/The_Hanged_Man#Van_Buren

Very close, it was 87.


Graham saw power and decided he would aid Edward so they both gained power. He became his right hand man and the rest of the New Canaanites (there were five others) were executed.


Yes, he had to make an example. He had to show his men that failure was not an option.


I believe he wandered the wasteland until he managed to drag his way back to New Canaan. He was nursed back to health and reaccpted back into the Mormon church.

Then Caesar sent the White Legs to destroy New Canaan. Only thirty people, including a recovering Graham, escaped.

They went to Zion, Graham brought the Dead Horses (he had gone to their tribe while he was a missionary before the Legion) to Zion and then Honest Hearts starts.

Graham has to be an old man for his way of living now, he had to of been in his 20s-30s in the 2250s, that means he's in his 50s-60s.

Yes, that certainly helps. It's nice to know the full story, especially with Joshua. He is personally one of the most interesting people in NV.

Oooh, now I understand what that armor of the 87th tribe is referring to(that A-hole is hard as hell to kill)
Thanks for the info guys, but how about keeping this thread alive with all the info on The Burned Man you got.
Even if it's about the 80 something tribes....

It's nice to have threads that aren't about which Fallout is the best....