There are also Enclave sympathetic politicians within the NCR I am sure. They would be those clandestine agendas that have ideals that surface in characters like Victor Presper.

Yeah and like the U.S. and Israel, I bet the NCR hunts down Enclave soldiers who merely guarded one of the bases while doing their service for their country when they were like 18 and now 40 years later still are hunting him down just so he could be put on trial as a 58 year old into one of those NCR kangaroo courts. This is why in game I supported Caesars Legion first, I'd rather deal with idealistic, honest and brutal dictators then corrupt bureocrats who wrap themselves in the flag. Caesar would have simply killed those who opposed him and offered a chance in his army for any Enclave Personnel, a far better and fair deal. Enclave and CL are simply the best two fallout factions, if they ever teamed up against the NCR, now that would be a Fallout Game I'd look forward too.

Enclave's arm up the wazoo of NCR would be a disappointing thing.


I mean, they've been used to death. (twice, like Col. Autumn)

They would never ally with each other (although might try to manipulate the other)

Ceasr's legion meet the Enclave definition of mutants (anyone but "us") and are hardly working towards a new USA.

The Enclave are trying to restore a nation not unlike that of the Pre-Ceasar Roman replublic, Decadent and Degenerate.

The Enclave who are left are likely so jacked-up, that they can't manipulate trogs, let alone the Legion. I doubt the Legion would care to manipulate the Enclave. There's no profit or purpose, in either case.

Remnants of the Enclave must be isolated. If Chicago's cordon has survived, for all we know, these are non-militants, making a go of rebuilding America through commerce.

The Enclave didn't wipe out the NCR in 2241 because they thought they were an upstart joke, plus they wanted to sterilize the world with modified FEV from the Poseidon Energy Oil Rig anyway or sterilize the world with the BOMB orbital nuclear stations in Van Buren. When they were taken down by The Chosen One, their morale was devastated along with their infrastructure, so they had no choice but to flee the NCR or sneak into their political machine. A load caption in FONV says the latter statement. The Remnants are the last of the old Enclave guard in Mojave by 2281.

Decadent and Degenerate? Neither Caesars Legion or Enclave want a society like that. Enclave want Pre-War America (which in this timeline wasn't decadent and degenerant) and Caesars legion killed a town full of prosttutes and Crucifies drug runners. In all honesty, CL and Enclave are the least Decadent and Degenerant of all the factions. You can't say the same with NCR or Mr. House.

Lets face it. Van Buren was simply repainted and re-engined and is now named New Vegas. Everything I have ever read about Van Buren has made its ways into NV in one form or another. This isn't what I would call a bad thing by any stretch, but it is simply a matter of admittance. Most publishers (of any media) have done the same thing at least once. The christian Bible has some of the best selling copycats ever...like The Chronicles of Narnia and Starwars.

No it isnt. Hoover dam is not a city in its own right with cut off communication from NCR city. The Main questline is completely different.

It has some common concepts and ideas, but they aren't the same.

Pre War USA was degenerate and decadent by Ceasar's standards. Not only are drugs such as Mentants freely available, they're given away as prizes in automated trivia contests, amongst other things.

Mentats, I personally think are pills that help you focus and allows you to focus your mind on something. It was written down as used as recreational drugs for parties and for them giving out prizes to anyone (maybe even kids) I don't think they would be particularly harmful outside of addiction. They probably help you with memory of with forming conclusions and rationalizing things. I would have bet they would have been used for such things as breaking into locked stuff, hacking terminals, playing memory games with friends or studying for a test.

Jet and Psycho would have probably been something Caesar would have been against, since they are indeed drugs of the variety we know them. I am not sure about the history of Jet but I know Psycho was a pre-war drug experimented on troops to increase their combat effectiveness. Dangerous indeed

Also Caesar was against Prostituition, I believe pre-war America would be like the 50s, and that Prostituition and people who went to prosttutes were sickos and it was kept back alley.

I cannot remember an instance where Enclave supported or used these two things (prosttutes or Drugs) but I have not played the first 2 fallouts so I am ignorant about Pre-war America or Enclave in the west.

The NCR & the Brotherhood are both good guys but are enemies. They are both bad. The NCR is corrupt & are somewhat murderers & you can't reason with the BOS. They want your technology and they'll take it. The only good guys in the Fallout world are the east coast BOS but look what they had to go threw to finally beat the Enclave. Every-time I saw them they were getting trashed by either the mutants or the Enclave. The NCR is in better shape because they charge taxes. Its really hard being purely good in Fallout.

That is why I said "in one form another". Van Buren was cannibalized by its creators because it was a good idea (Van Buren that is). No it isn't a carbon copy but it is enough of a copy to require honesty.



The Legions beliefs are just another joke about how horribly misinformed KAI-sar (god that bothers me) is about the ancient world. The ancients were so corrupt and debauched that they destroyed their own culture. Also there is nothing anywhere that said the Enclave weren't debauched. They were already well known to be the very definition of corruption. They were a shadow government dedicated to the protection of capitalism at all costs...not the American vision of a democratic society. They are a "red-scare" joke. To this very day most people even don't know what communism is. People still think it is a form of government when in fact it is the only functional and fair form of economics. The Enclave could also be seen as the American peoples collective fear of losing an all powerful father figure to tell them what to do thereby relieving them of responsibility for their own lives.



The whole point is that there are seldom black and white moral dilemmas. The BoS was founded on the idea of keeping the technological, social, and philosophical accomplishments of man from vanishing forever. It evolved into a xenophobic sect of techno terrorists. The Legion are representative of one mans ability to sway the conquered to his own corrupt and psychotic politics and therefore has absolutely no redeeming qualities. Seriously...how hard would it be to for a tribe to simply pretend to join the legion and then turn on them in the night while everyone is sleeping. KAI-sar (grrrrrrr) wouldn't last 48 hours, guards or not. Mr. House may not be a great guy but he isn't "evil" just self centered. He really does want to protect his little domain and that kind of includes the people around him. He can't possibly have any human frailties any longer because he no longer has human needs. All human greed and corruption stem from basic instinctive drives, when you remove the need to fulfill the drive you remove the whole idea of corruption. You can't bribe a man who has no need or desire for anything you posses...know what I mean? The NCR is the most confusing of them all. It isn't founded on an evil idea so the organization isn't "bad" in and of itself. It IS expansionist, which I can't even complain about because that is what all new societies do. Individual people (soldiers, politicians, etc.) may be bad but you can't say the same for the NCR as a whole.

How are people saying the NCR are bad? They might be corrupt but where would you rather live?

In the NCR alive, with a stable life, a family and some luxuries.

In Caesars Legion, either a profligate slave, or a soldier born and raised to die for some one elses goals

Or with the Enclave where you and your family can be Dead in a Ditch because you are not "PURE"



Just trying to show how saying the Enclave are good and Caesars Legion are better than the NCR is very silly

Keep the real world politics out of the discussion, please.

Honestly?

I always like that little room that you find in the first major Metro Tunnel you go through to get into the DC Ruins. It's shockingly clean, has a workbench, a bed that actually doesn't look like a Insect Commune, a functional desk with working computer terminal and a very nice chair.

The problem with the Feral Ghoul neighbors is mitigated by the locked gate and gas exhaust "Termination System" if they get too riled.

Easy access to buildings to hunt for salvage and that nice little restaurant by the edge of the Potomac.

^^^^ Win

And it's a quiet neighborhood, too. Well, quiet is subject to interpretation, but it's still it has the advantage of being close to a lot but far enough out of the way that beyond the random explorer, you aren't going to be bothered. The locked gate (Plus the door into the room proper that can easily be rigged with a Shotgun trap or even a few Mines) and Feral Ghouls are going to discourage anyone from coming at you from one direction, and activating the Securitron in the Metro Station proper will keep the riff raff from bothering you in the other direction.

Nope corruption sickens me to the core, rather born as a Soldier to die for a ideally noble cause then live life as an NCR degenerate

Also for the Enclave you would already be technically pure you would just be endagered because 1 random guy blew up the oil rig you lived on or the military base you lived on or the crawler you lived on. With the Enclave you only really need to worry about 1 random guy.

Tell that to Arcade Gannon, his father, and his friends. The NCR sent more than just 1 random guy after him.