I agree that we have only seen the tip of the iceberg..

But the Enclave headquartered in Alabama? :tongue:

Not saying I disagree with you but it just seems like a weird place to place the brunt of the Enclave's main military force.

Must be a pretty small Iceberg then, comon' the Enclave is dead. Even I who use Enclave in like everything can admit that. Unless the Enclave change completely what they are they can never win or survive, and to be honest I don't know whether I would rather them die proud or survive in a bastardised way.

*grumble grumble*

Well, I would hate to say that they are dead...but I suppose I should clarify that I'm not expecting a huge Enclave force to suddenly appear out of nowhere and conquer the world or anything. I guess I just have believe that there are other pockets of Enclave forces out there, I mean, they are the remnants of the American Governent, and the Government today has many contigency plans for surviving a disaster like what has occured in the Fallout universe, such as COG (Continuity of Government). Indeed besides the bases that we have already seen with the Enclave (Raven Rock and the Oil Rig) there are many many other government bunkers located throughout the U.S. (Mount Weather, Offut Air Force Base, and even Camp David spring to mind) which could all be viable locations for an Enclave base (and most likely would be in use following a Nuclear War). Prehaps the majority of Enclave forces have been defeated yes, but I would think that there are more out there than just the Chicago outposts still. Even if now they have broken off from the main force or are a separatist movement.

Edit: Yeah "tip of the iceberg" was a really bad phrase to use, we have seen much more than that....bad wording on my part :spotted owl:

Enclave never had any bases outside of the Oil Rig and Navarro.

What? we know for sure of Raven Rock (yes they came in later and didn't occupy it from the start but it was still their base) as well as Adams air force base in addition to that and now with New Vegas we have heard of the Chicago Outposts, which are almost confirmed through ED-E.

Yes the Oil Rig was their main facility (and Navarro was their main base on shore) but that doesn't mean there aren't others.

Well to be fair Navarro wasn't a base but rather a pre-war Poseidon Energy oil refinery, purposfully designed to be converted into a post-way military base. Who is to say that other facilities across the US weren't designed that was, as the Enclave spread from the Oil Rig in the post war years it makes sense that they would plan before hand and have some ready made command centers and barracks ready for their arrival. Eden was apartenty a Presidential advisor to Richardson, so therefore, Raven Rock was designed to do so by the pre-war Enclave.

Its possible Enclave are in other locations, New Vegas lets us know they could be in Chicago. Just because they could be in other locations does not mean they should be. Enclave are way over done. Remnants of Enclave should be all thats left on the West coast like in New Vegas. On the East Coast there should only be remnants of remnants by that I mean the Enclave there were younger so they are the kids of Oil rig/Navarro Enclave. They were born after FO2. Since they had their shot in FO3 and lost only remnants should be left.

Having them back as a large powerful faction would just be stupid.

Right and I agree with that, after the defeats they've suffered it would be foolish to think that they will be able to reclaim the power that they had in Fallout 2 and 3 anytime soon (which is why I recanted my not-well-thought-out "tip of the iceberg" phrase). However to say that the Enclave are gone forever and are blown to smithereens everywhere is just as foolish in my mind. I mean, where is the mysterious "Enclave High Command" which was mentioned in Broken Steel or the apparent Congress that still exists in some form? Im not saying that we will see them in a game soon beyond the type of appearence seen in New Vegas (the Remnants), but simply put, an organization wth the levels of logistical, tactical, and military resources that the Enclave have been seen to possess doesn't just go away. Throughout the enitre U.S. and all the government bunkers and facilities, I highly doubt that only the Chicago Outposts remain. Most likely though, these more isolated pockets of Enclave will do what the forces on the Oil rig did for much of the time following the war, bide their time and regroup their forces, "lick their wounds" so to speak and wait till they can emerge again as prehaps a weaker and more humbled faction (and then maybe more tactically sound), but still the Enclave.

The Enclave's certainly got more strength left, but after losing their two most important bases and their entire higher command echelons twice, they have to be reeling pretty hard at this point. I'd imagine it'd be quite feasible to see them breaking up into separate regional groups at this point.

Pfftt... I don't need no back up! I got the developers on my side!

......or do you? : :stare:

*James Bond music plays* :ninja:

If I were to have a major Enclave presence in my mod (a resurgence, having them come back for certain reasons), what would be the "most canon" place I could say they came from? Could I use Chicago as a potential launching point? Or would it be better to make something up that is closer to the DC area? The idea would be that a large force was coming back into the DC area to not only find out what happened to Raven Rock, but with another larger strategic goal in mind.

Thanks!

Miax

Probably Chicago then, you could say that sometime after Raven Rock was destroyed they were ordered to return from the command at Adams Airforce Base.

Cool, I was hoping that it wouldn't be too far a stretch to talk about Chicago, I'll be intentionally vague.

Cheers,

Miax

I dunno the US government has lines of succession the thing is why I think Alabama is one of the Enclave homes is the fact of the larger Enclave Presence there in DC heck the enclave still has the Pacific fleet under there command. Now I think in future Fallout Games maybe the new Enclave Adminstration will take a more Col. Autumn way of thinking. Also why I thought the Enclave is in Alabama is for the fact that we have alot of NASA projects here I Don't Think the Crawler came from Cape Canaverial there is some water stoping you...just sayin

But also The Enclave High Command that is true we dont see one General in Fallout 3 they assigned a Regiment to take DC and the Crawler was there to renforce them with back up also the VP and President are mainly never together.