Much of modern fantasy traces its inspiration back to Tolkien, the 'father of fantasy' (or whatever). I'm not a huge fan of LotR, but I watched the movies when they came out on VHS back in '01-'03. Never paid much attention, then I start playing Morrowind, Oblivion, and Skyrim in the past 4-5 years and got into their kind of fantasy world.

Then all this 'The Hobbit' stuff and people renting out all the LotR movies at the movie store, playing Battle for Middle-earth II, etc... it made me get interested in it again. I started comparing the two series.

In LotR, it's pretty basic: Good VS Evil. Orcs, Goblins and Trolls, VS Humans, Elves, and Dwarves. TES... it's not necessarily 'good vs evil', though exceptions could be made. But the Orcs are 'civilized', their are no goblins (unless you consider the Falmer golbins), and Trolls are not at all the same kind of Trolls in LotR. Dwarves are different from most modern fantasy Dwarves, Elves don't look anything like other fantasy elves (except the Dark Elves, who look like other Dark Elves). Some of the biggest conflicts have been Humans VS Elves.

What would you think if TES was more LotR-fantasy as compared to now? As in, Orsimer are evil and are the antagonists (along with goblins and trolls), Dwemer exist but were not technologically advanced, only one kind of Elf (light-skinned archery-based), etc.

I'm not saying a complete rip-off. But I understand TES is unique in that it has its own world, a lot of depth involved and a lot of lore behind it. It's 'original' in a way. Not criticizing it, just wondering your thoughts.

I think these forums would self-destruct.

I think Dungeons-and-Dragons (and, by extension, the Elder Scrolls) derive almost as much from the work of Robert E. Howard as they do Tolkien. The conception of a lone adventurer embarking with deliberate intention to go on an adventure, of parties questing for power or loot or just because they crave "high adventure" comes from Howard, not Tolkien.

A quest in Tolkien is an event that is usually thrust upon an unwilling, ordinary person, who agrees to go reluctantly. When a character in Tolkien deliberately seeks adventure it always brings disaster to everyone around him.

I would say the world of the Elder Scrolls (Orcs, humanoid Elves, ect) comes from Tolkien. The spirit of adventure that is the backbone of roleplaying video games comes from Howard.

What one has to understand is that Tolkien was a deeply religious man (not trying to start any sort of debate here) and he wrote all his works from his religious perspective. Thus, he made sure there was a very clear distinction between good and evil and no "grey" areas (though there are struggles of good vs evil in characters, but again the good and evil sides are very distinct). He also made sure good wins in the end. Now while Tolkien is my favorite fantasy author, and his works by far top TES fantasy in terms of depth, scale and sheer epic-ness (not a word but whatever), I don't think his formula would work well in a TES setting. TES lore gets much of it's charm from it's grittiness and that there's no absolute morality in it. It's nice in it's own way but TES is not Tolkien and vica versa and the two should not be mixed. It would be like trying to force the Tolkien "formula" on Game of Thrones.

@Pseron: Well I was really just saying Tolkien was more Orcs VS Humans, with Elves and Dwarves thrown into the mix and such.