Hello all,

I'm working on a new version of SDR that will have a completely new method for sneak skill advancement when skulking around.

In order for it to work, I have to nullify the sneak skill use amount of the default system ( bad things happen if I don't ).

My concern is that SDR will turn it off, and then another mod will come along and turn it back on again, whether by hardcoding the skill or through a scripted command like this:

SetSkillUseIncrement 1 sneak 0

If anyone is aware of a mod that might do this, please let me know so that I can figure out a patch for it.

Thanks!

Well, Fundament for starters. But you can easily send an instruction to ensure the skill use increment remains at 0 using RunScriptLine

set fd.Use to sv_Construct "31" ;this is the sneak skill codeset fd.Mult to 0 ;multiplies any use value by 0setstage fd 1

Other than that, I don't think many mods alter the increment rates of skills at game time through scripts.

Check out Tejon's Fundament, which has a unique method for taking account of values and making sure the right ones get used at the end. Mgick is your go-to guru for how it works. Fundament also has a way of ensuring that its scripts run first.

What I'm thinking is maybe you can actually use Fundament to achieve what you're looking to do, but of course maybe you can also learn from its methods.

EDIT: Ninja'd by the go-to man himself!

Heh. Thanks guys.

I can't use Fundament for what I'm doing.

With Oblivion's default system, it's all or nothing. If you are detected by just one person you get nothing, even if everyone else doesn't notice you at all. It's particularly annoying if you have a follower/companion with you while sneaking because then you will never increase in skill. In addition, there is no adjustment for distance, which I thought was always odd since it's much harder to sneak around someone in close range than at a distance.

I'm providing an alternative that increases the sneak skill at a much lesser amount (1/10), but it's adjusted by distance, and applies to everything that can't detect you within the max skillup range. It also (optionally) ignores detection values for followers, so you can't get any points from them if they are following you around but can't technically detect you for various possible reasons.

For example:

You and your companion are in an area where there are 5 NPCs

3 detect you, the other two don't, and your companion is ignored for the purposes of calculating Sneak skill improvements.

Of the two, one is within short skillup range, the other is in long skillup range.

You'll get full points from the NPC that is within short range, but only 25% for the one that is within long range.

Huh. Have you looked at Oblivion XP? That one surely shuts off the use amounts, right?

I'm just whistling in the dark, though. You two are the professionals.

In the Fundament - Skill Rates.ini I have, it uses fd.Value, not fd.Mult. Which one is correct?

EDIT: Never mind. I found the documentation that references it.

I don't think Oblivion XP stops the skill use improvements, but it does stop applying skill improvements towards leveling.

Hm? Unless I'm mistunderstanding something here completely, it removes all skill ups from sneak, you can sneak for however long you wish, it won't give you any experience or sneak skill level ups, it will remain static until you put points in it at level up.

Unless that is what you mean by "skill improvements towards leveling" <.<

I could very well be wrong about it. It's been awhile since I've looked at Oblivion XP, but my recollection was that the XP only went towards leveling and putting points into attributes, not skills. I will have to take a look.

EDIT:
Took a look. Yup. You are correct. And based on the description, I'll just turn off the alternate leveling system if XP is installed.

XP is used to raise skills also. Nothing is raised by use.

You don't need to, I was suggesting sending those commands through RunScriptLine if Fundament.esm is loaded, so that you don't have to make the mod dependant on Fundament.

Also, your concern is about other mods turning sneak skill advancement back on after you've turned it off, right? As I've said, other than Fundament and Progress which was superseded by it, which only change the rates if you tell it to, and Oblivion XP which sets them all to 0 as well anyways, I don't really know any. I can't think of other mods needing to alter the skill advancement rates in general, nor sneak in particular, through scripted operations in game. Non-obse mods that alter them directly like OOO do so by editing the skill directly in the CS, and those changes are simply overwritten by any scripted changes while in game.

I hate the new quoting system.

Yeah, I think I'm good. Pretty much anything outside of an overhaul that messes with that is probably going to be in direct conflict with SDR in more ways than one. And since SDR's esm will be loaded last on the list, I'm not too worried about any other core .esm that alters the values.

Thanks for the tips and response folks! I'm chompin' at the bit to get a beta released before I leave for vacation on Tuesday.

See what I did there?