A while back MK posted this:

The list of Shezarrines. One thing came across as odd, however: It mentions Ysmir. The Ysmir he is presumably referring to is the Ysmir in the 36 Lessons of Vivec, but we run into a couple problems with this. Our recent discussions on the topic of what Ysmir is reached the conclusion that Ysmir was a title, not a person. Wasn't it also argued that the Ysmir of the 36 Lessons was probably Wulfharth? If true, that would mean Wulfharth was mentioned twice.

Either some other Ysmir is a Shezarrine, or Wulfharth is somehow a Shezarrine twice over. Sounds important.

It strikes me as odd that a title would be included among the list of Shezarrines. All the other characters are names.

Notice in the 36 Lessons that the reference to Ysmir mentions that he is always a bearded king. I think Vivec was referring to all of them throughout history. And then proceeded to speak on Wulfharth's feats specifically.

Indeed it is strange. But PGE1 implies that the Ysmir title was traditionally used even before Tiber Septim took it, so maybe it refers to all Ysmirs in general.

Maybe. If so, that has interesting implications. Here's the passage in question.

I think you're right. It says "Always appears", not "always appeared". I also think that the "great bearded king" isn't literal. If it refers to every Ysmir, then it can't be literal. We know of one Ysmir that isn't certain to be a literal great bearded king: The Last Dragonborn. I think that the "great bearded king" part refers to a powerful being whose legend is associated with Skyrim or the Nords.

Speaking of The Last Dragonborn, could this be semi-conclusive evidence that he is a Shezarrine? There doesn't really seem to be much point to including a title as a Shezarrine unless you don't know the character's name.

Why is Talos and Septim separate? Why are they considered a separate Shezzarine when Septim is "people"?

I thought about that, too. Could be evidence that Hjalti taking the name Tiber Septim is like the creation of an entirely new person.

One is Hjalharthin Arctus Early-Wulf LoL. The other is Martin.

Tiber is an amalgamation, not one person. Hjalti played him for the most part of his life, but feats by both Zurin and Wulfharth (and others) are attributed to him.

I suppose that Tiber Septim is kinda the mortal three-in-one, while Talos is the divine three-in-one? Does that make sense?

I always thought "Septim" referred to Martin..

I do like the idea of Septim being a Shezzarine, because I love Martin. I'm just not sure there is enough to support it. I mean.. I guess he was Dragonborn and did become Akatosh.. who is Lorkhan.

It's just that the list is fully comprised of the people of Talos if Ysmir is Wulfharth or.. a Wulfharth, and I'm not sure Martin fits there.

Tiber Septim's Sword-Meeting With Cyrus The Restless implies otherwise. I actually liked his character quite a bit. My take on it is that pre-Talos ascension, Hjalti, Zurin, and Wulfarth were seen as different people. The creation of the 9th Divine muddied this by remaking history to fit Tiber's story. Or it could have been Tiber CHIMing it that way.

I think Martin doesn't fit for different reason. He was distinctly connected to Akatosh, not Lorkhan. Yes, yes, Akatosh is Lorkhan, but I've always been under the impression that Shezarrines are closer to the Lorkhan part than the Akatosh part.

Yeah I was always under the assumption that Martin was in Akatosh's role and the Champion was a Shezzarine (Pelinal written all over that guy). However.. the more I think about it, the more I see them as just the same thing almost entirely.

Do we know which Tiber Septim met with Cyrus?

At risk of overusing the trope, do we know Ysmir Wulfharth was the the same all along, like how Ysgramor is therorised to be multiple people, could Wulfharth be the same?

or.. is Ysgramor a collection of Ysmirs? ->