How about you log into your PTS account on the PTS forum, make a post, and I will reply. If not, you are simply clueless and a troll. The post in question I quoted from is called "Magical Melee Abilities" on the PTS forum, which I have access to, as a PTS player.

You are a troll with no information who can't even source where what you claim is even true, and when shown you are wrong you use ad-hominem attacks. You lose.

Woah now, insults ain't getting anyone nowhere

So basically, if we included a gladiator line, a thieves guild line, that only involved stamina would that be satisfactory? Or how many other guilds/specializations that add stamina only abilities?

I'd like to refactor your concern so that we decouple it from any other things; is your concern that as of right now there essentially aren't enough stamina based abilities? Or that classes must necessarily have stamina based abilities?

If it's the latter, then why is it an absolute necessity? So long as you cover all play styles and have a good meta it shouldn't matter if all the stamina based abilities are outside of the class (and they really should be as to loosen the class restrictions).

If that's correct I do. If it's not you're just a troll.

C'mon, convert! Or at least let's agree that the AD is the worst of the three alliances and should be the first to burn.

Context.

I told him he was wrong. He asked me for a source. I posted a quote from the PTS servers. He said my quote is made up and I'm a troll. Clearly that makes HIM the troll, as he is starting an argument and then as soon as someone with actual gameplay knowledge posts he uses ad-hominems. Troll.

I joined this topic totally agreeing with the OP. After reading some posts and doing some thinking of my own (Yes, I can do that!), I changed idea, I think it's pretty fine (or close to fine) as it is.

...

But now it seems to have turned into an insult party.

Can we go back to civilized discussion, please?

My context, due to my lack of PTS access my entire argument must be invalid because reasons.

He made up something to get me to quote him, saw that I was ignoring his PTS post and is now trolling really hard. I give him credit for how in deep he is though, again if your source isn't made up we are all winners. But after going to a few streams and asking around it appears sadly it isn't.

Please guys, stop it right there. It doesn't matter who did what for what reason. You are both ruining this thread if you don't stop this fight.

I'd log in and test it but my character is a Templar, so quite impossible, I'll ask my DK friend to look at numbers. Spell penetration does not effect many "magicka" class skills though, I know that for a fact.