Question about the daedric princes

Post » Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:58 pm

Can the daedric princes interact with Nirn directly ?

They mostly seem to resort to sending servants like dremoras to do their will in Nirn as well as introducing items into the world to entice and torment mortals with. They don't seem to be able to do things directly, like destroying mortals who oppose them or burning cities to prove their might. Why don't they always send minions when they want something done, and instead rely on mortals to do their work for them (ex: Meridia in Skyrim asking the player to clear the necromancer from her temple) ?

Although both Sheogorath (mostly) and Azura seem to be have been able in the past to interfere directly in the world of Nirn.

The daedric princes seem to be unable to act directly even within their own realms, and are also oblivious to mortals interfering in their own domain.

User avatar
koumba
 
Posts: 3394
Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2007 8:39 pm

Post » Tue Mar 11, 2014 12:23 pm

One thing to remember is that the daedra are not gods. They are simply rulers in their own dimensions. They ask mortals to do their bidding for their own reasons mostly. They are prevented from taking any direct action because of the wards that seperate their dimension from ours. Yes they are vastly powerful, and yes they toy with people for their own benefit, but so do the Q, and they are definitely not gods.

User avatar
xemmybx
 
Posts: 3372
Joined: Thu Jun 22, 2006 2:01 pm

Post » Tue Mar 11, 2014 1:16 pm

In Oblivion Mehrunes Dagon was able to go to Nirn due to the Dragon Fires not being lit.

If i recall correctly, the Dragon Fires are not lit now, we have no emperor who is Dragonborn (which is needed in order to wear the Amulet of Kings).

There was a book i read, in i want to say Skyrim but im not sure, that stated that the Aedra represent stasis and therefore the Deadra represent change, for the Deadra are immortal and cannot create, only change what is already there (not sure how each created their own realm, but im sure someone might know).

I am also not entirely sure what you really ask, for the Deadric Princes interfere with men and mer, yet as far as i know never really changed the appearance of Nirn itself (unless you count the moon sheogorath threw at Vivec city).

oh, almost forgot. Let's not forget Molag Bal is trying to pull Nirn (or just Tamriel?) toward his own little plain of Oblivion, so yea, quite the interference if you ask me :happy:

AH UNFAIR THIS BE MOVED FROM TESO FORUM!!!!

User avatar
Kim Bradley
 
Posts: 3427
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2007 6:00 am

Post » Tue Mar 11, 2014 1:16 am

All daedric princes have a different amount of power. It does semm to require of them a lot of power to be able to interract directly in Nirn. Mehrunes Dagon was able to travel to Tamriel during the Oblivion Crysis. But there also seems to be forces opposing their entry into Nirn (Aedra?).

And some of them just enjoy having mortals serving them because it's a way for them to tell the gods "You created them, yet they prefer to venerate us! Ha!"

User avatar
Angel Torres
 
Posts: 3553
Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 7:08 am

Post » Tue Mar 11, 2014 5:21 am

Yet Sheogorath changed a woman into a musical instrument and Azura changed the dunmer skin to grey and eyes to red. That looks like directly acting on Nirn.

User avatar
Marguerite Dabrin
 
Posts: 3546
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2007 11:33 am

Post » Tue Mar 11, 2014 1:16 pm

Arent the dragon fires destroyed? I thought that now the daedra can never go to nirn now due to akatosh kicking Mehrunes Dagon's Ass?(well not literally due to that, but like tied to that).

User avatar
krystal sowten
 
Posts: 3367
Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2007 6:25 pm

Post » Tue Mar 11, 2014 8:00 am

But kind sir, we can't possibly know that, that's 1000 years into the future :ohmy:

and not entirely correct. Martin's change into the avatar of Akatosh made it so that the Dragon fires were unneeded. The boundary is now up forever.

User avatar
kennedy
 
Posts: 3299
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2006 1:53 am

Post » Tue Mar 11, 2014 2:05 pm

I've read another book, and I'm quite sure the daedra can create. They created their realms, after all. The difference is that the Aedra gave a part of themselves when they created Nirn, while the Daedra laughed at this very idea and created their realm without any sacrifice, mostly just to laugh at the gods.

User avatar
IsAiah AkA figgy
 
Posts: 3398
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 7:43 am

Post » Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:30 pm

Oh right... Well since the thread is in the lore forums I thought that he was talking about Skyrim.

User avatar
Michael Russ
 
Posts: 3380
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2007 3:33 am

Post » Tue Mar 11, 2014 6:45 am

the daedric princes can't interact directly with Nirn because of the covenant of Saint Alessia with Akatosh, wich is part of the lore and mainquest of TESO, no dragonborn Emperor on the ruby throne to lit the dragonfires and so Nirn is unprotected from Oblivion and Molag Bal use this oportunity to launch an invasion in Nirn to join it with his realm of Coldharbor, like Mehrunes Dagon does in TESIV invading Nirn using his oblivion gates after the death of the last Dragonborn Emperor, Uriel Septim VII

“Akatosh made a covenant with Alessia in those days so long ago. He gathered the tangled skeins of Oblivion, and knit them fast with the bloody sinews of his Heart, and gave them to Alessia, saying, ‘This shall be my token to you, that so long as your blood and oath hold true, yet so shall my blood and oath be true to you. This token shall be the Amulet of Kings, and the Covenant shall be made between us, for I am the King of Spirits, and you are the Queen of Mortals. As you shall stand witness for all Mortal Flesh, so shall I stand witness for all Immortal Spirits.’

And Akatosh drew from his briast a burning handful of his Heart’s blood, and he gave it into Alessia’s hand, saying, ‘This shall also be a token to you of our joined blood and pledged faith. So long as you and your descendants shall wear the Amulet of Kings, then shall this dragonfire burn — an eternal flame — as a sign to all men and gods of our faithfulness. So long as the dragonfires shall burn, to you, and to all generations, I swear that my Heart’s blood shall hold fast the Gates of Oblivion.

So long as the Blood of the Dragon runs strong in her rulers, the glory of the Empire shall extend in unbroken years. But should the dragonfires fail, and should no heir of our joined blood wear the Amulet of Kings, then shall the Empire descend into darkness, and the Demon Lords of Misrule shall govern the land.’”

User avatar
Ross Thomas
 
Posts: 3371
Joined: Sat Jul 21, 2007 12:06 am

Post » Tue Mar 11, 2014 2:34 pm

When questions are answered, only a fool would not come up with new questions.

So have you got any idea in what way the Deadric Princes can interact with Nirn? Do they simply interact with men and mer, or also with the plain itself?

We know that Azura cursed the Chimer into Dunmer. This must have happened before the Dragon fires were lit right? or do the Dragon fires simply prevent the Princes to interfere in the plain?

User avatar
suniti
 
Posts: 3176
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2006 4:22 pm

Post » Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:32 pm

It's complex, and this question is probably better put to the lore forum.

The relatively simple explanation is that the princes and their realms are essentially one and the same. When a mortal perceives or interacts with a daedric prince (or an aedric divine, which are the same things in essence), they're interacting with one specific interpretation of the sphere, which encompasses every possible interpretation of that sphere - this is why the various cultural interpretations are all equally valid even though they may seem contradictory at times. At the same time, these abstracts given sentience can't ever change their own natures.

Nirn, by contrast, involves finite limitations, self-contradictions, changing natures, and so on - it's a pretty alien place, and their interactions with it (and its creatures) are limited by those very things. This doesn't stop the occasional meddling, but it tends to be something that comes from the mortals themselves, whether by invitation or inspiration. It's also worth bearing in mind that the only real distinction between the daedric princes and the aedric divines is that the aedra were "killed" (whatever motive you ascribe to the act) to give the world form, while the daedra retained their separateness. While the occasional tinkering within the context of their spheres fits into that, if they'd been inclined to be a constant part of the world's nature then they'd have ended up as aedra to begin with.
User avatar
Big mike
 
Posts: 3423
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 6:38 pm


Return to The Elder Scrolls Series Discussion