I'm thinking about the end game content and the direction ZOS has mentioned regarding the matter.
Currently it seems like TESO won't have super difficult fights, obviously because they want everyone to see the game they've made (and to keep people playing as much as possible; cha-ching). This leads to mobs and bosses having more HP and dealing more damage instead, to give those with the best gear possible some sort of challange (basically longer fights).
As new content is released, ZOS will be forced to release better gear aswell in order to give people an incentive to actually do the content and satisfy the players in the long run. To counter players being overpowered for the newly released content, they will have to increase the mobs and bosses HP and damage even further.
And so it goes, by time mobs and bosses HP and damage will have scaled to ridiculous amounts (looking at you WoW).. but here's what Blizzard did in Wrath of the Lich King, they introduced the Hard Mode/Normal Mode setting. It's basically the same content, almost the same boss mechanics but with a few twists where they deal more damage, it's a bit more chaotic, it's more difficult overall. But it satisfied both the hardcoe raiders and the more casual raiders (to some extent atleast). Everyone got to see the content and for those that want more challanges (instead of just longer fights) they could do the Hard Modes, rewarded with somewhat better gear than the Normal Mode.

So how do you think/hope it will play out in the future for TESO?
Will we see scaling so insane that 1% will have such a huge effect that ones racial choice is imperative?
Will we see content that not everyone has a chance to see, simply because the fights are too difficult for some people?
Or will ZOS implement something along the lines of Hard Mode/Normal Mode?
Or, will they simply increase the level cap with every newly released content patch?

Edit: seems I have to add "what do you think?" so people don't think these are the only options available.

I don't think that Bethesda/Zenimax want super ultra difficult fights in ESO. The whole idea here is to create a game that everyone can see all of, not artificially lock a large % out of because of obnoxiously difficult encounters. I realize some people thrive off that sort of thing but personally I don't see them taking the game in that direction.

If you are looking for a serious challenge, one that isn't scripted like PvE encounters, I would suggest heading to Cyrodiil

if they made it like WOW raid encounters i would quit playing like i did with WoW.

I hope zeni can be original and come up with some new ideas when we are max level , treasure hunts that spawn loot and monsters ! (like in UO) Housing and loot drops that have things to do with housing, or heck a new crafting trade ! .

there 2 ideas....... off the top of my head , and im no game designer

Group content already seems to be very lazy by design.

The 4man dungeons all have the same thashmob -> boss -> thrashmob -> boss layout.

And bosses look quite unimaginative, having huge amounts of hp and some silly special attack mechanics that seem to be thesame as in every other game.

So it will probably appeal to the people who are used to do dungeon and raid grinds.

I couldn't care less if that content has a powercreep to keep people busy

I'm guessing they will just increase the VR ranks whenever new open world areas are unlocked.

I honestly won't be doing all the dungeon and adventure zone stuff.

It's just the same silly choreographed stuff like in every other mmo.

I think the fights will already be more difficult after API information was limited. Basically all the PTS players were playing with addons that show the mobs actions and when to block or interrupt.

The game gives this information out by indicating such skills being casted, but without the add-on it will be much harder to see due to the spell effects on your screen that might block a clear visual indication.

Let's see how difficulty adjusts with the API limitation. Especially tanks jobs will be harder, since there is no visual indication for many important skills apart from when it's already ,too late' (e.g. taunt, deep slash).

Yeah, that's what worries me. I'm in no way a pvp geek, I'm a pve idiot.. pvp can be fun, in short bursts, but in the long run it doesn't satisfy me at all. Which is my concern; the pve end game aspect.

I never liked the Hard Mode / Normal Mode myself. I've always been the type of player that actually want some stuff to be exclusive to some people, it gives me an incentive to actually make my character better and better.
The loot from those treasures and monsters goes in same line as "mobs and boss hp/dmg output". Housing doesn't satisfy me enough to keep me happy in the long run pve-wise.. it's cool for a day or two, then I forget about it. And it's a one time thing, not a long term solution really.

Yeah, the VR seems to be the "difficulty levels" one chose to play, much like Hard Mode / Normal Mode. But, that's essentially the same thing as in Diablo 3 (for an example) which.. has no end game what so ever, because you don't get to see anything new, it's just the same old same old and you do it because you want your character to be stronger, to raise the level, to get stronger without no real feeling of purpose. And I'd hate the same thing happening in TESO, because most (pve oriented) people will quit pretty soon after they hit lvl 50 if they do.

What do you want to achieve with this thread? We don't know about the challenges of PvE regarding the raids. There is not enough information out there to have a real discussion. You have to realise that everything you concluded is based on speculation and assumption on your part. Can be true, but must not be.

I don't know what you mean by "super difficult fights", so I can't speak to how you know it is not in the game.

If you want to get a glimpse of what may wait in the 4man dungeons other than the starter three that most testers have seen, you can find stuff on Youtube. Some of the content there seems to be quite challenging until you figured it out.

Veteran Ranks are not comparable to hardmode/normal mode, by the way.

And I strongly resent your statement that "most pve oriented people" will quit. If you're that gifted with a crystal ball send me the next lotto numbers, please.

And I hate to break it to you, but you will not get a "feeling of purpose" in PvE content, since right next to your character there will be plenty of other chosen ones who all think they're about to save the world. And if you leave the dungeon/adventure zone/quest area with the smile of purpose and success, there will be a very long line of people just like you waiting to re-do what you just accomplished. Because it did not change anything.

Now imagine Molag Bal with the voice of a Cylon Hybrid: It all happened before and will happen again.

If you want real dynamics: Come visit Cyrodiil

As said before we don't have the information on AZs to form any type of educated opinion. Ask this again in a couple of weeks.

Not again ... D:

Tell me, how should be a Dungeon made ? running a floor and opening lootchest with Randoms mobs that sometimes appear and sometimes not??

First of all they shouldn't be exactly the same on every run.

Make each dungeon layout somewhat randomized.

If it's not within the game engines capabilities, make several different map layouts that are chosen randomly.

They don't have to be complete remakes.

A dungeon could be in some sort of mine, certain paths could have collapsed in one map where you need to take another route to get somewhere.

A dungeon in a keep or fort could have barricaded gates closing off paths leading to a new map layout.

They could add more randomized mobs and boss selection.

Why always the same bosses and mobs over and over again?

They can add puzzles that aren't always the same and where you actually need to think.

Add some uncertainly like ambushes and traps.

Every time you start a dungeon it should be a new adventure.

Sure there are limits to it and you won't get 100 unique runs, but having atleast a dozen or so variations would go a long way.

Atm there is no replay value for dungeons, you do them once and the next times you do them it's just a grind.

They are also way too easy to be just wiki'ed and completely planned out from the start.

There's nothing exciting, just thesame thing over and over again.

I want people to come up with reasonable speculative answers to what they believe will happen, I want to know the possabilities.
"Super difficult fights" as in where only a "handful" of people will accomplish to progress even further. And I know it's not in the game, because of what's been shown, what I've seen in the betas and from what ZOS have stated themselves regarding bosses.
I know VR aren't the same thing, but VR ranks (like hard mode/normal mode) are different difficulty levels, so they are comparable.. also like in Diablo 3 where you have 10 different difficulty levels once you reach max level with your character.

Most people will, maybe you won't, but most people have done so in other games where end game have been about to just do the same thing over and over again without any diversity of gameplay; new mechanics, loot, areas, skills etc. anything that's giving you a new experience (apart from just dealing/taking more damage). No, it's not a fact that people will leave, nothing is never a fact when predicting the future of anything (if you wanna take that stance), but the chances are very likely that people will.
I hate to break it to you, but on a competative level of raiding there's plenty of purpose

It's not really a question regarding facts, I want speculative answers to what Might come. Theoretical answers basically and what would be the best way to go about this topic of scaling.

One of the great things about my old AD&D days: you never knew what was coming around the next bend, and the very real chance that whatever-it-was could wipe the floor with you. Of course, I also had an incredible DM. Wouldn't surprise me to learn he is a writer or designer somewhere.

Speculation I can give you

I believe the AZ will be similar to the Plane of Fear in the original EQ. A large zone comprised of group content ranging in difficulty, no solo content at all. Inside this large zone will be instance dungeons tuned for 12 man content.

As far as difficulty goes I believe it will be where only people on top of their game will do the top end instances, so there will be a type of progression.

I really hope that's the case, but I doubt it. That would make the content exclusive to only "a few" people who are skilled enough.. but here's to hope, cheers!

I know quite a lot of people who'd be upset with not being able to experience everything, which is the reason for WoW's normal/hard mode content.. after all, people are people and I really doubt the TESO crowd being that much different when it comes to progression.