I hope there has been changes so it's not so darn easy to be wealthy in FO4. It would also be nice to have a "realistic" economy with dynamic price, supply, and demand changes. I am not a programmer and have no clue as if this is even possible currently. An example would be rain, which we now have, rain brings radiation and so in turn the cost of rad-away and rad-x should increase. Another scenario, your settlements bring in to many 10mm pistols which decreases the prices of all 10mm pistols until the supply drops.

I know this is asking a lot, and I doubt we will get it in FO4, but a vault-boy can dream

In FoNV I cheat. I "player.forceav barter 1" to make sure my barter stays at 1. I reduce my strength to carry weight ratio in http://www.nexusmods.com/newvegas/mods/40040/?, and make sure that ammo/food spawns are low. I don't take armor off enemies I kill. I take the trait http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Built_to_Destroy so my weapons degrade faster. I rarely repair things myself, always pay npcs to repair them... and dispite all this by the time I make it to the strip I'm loaded.

I blame counterfieters flooding the market with fake caps, or new caps.

Well if all else fails, I'm sure someone will mod it in. Pretty sure we got some complex marketing system mod for Skyrim, so one in Fallout 4 is sure to happen.

Of course some players like being able to get rich so this should be optional. With that said..

The real issue is that NPCs do not really have any needs. They don't buy anything from each other, they don't really use up food, they don't really use up supplies, they don't make any purchases, etc. Since there is no action on the market except what the player brings there is no responsiveness in the economy.

Most games (that are not turn based simulations) have this problem.

What might be possible is to have a running simulation in the background that updates once a game day or so. When you talk to a merchant a check is made to alter prices and stock based on that simulation. NPCs would never go anywhere in-game and they still would not really have needs, but within the simulation their stock/prices could be adjusted according to what is going on.

Adjustments could be tied into the game world based on quests completed, ongoing conflicts, perks, or factions pleased/hated. Merchants would need to say things like "Slow Town keeps getting hit by raiders. They bought up all the 9mm ammo." so the player could have some idea of how they could affect the supply of that ammo (go to Slow Town and wipe the raiders).

That would bring a little more responsiveness and interest to the economy without having to give individual NPCs a "need".

A player could still get pretty wealthy off this system though. In Fallout it is trivial to travel from one place to another - you effectively teleport there for free. It would be easy to find out some area needed 9mm ammo, get a bunch of it from elsewhere, and then sell it for 4x normal price.

To resolve this fast travel would have to have some cost associated with it.

The thing about all of this is that I'm not sure if it's "fun". It seems like it might be though. It definitely seems like a meta-game that could be implemented more or less within a mod if they didn't do something inside the game by default already.

Since you can build a "town" in Fallout 4 and your town has trading lines I am hoping they also implemented some kind of basic economy setup. Probably not anything quite as complex as I described, but...

Like you said, Vault Boy dreams.

I think the real problem is that by the time we amass that wealth, there isn't anything we want to spend it on. Daggerfall actually had the most interesting economy I've played with in an RPG; you eventually reach a point where you amass hundreds of thousands of gold pieces, but it costs about that much just to purchase a house, summon Daedric princes for artifact quests, or get a custom enchanted item made. Enchanted items disappeared after they ran out of charges, and since gold had weight you actually had to start using banks to manage your wealth. And you could take out loans from the banks, too.

Of course, I'm not so sure how that would translate to the Fallout universe. Maybe you need to spend/make caps to maintain your settlements at a certain point?

You have strange concerns - I like being wealthy (I don't play a game to work my butt of for some cash to buy equipment with and the PC is supposedly someone special, too so why shouldn't he/she be able to make cash like crazy (all successful people do after all!))

greetings LAX

That's possible. The settlements you make could add substantial economic drain to the player (assuming they choose to make a settlement). I noticed in one of the videos that settlements seemed to have morale, as well as a need for food, water, and power. Maybe some of the settlement updates or supplies cost caps.

I know damn me for wanting a deeper game experience

when they first started showing Skyrim they mentioned a deeper economy system(which then didn't make an appearance probably due to hardware constraints)so it wouldn't be to far out for them to institute that system (assuming they didn't already max the hardware with everything else )

It isn't easy to be rich in BGS games if you play good alignment. Heck, it isn't easy to even be decently well off. Not unless perhaps you play with default/vanilla time scale and respawn so that you are burning through days like crazy and constantly fighting random spawns. Most players on PC change this to be much slower and more immersive.

The problem with economies in BGS games is that they are completely messed up as far as supply and demand, plus the only way to really make decent money is to constantly fight and sell off stuff. This makes no sense in the world context because vendors have stuff that costs far more than any average person in the game ever makes, and sometimes this is even stressed by NPC dialogue.

Hopefully, the new crafting system will enable a decent economy that actually works in the game world, including allowing the PC to be independent and self-supporting about equipping themselves as they wish for roleplaying purposes (and not taking half of the character development time in order to do so).

Anything but the system Skyrim had. I want it so I actually have to contribute to the market instead of just selling my stuff over and over.. Like I want to be forced to buy stuff really!

part of it is the problem they have with there "Radiant AI" that they were still trying to get to work in game give me a bit

linky 1

http://venturebeat.com/2010/12/17/dimming-the-radiant-ai-in-oblivion/

Like I said in the other thread, I just hope I won't have to shell out 2000 caps for a assault rifle.

Not only should the price scale across weapons be narrower (100-1500, for example, rather than the 12-12000), I would also like if the prices themselves had a little more variance for more organic trading. Extremely unlikely, of course. But it would be nice to come across a weapons merchant who has no idea how to value broken energy weapons, reduce it to parts, and then make a profit selling the Scrap Metal and Scrap Electronics off to someone who can make use of them.

Thank you for the link it was an interesting read. Makes me wish we could toggle the radiant AI just to see what kind of world would emerge.

The from what I recal hearing with Skyrim, the basic problem was that they just could not get the AI to act rationally to changes in the environment. For example burn down a sawmill in settlement "A" workshop B would start going to village "C" for wood even though "C" was on the other side so the wood buyer from "B" would end up pulling a army unit from C who would proceed to wipe out the village that was around C, never mind that the whole civil war thing ended up being more complicated and glitchy than they could make work in the first place.