I'm sorry, but that doesn't sound right.

Statistically that's true. As said by many sources, smokers die on average 10 years sooner. Most people who live those 10 more years will spend many of them getting some sort of health treatment because the older you live, the chances of getting a health problem is dramatically increased.


And it's statistically true when a smoker gets a health illness, they will die much sooner than a non smoker due to other complications associated with their higher risk health due to the smoking (immune system aren't as strong in smokers for example, so the same illness given to both a smoker and non smoker, that smoker will die sooner).

Smoking vs Non-smoking is always a touchy subject. Thing is, I understand that non-smokers don't want to be exposed to smoking, and rightfully so. It is just that sometimes it takes on proportions which isn't right or fair. You don't get lung cancer from walking past a smoker in free air. Closed enviroment is another thing tho, which I fully understand (which is why I smoke outside our house, since wife doesn't smoke) Lately, at least here in Denmark, it has become in for the politicians to make various laws and bans regarding smoking, because it scores them voters. But, what or who is next to be put under scrutiny?

We happily pound on a group of people, while we pollute in our car to work exposing all to it, pick up groceries full of chemicals, and sits in front of our computers full of things that have been transported by ship thousands of miles, and use batteries like candy for various things, our cities is light up as christmas trees and the list go on. Somewhere, in there, I personally, think that smoking is of less evil, as long as it only involves the smoker himself. How much are we ok with, when it interfers with peoples personal choice, provided no others come to harm?

Always thought that Canada's healthcare system was like ours in Scandinavia, with free healthcare through taxes (or perhaps you just forgot about it, or didn't know?)

People who try to defend smoking as "not so bad for you" really make me laugh. Like, educate yourself. Please.

The difference with Canadian healthcare is that it's illegal to have any form of private healthcare. You have to go through the free healthcare no matter what, and the service is terrible, too long of wait times, and they won't cover things like dental either.


Other countries have both private healthcare and public healthcare, so poorer people can use the public one in emergencies, and private ones can be more expensive, but take the load off of the public system and lower wait times while increasing services.


In Canada, the government has a monopoly on healthcare, and like all monopoly when there is no competition, the service doesn't have to be good or cheap. Which is,why we spend more than 50% on our taxes whilst having 1000% sin taxes on smokes and liquor to help pay for it.


Like I said, the only countries that have our system is north Korea and Cuba. Your European countries have multiple tier systems that is way more sophisticated than the backwards Canadian system.

So why is it okay to defend a person who's morbidly obese when it's well known that it's very unhealthy, and the health complications associated with being obese is a bigger drain on the healthcare system than a smoker, yet you're not allowed to fat shame because that's their choice, but going after smokers is free game?


Get off your high horses people. I'm not even a,smoker, but your ridiculous double standards are hypocritical at best.

I thought that was so well put I just had to copy....

It is well A lot of the same here in the U.S.... The tax revenue it generates has a ton to do with why, its legal. (I am not skimming over the Tobacco Lobby but I have blasted them all ready in a science for hire thread or something of that nature).

In my small neck of the woods (a fair sized city, but no say new york or even Chicago). You can not smoke in any business, r restaurant, or Bar....err unless you get some special permit and then it only outside in the Leper zone. (oh ya we have nasty winters here well not as bad as some) There was a brief movement that did not fair so well about having Cigar bars that you could actually be inside but I am not sure how that went. Now I work construction at a point where there is no house, (we have basemants here) and many of the contractors have deemed you can not smoke on there foundations......

Which is fine by me, I want to keep there contracts and I saw the Butts littering the ground from idiots at best that I think is what might be root of why (funny thing is now it chew cans from the framing crews heheh). So no smoking inside or out for me less I am at home. At The moment there working on passing a law to make it illegal in apartments... which some all ready saying its a no no if you wanna live there. I have house but i suspect after apartments it will be smoke free blocks.

So we get to a simple forum topic from Heiress Do you smoke??

Yep

And then we get the earful..... I feel you AL-B

Then I wonder how many giving us grief have there own vice (least one smoking something legal where he is but felt the need to snap at us) You drink (dont look at my picture I never said i was saint), you eat too much, YOu a Male guess what buddy Prostate cancer has yer addy.

And my grandmother like many others died from smoking(not in the normal way she set her hair on fire lighting a cigg off the stove) Ya

Ah ok, I see

They don't necessarily die much sooner, and often patients opt for costly medical/surgical interventions. Post-operative care is also expensive. In thoracic surgery, smokers often result in poorer outcomes, more aggressive pulmonary treatments, and longer hospital stays versus non-smokers who had lung surgery.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4332384/

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-healthcare-costs-smoking-idUSKBN0JX2BE20141219

That's why hospitals attempt smoking cessation programs. If smoking doesn't contribute to immediate complications, they do contribute to chronic disease, which are expensive to treat.

Err, I am actually paleo (no processed foods at all) because the chemicals you eat from fast food is worse than smoking. So..yeah. Obesity is a huge problem and that's not okay either. So that puts me in a high horse? Lol

Yup! I get it, smoking is not healthy/stinks, but when people rail against it, yet svck in car exhaust daily without a peep....I tend to .

Where is all the hate and people wanting to ban cars? (Which I am all in favour of!!) I have to svck in your blasted exhaust, from right behind/beside you on my bicycle. Passing 1 smoker and turning your nose up, as cars blaze past you by the hundreds, if not thousands daily just seems silly. Time for the car to go! Not trying to be offensive, but when you think about it...

/pet peeve.

I'm not entirely convinced that anybody did that. It would be kind of amusing to do so, though: it probably has some disinfectant and insecticide properties. And increases your awesomeness (yes I know, speaking as a 10+ years non-smoker who was really embarrassed about it at the time).


So many lifestyle choices are unhealthy in one way or another. Okay, some are notably more unhealthy than others, but I've seen a few people get really puritanical about it when their own lifestyle is often high-risk in various interesting ways.


One of the biggest causes of health complications is mental health conditions, yet that remains one of the most ignored, by state healthcare and especially private healthcare, which usually has a blanket exclusion on it in my experience. It's probably a much bigger problem than anything like smoking, drinking, drugs, creative driving, dangerous sports and so on and is probably the biggest avoidable source of health complications but nobody ever wants to do anything about it.

Whose double standards, if you could be more precise? Not a single person defended obesity in this thread, so either you're a mind reader or you're talking to imaginary people.

Agreed. There's a lot to be disgusted at, much of which is terrible for our health -- sodas, processed meats, sugar, and even car exhaust.


While smoking is terrible, I would assume many here partake in some very risky behaviors besides smoking which had been shown to cause long term health issues.


I've had relatives die from smoking related diseases, and I've seen others suffer quite heavily from a life time of terrible diet decisions. They say you pick your poison -- that is most definitely true.


Many of us are gamers -- I think most of us know the outcome of a lifetime of sedentary habits lol, and that could very well take a couple years off your life if you're not active.


Edit: I do not endorse smoking as a former smoker, but I think some have this superiority complex toward smokers, which is simply ignorant. I've always been active in sports throughout high-school, I'm at the gym everyday, I stay true to my goals. I'm not ashamed of a life decision I made years ago, and I don't look down on those who choose to smoke, but as a smoker I do feel obligated to share my experiences.


I never got a smokers cough, even from smoking a pack a day, but heart palpitations, elevated heart rate, and a benign arrhythmia are a bit scary to me. Thankfully, those effects have passed.

Definitely. A lot of people with mental health issues often have poorly managed comorbidities, and as a result, a lot of them are frequent flyers in hospital admissions. I really don't know why mental health conditions are ignored, but we all know that health care is ultimately about the bottom line.

I think there's something to be said for the many negative life decisions people make.


Smoking is a bad habit, but so is alcohol in excess (more than two drinks), daily caffeine consumption, high sugar content foods and drinks, fast food, not exercising, not drinking enough water, etc -- the list goes on and on, and I could even point to a few studies that show the negative impact of eating processed or cured meats or just simply red meat.


Unless you partake in none of that, which may be the case, you're still at risk for many complications later in life.