Thanks for the slap to the face guys. Watching the trailer to fill my heart with joy only to slap me with a wallhacked Railgun. You guys killed Quake officially now. After Q4 I shoulda expected Quake to be in the grave. But this just confirms it. Guess my only hope is to wait for HL3DM.

Overwatch? I guess I should actually play it before I pass too much judgement...I'm just surprised you wouldn't fall back to a previous "known good" iteration of quake. The wall hacky thing looks awful, I'll agree, but don't you want to at least....try it...or check out a "let's play" before you write it off entirely? I'll put it out there I don't have much faith in bethesda to give us anything as lean or as direct as the old games. I actually have exactly no faith, but I believe we will get an approximation. Also...Quake 4 kinda killed quake before this even had a chance. Before that comment starts a huge flame war, I'll add that I blame quake 4 for the downfall because of its attempts at completely unnecessary modernization and scaling back gameplay to force the game into as many PCs as possible...additionally it threw in a lot of elements that I personally don't find fun (mostly story driven stuff) and I think it slowed the game to a crawl at many points.

ioQuake3 is alive and well, FYI

The funny thing was that the Dm online was really rather good with amazing level designe

The thing is is that Quake is about people who all have the same equal level, abilities, and equipment and it is all about being better than your opponents. Once you give specific attributes to characters it ruins that and that is not how the base framework of this franchise works in the MP. You dilute what makes Quake Quake. Now there's always gonna be a class/champion/hero/(what have you) that is gonna be better at one thing rather than keeping everyone on the same leveling field. That's what makes these arena shooters awesome and appealing to me, remove that and it just casualizes it.

I don't want what I have to do in TF2 which works in TF2 because that's the game, the genera, the qualities that make TF2 TF2. That being I don't wanna have to chose the "soldier class" to rocket jump more efficiently. Or choose a class that will allow for plasma gun wall climbs.

Quake is about skill and the player's own abilities to win over opponent. Not what character/class/load out they get to chose from.

Agreed on all counts. I think games that have made a big name for themselves should stick to the things that made them great. It seems sometimes like the path we're going down...we're going to end up with "generic shooting game" and it'll have something from every game...something for everyone and all direct niche audiences will be written off.

Loadouts, characters/classes would indeed ruin the founding skill-based principle of quake, I agree completely.

Remove Quake from the title and I would have no objection to this game, but you can't call it Quake just to cash out and try to get more sales. Well they can and they will but it isn't fundamentally right.

Also agreed, I'd almost say they should do the same for the new doom. This is why I bring up open source game development (or at least I did in response to something you said...somewhere). If you want to have nice things, you need to work on them where bethesda can't bethesda all over them.

I'm undertaking a HUGE project that...I honestly don't know how I'll pull it off by myself...I may actually need to hire some people...or something...I'm still doing sketches and putting worlds together, but I want to create something that will be free and open to everyone and it won't be something that caters to any broad audience - the key focus will be to put something together that can be enjoyed in *exactly* the same way classic doom can be enjoyed...or as close as I can get it. I feel the need to do something to fix the fact we haven't been given a pure doom gameplay sequel since doom64 got ported to the pc.

As far as I can tell, the perfect quake game(s) have already been made, and those would be 1 2 and 3. I can live with ignoring 4....and whatever the hell happens with this new one....confidence is low, but we'll see.

I would love to see your project when completed or WIP updates. I found Wrack years and years ago before it was even a founded game and loved playing the first few levels over and over again. People like you guys are what makes this genre great.

I appreciate it, I actually generally get a lot of negative feedback...people say my levels are too big but I think it's means there's more to explore and fosters more of a sense of lonliness....which I think is cool but....to each their own, I'm also grumpy as hell so their feedback just kinda fueled me to keep going in spite of them. *shrug* Hit me up on steam if you're interested, I use the same name everywhere.

Hey so why is Quake Live now $10?

I heard something about that, it's something to do with keeping the servers up...I think Quake Live was supposed to be funded by in-game advertisemants on virtual billboards...but that either didn't pan out or didn't ..work...or something....I don't know. I never got into Quake Live, it was on my to-do list and it sounds like the ship has sailed anyway. My heart will go on without it.