I'm using Realistic Leveling for the first time in...well, ever. I've been an Oblivion XP user up until now and haven't used any skill based leveling mechanic for Oblivion - modded or vanilla - since the first time I've ever played it. My questions here don't have to do with how the leveling system works, but have to do with mods affecting the leveling system (hence why this thread is in the mods sections).

• I'm using OOO (and MOO, if that matters) and I know that OOO drastically lowers the leveling progression of skills. Since I'm using Realistic Leveling, will the leveling speed increase if I lower the set GS fSkillUseFactor value? In other words, will this global skill rate modifier overwrite OOO's set leveling rate?


• I've heard of this little OBSE plugin called Fundament. Problem is, I'm at a complete loss as to how to install and tweak it. Do I just install it normally with Wrye Bash and then just leave it as is? How do I make it so that I use the OOO version of Fundament instead of the vanilla? How do I change the global skill rate for OOO through this plugin? How do I change individual skill rates in addition to the global skill rate?

Yes, this will override OOO's skill rate setting. OOO's setting is fSkillUseFactor 3.0 (vanilla is fSkillUseFactor 0.35). So, if you want to retain Oscuro's value, make sure RL's value is 3.0 also.

I install all of my mods by hand, so if you're looking for advice on how to install via Bash or some other utility someone else will have to answer. I simply drag-and-drop the ini folder and Fundament.esm into my Data folder.

Fundament doesn't do anything on its own. So if you want to adjust your skill rates using Fundament you have to make a small change to your Fundament.ini. Open the ini and scroll down to the bottom. Uncomment (i.e. remove the semi-colons) from these two lines:

Thanks!


I'm a bit confused about something. OOO's leveling is slower than vanilla, right (if I remember corrctly, it was roughly 3x slower than vanilla)? If that's the case, then how is OOO's default fSkillUseFactor lower than the vanilla default value (0.30 compared to 0.35)?

Odd, I just double-checked my version 0.37 copy of OOO and it doesn't make any change to the fSkillUseFactor GMST. I could have sworn it was 3.0 many years ago. Maybe this was changed in a later version?

OOO changes the number of skill experience points given for skill-related actions separatly for each skill, which allows to tune it more precisely.

Even if it was changed in a later version, I still don't understand how the vanilla fSkillUseFactor could be a higher value than OOO's. How can vanilla be 0.35 while OOO is 0.30? Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't a higher value mean a slower level progression? By that logic, shouldn't OOO have a higher value than vanilla?

I'm not sure where you're getting the 0.30 figure. Where did you read this?

Wow, how embarassing. I misread 3.0 as 0.30. Sorry about that.


Is the leap from 0.30 to 3.0 really 3x slower? 3.0 seems a lot slower than just 3x if vanilla was 0.30. If that's the case, then which value should I use if I want ro make leveling skill rates 2x FASTER?

OOO slows down the leveling rate by lowering how much experience you gain from each skill use.


fSkillUseFactor changes how much experience you need to reach next level in a skill.


Since they slow it down in different ways they will combine, not overwrite each other. If OOO slows it down by 3x and fSkillUseFactor slows it down by 3x the total slowdown will be 9x.




OOO has never changed fSkillUseFactor to 3.0. fSkillUseFactor 3.0 would make leveling like 30 times slower...

OOO by default slows down the leveling rate to 3x slower than vanilla. If you want the leveling rate to be 2x faster than vanilla you can do so by:

* lowering fSkillUseFactor in RL to an appropriate value. The exact value you need to set to archive exactly 2x faster overall leveling speed I don't know since you need to do some math to calculate it.

* installing MOO and changing MOO.ini_skillgain to 6. This is a multiplier to all experience income. A value of 6 will make you level 6 times as fast. Combined with the 3x slower leveling in OOO you will level 2x as fast.

update: I don't remember exactly but MOO might be overwriting OOO's changes with the vanilla values before adding its multiplier, if this is true then MOO.ini_skillgain should be set to 2 instead of 6.

* installing Progress or Fundament and overwrite OOO's changes with new values. There might also be some global settings there that can be tweaked as an alternative method.

I had a feeling I was mis-remembering that number. Thanks, Johnn.

Anyway, these days I don't bother with fskillusefactor. Nowadays I increase the number of skill gains needed to level up. I generally choose a number from 20 to 25 for most characters. I tweak the leveling speed of individual skills more to maintain balance between the skills now, rather than to slow down character leveling.

OOO has two addon plugins that change the skill experience rate; they are included in the "Lite" package, but work with the "Full" version.

* OOO-Level_Stock.esp --- Reverts them back to vanilla

* OOO-Level_Slow.esp ---- Slows skill rate down even further; about 6x vanilla. This was the default pre-1.33

The way OOO changes the rate is by editing the skill records themselves.

So let me see if I got this right. If OOO slows it down by 3x and I want to get the vanilla level rate back by editing the fSkillUseFactor, I should make it so that the fSkillUseFactor is 3x less than the default value. That way, they cancel each other out and go back to the vanilla rates. From there, if I wanted to make it, say, 2x faster, I'll take that new value and make it 2x less. Am I right so far? If I am, then I'm guessing that all that's left to do is to find out what the math formula for this is.

If your Realistic Leveling mod loads after Oscuro it will over-ride any change to skill leveling rates or character leveling rates Oscuro's mod makes.

Sorry, I'm a bit confused. I thought Johnnn said that they combine, not overwrite each other.

Not true. RL itself doesn't make any changes at all to how you gain skills and how fast your skills level up. It does provide an option in the ini to change a game setting related to how fast your skills level up (fSkillUseFactor) but that is all and that line is commented out by default.

The only thing RL does is basically assigning new attribute values and new character level to PC based on how much PC has leveled up his skills. How you gain skills and how fast you gain them is up to any other mod to decide.

Yes, but you don't have to do it in two steps. You just have to make it 3*2=6 times faster by lowering fSkillUseFactor.


Or you can install OOO-Level_Stock.esp and then make it 2 times faster by lowering fSkillUseFactor.


Or you can install OOO-Level_Stock.esp and then make it 2 times faster in MOO by setting MOO.ini_skillgain to 2.

Yes, this was what I was referring to. I should have been more clear.

Yes, this is what I do too.

I am curious about which levelling mod (or combination of mods) you guys usually use in a OOO-based Oblivion installation ?

I really like the idea of a natural levelling, I don't like to micro manage (Oblivion XP is not for me). I saw that some people use a combination or RL, nGCD and Fundament/Progress to allow more precise tuning.

My past 300 hours in Oblivion on PC was about functional testing of mods. so I don't have old save/character on it. Only test saves (max 40 hours on a save). My experience in terms of levelling mods is basic. I use RL (default settings) with OOO and it seems to be ok.

If you guys can explain/share what changes you made to levelling (especially concerning Fundament and how it affects skill advancement) it would be useful for me.