Why not? Any proof of that?

I did never use it, but only because it seems for me too boring and unnecessary.

Define harder.

So, I'm using a calm spell, make a sneak attack and using a calm spell again, until my victim is death. Or I conjure an atronach an attack the back of my victim while it is fighting the attronach.

Raising the health of the victim just let me level faster! So, in conclusion, harder or easier is not in the mod itself, it is in the play-style!

For the protocol: I'm a re-starter. My characters start with a feeling of being weak. If I feel that they don't need to fear anything, I start a new character. To keep a character long enough alive, I do not use anything what would rise the leveling, including using stones and sleeping. (Except to join the brotherhood or speak to the ghost of the old friend of Hjalti.)

I agree with Pseron Wyrd. Enough said.

You don't "beat" an Elder Scrolls game, you live it.

YASH

ROTE

Deadly Dragons

Dragon Combat Overhaul

Requiem

Wildcat

Etc.

It's a broken mechanic, if you need explanation for that I've got bad news for you.


I was thinking more about harder in form of aggressive ai, starvation, hypothermia, thirst, sleep deprivation etc. + you're using a very specific attack pattern to disprove my point, which can be disproved back by specific situations in which calm won't help much (like when you're having problems with things I just listed).

stopped reading there @ mods = cheats

If calm don't work, there is still the conjuration...

... but I'm assuming, the real question is here, if we want to turn the game into an simulation or not.

So, we agree that there is no proof that the developers did NOT want players be able to use the restoration-loop?

Sure it does! But we have CHIM; those who know it can reshape the land.

The only time "cheating" bugs me is when a player does this and then thinks they are "all that and more." Otherwise, their game, their enjoyment. I don't care.

However, as an example, saying something like, "I walk through the game on Legendary!", while using cheats (restoration loop type cheats) will get under my skin.

Or if there is some kind of competition going, like Dead is Dead (DiD) or races. Then it is not just "the player" but many playing, albeit separately, but at least comparing

I cheat at times. I metagame at times. I still enjoy myself

This is not always true, though. If enough players "cheat" and then post about how "easy" a game is, the next installment may become more difficult due to that, which then effects my game

(Anyone recall Point Lookout from FO 3?)

Taking shelter in the number of people Modding, doesn't change the fact that you are all re-shaping the game and the rules to your liking, to what YOU percibe as "broken". That is the same morally as us cheating with the Restoration Loop :].

The first "Censored" comment, somebody got triggered! xD.

First of all, nobody force you read or write a comment in here and for what I can see, you have no real points other than say "No" to all I say. You seem to try to make yourself look tough having censored words, but in the end your just a cute bag of hot air :].

Tell me Why?, 0% magical cost via enchanting is ok, but the restoration loop is not?. Both are OP broken mechanics and the "Intended gameplay feature" is just another word for an oversight from the developer, JUST like the restoration loop... And Please dont tell me you are a beta that need others to put limits on your actions, just because Daddy Bethesda allow you to reach 0% magic cost, doesn't "magically" take away the OP of the mechanic.

So you are going to forfeit your achievements?, thats inconceivable to me xD.

I see your point, I have the recent memory of Survival difficulty being change in Fallout 4, forcing me to change my difficulty to Very hard as I didn't wanted to play with the new rules.

I've never liked the idea of achievements, they're nothing but a dike measuring contest to me.

There is nothing "moral" or "immoral" about using the restoration loop. It's a single player game so there is no such thing as "cheating" in the technical sense of the term.


Just play the way it's fun for you. I don't find grinding or using loopholes to make the character more powerful, or any sort of power gaming to be any fun at all, so I don't do it. But I don't assign any moral blame to those who enjoy that style of gaming.

It's a single player game. Messing with the game is only a bad thing when it's detrimental to your enjoyment.

It's not that deep.

For me is not a contest to show off, the real dike measuring contest start at a minimum of 80 platinums and up--> I only have 8 (T^T), so for me is more of a personal challenge. To get Platinums with all the games I really like :].

I now there is nothing Moral or inmoral about it, but people that defend Mods as not being a form of cheating, or the 0% spell reduction as a "intended way to play" not cheating at all. They are the ones bringing the morality to the matter... I made this topic and I have to defend it, till it gets deleted for becoming too hostile xD.

I totally agree, and I find that even if is detrimental to your enjoyment, the experience of messing things up is still a valuable experience to learn.

None of my business how you play your game. Nor is it anyone elses business how I play mine.

I agree with you, but regrettably not all people have that healthy mentality. Thats why we must kill them while they sleep!... I mean, be alert to calling them out on their bull :].

I'm not triggered, like I said, I don't care what you do in your game, I'm just baffled with this stupid reasoning over why us who don't cheat actually are cheaters. Using mods is not the same as cheating, and some mechanic being op does not automatically make it cheating. Intended mechanic is intended mechanic, restoration loop is not it, it's a direct violation of gameplay mechanics to make the game easy by abusing an unintended sideeffect the devs missed to fix = cheating.


Essentially, I don't dislike people who cheat, if you find it fun go ahead, you are the one who made a witch hunt type of thread where you, for some reason, try to defend your cheating by trying to level us fair players with cheaters with arguments on level of a 5 years old child. You don't see me making threads about how cheaters are lame, do you? So who has a healthy mentality here?


No, you do not agree with the previous poster, otherwise we wouldn't have this op where you openly indirectly express how you're better and smarter than people who take their time to fairly grind and level. You're the one pointing a finger here.

I don't have any problem with cheating. Sometimes I handicap myself by only using low tier equipment and sometimes I use the player.setscale command to turn myself into a giant and murder everything in a couple hits, it just depends I'm in the mood for. I don't see any reason to go into semantics about what an exploit vs. a cheat vs. an intended mechanic. To me, it just boils down to whether I'm having fun or not.