The Colour of Magic

Hi all. For a while now I've been thinking about coming here to ask for help with creating a total conversion for Morrowind, based on Terry Pratchett's Discworld. Obviously, not the whole thing seeing as it's about 13 thousand miles across, but I was hoping to create Anhk-Morpork in it's entirety (eventually, possibly, hopefully). The idea would be to create landmarks as self-contained areas, then build out from them, with later releases being introduced as plugins, and if it got to that point, combined into one singular mod. I imagine a good starting point would be the Unseen University, given it's nature as a point of interest and the heart of the city.

I've no idea how to mod Morrowind, but I can provide writing for the project - NPC dialogue, books, newspapers, infocards - all that sort of stuff. I'd need a modder who is able to put stuff together though. Probably need new meshes and textures as well, although I presume some stock stuff could be improvised. I can throw up some fairly in-depth plans, however they can be scaled down depending on workload. Here goes. The below would be bare bones for a starting point, and I can write up more stuff as required, including descriptions of areas, characters, classes, skills, the setting and so on. There's a couple of special characters from the books I'd like to include as well.

Here is a map of http://castrow.com/TP/ankh%20morpork%20map.jpg.

Here is a description of the potential mod-to-be's starting point, the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unseen_University.

Here is a description of the city itself, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ankh-morpork.

Starting Races:

Humans: The bog standard character, humans are the jack-of-trades generalisation. As Anhk-Morpork's largest demographic, humans are found in the greatest numbers. The only playable race that can use magic and join the Unseen University. Weaker than both Dwarfs and Trolls, but faster and sneakier. Most apt for Magic or Stealth set ups. In combination with Better Bodies and Better Heads, they could be ported straight over, including Bretons, Imperials and maybe Redguards into one race. Racial powers would have to be redone to be in keeping with the Discworld setting. Would specialise in unarmoured, speechcraft, sneak and other attributes I've yet to decide.

Dwarfs: Far shorter than humans, Diskworld Dwarfs are depicted in the traditional fantasy manner: stoic, traditional, merciless salesmen and very handy with an axe. Anhk-Morpork is the biggest Dwarf city outside Uberwald (another Disc country), containing some 50,000 of them (not going to be represented in full numbers in the mod of course, which would be a nightmare). Every Dwarf features a beard of some variety, regardless of gender (something which has traditionally been viewed as unimportant, leading to all Dwarfs up until recently being referred to as he/him). Dwarfs as a species had traditionally been locked in war with the Trolls for centuries, supposedly due to 1) the fact that Trolls are a race of rocks and Dwarfs are a race of miners, and 2) the Koom Valley incident in which both sides attempted to ambush each other at the same time. Technically at peace in the confines of the city due to the Koom Valley Accord, there are still strong tensions between Dwarfs and Trolls. Dwarfs can't use magic, and would need something else to compensate. Would specialise in Heavy Armour, Axes, Mercantile and other attributes I've yet to decide.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dwarfs_(Discworld)

Trolls: Trolls are larger by far than Dwarfs and considerably bigger than Humans. They are comparable to Golems of other fantasy universes, in that they are beings of living rock - however, there is a core difference in that they were not made, but born. Male trolls are covered in lichen, moss and ivy, while female trolls are increasingly favouring more intricate and decorative plants. Trolls teeth are made of solid diamond, making for a hefty prize for anyone who actually manages to kill one. Trolls as a species had traditionally been locked in war with the Dwarfs for centuries, supposedly due to 1) the fact that Trolls are a race of rocks and Dwarfs are a race of miners, and 2) the Koom Valley incident in which both sides attempted to ambush each other at the same time. Technically at peace in the confines of the city due to the Koom Valley Accord, there are still strong tensions between Dwarfs and Trolls. Would either specialise in unarmoured (naturally rocky hide) and/or heavy armour (rock reinforcement?), hand to hand, blunt and other attributes I’ve yet to decide.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolls_(Discworld)

I'll write more stuff if people are interested.

It's very unlikely you'll find the help you need for this. Not because it isn't a good idea, I'm sure we'd all love to see this, but because getting a team of serious modders together is very difficult to do. We all have our own projects on the go, and they take a very long time to finish. A total conversion would take years of work.
Since you've never modded Morrowind before, not very many people are going to want to do all the work while you just sit back and help with ideas.

There are many dead projects (or projects that never passed beyond an idea) for these very reasons.

Despite an active and helpful community, a project this big is almost impossible to recruit for, especially when you have no work to show so far.

My suggestion is this: Start learning how to mod so you can get the ball rolling. People will be more eager to help if you have laid the foundation for the mod and need help filling in the details.

Good Luck! and Happy modding

You'd be suprised how often we hear stuff like this. A massive total conversion like this doesn't just require one modder and one guy with a few ideas. Total conversions are built by whole teams of skilled modders working together for very gradual gain. Ever played TR? It was started in 2002, and has so far released 2 out of a planned 6 maps. This isn't just a casual past time.

If you really want to do this you're going to have to learn to mod or moddel yourself. If you put some effort in yourself and show us what you're done we'll find it easier to believe your conviction and be more willing to work with you. Why not start by learning to moddel and making some buildings or clothes? Then you can show these to people and they'll have something to begin with.

EDIT: Ninja'd by some good points :toughninja: .

Do you have permission to make a derivative work of Discworld? The reason I ask is that many people aren't really aware of how copyright works, and we occasionally hear sad stories like the Middle Earth Mod that got shut down by the Tolkien estate lawyers.

In that case, do you guys know where I can find some tutorials? I'd love to get the ball rolling as ya said, and hopefully establish some credentials. Maybe start with something small first. I guess I'd get some work in doing urban areas or something, just to practice how to lay stuff down.

As for the 'just providing ideas', I'm not too sure on the intricacies of how it works, but I presume written stuff is just coded and inserted into the correct file with scripting and stuff? I mean getting the actual material written is part of the job, and I'd be willing to take on that entire aspect of it.

I'll put this on the shelf for a while to practice.

EDIT: Just looking up the Video Tutorial thread. Should be useful.

the Tamriel Rebuilt has some good tutorials, including http://www.tamriel-rebuilt.org/?p=modding_data/tuts/dsong/first_room which is great for beginners.
The Construction Set section of the forum here also has many links in the pinned threads.

Yeah, I'm just looking through the Youtube videos Morrowind Construction Set - Tutorial 1 - 4, then I'll be looking at a few more of the follow up videos. I'll check that link there. Thanks for the help.

I might try some basic modelling as well, although I've never been able to progress much beyond boxes.

EDIT: About the copyright, I presumed that as a non-profit project, this would avoid most of the legal work associated with the topic. Added to the fact I won't be directly importing any images, texts or artwork, but carefully rebuilding them based on how the project turns out. For example, that map wouldn't be used as a world map, due to the fact that it is copyrighted that they probably wouldn't like that. It is, however, very useful as a guideline template as to what Ankh-Morpork should look like though.

Well, IMHO, I think you presume incorrectly. My suggestion is to read up on copyright. Brad Templeton's 10 Myths about Copyright is a good quick read. The US copyright office has a FAQ which is pretty accessible. Consider the case of the MEMod I mentioned which was shut down after a lot of work was put into it. That's the big risk: losing a lot of hard work. I would only ignore copyright if you're willing to take that risk or make the mod entirely private and not for public use.

Just read through the article you mentioned, which raises some good points. Despite that, it focuses primarily on US copyright, while I'd need UK law. No doubt a lot of it is applicable in any case, especially regarding the internet. At any rate, I'd be interested if the Middle Earth mod was attempting to use materials ported directly from another of the LoTR games or books - like direct quotes, or art work.

I guess it would be worth me sending Terry Pratchett an email, if I could find his email address, or his business address. He's swamped by hundreds of fan emails a day though, so a reply would be unlikely, meaning I really shouldn't bother unless there's an actual possibility of this happening.

Plus, just made my first shack in the TES Construction Set, on the exterior at least. Little baby steps, but it's a start.

The same little baby steps the rest of us took. Welcome to MW modding.


KF

You have it there, art work. It's part of the copyright and so are the made up names. And if you change the names and the art work that's not Pratchett's Discworld anymore. If you're so eager to make such a big mod, do it a bid different- make your own. Imagine your own names, even similar to those from the Discworld, make your own art work, and all, and have it heavily based on the original Discworld. That way it's kind of like the Discworld, but even better- it's your own story. + yo uwon't have to take the mod down eventually

Anyway, welcome to modding! :celebration: Building the shack was actually my very 1st thing in cs, trying to figure out landscaping, interior design and how the door work.. tho I had to learn it by myself, since there weren't any made guides at the time ...beautiful times :touched:

there is this mod if you are interested in http://planetelderscrolls.gamespy.com/View.php?view=Mods.Detail&id=8629.

That is amazing, thank you so much! Definitely downloading that one.

As for the comment about artwork, I meant, for example, directly using that map, or scanning images from the books. The actual lore would remain the same, I guess.

Also, are there any modders here who use Skype? It'd be really awesome to have someone to shoot queries to when the fatal error message pops up after I tweak something.

Welcome to modding! We all started very small. I remember making my first house in Oblivion by following the begginers tutorial.

However, as to copyright; because Terry Prachet is British, and the Discworld series is copyrighted to him (I just checked in one of the books) his works probably fall under UK copyright law, in which I quote from http://www.copyrightservice.co.uk/:

Now I don't assume that would mean that anyone else could write a Discworld book, but since your use is for a non-profit end you could probably get away with it. Of course, there's still along way to go before you reach that stage. All I want to know is why you guys thought that the US copyright laws would be relevant :shakehead: .

This assumption is what killed the Middle Earth mod in the end. It got quite far, getting even an article in a gaming magazine or two if I remember, but once the copyright holders found out they were shut down.

I'm thinkig most likely it WAS article that caused it.

Just wondering, are there any tutorials on how to write quests? Also, how can I add new scrolls and books and such? I've made a hut in Seyda Neen formerly belonging to the Argonian slave Banolz. I've added three notes with a bit of background to the situation, but to do that I've just had to pick obscure notes and write over them. I'd be good if I could clone the actual object so I could rename it and rewrite it without messing up something else somewhere else.

http://www.themcnews.com/Making%20a%20Quest_Contents.htm by Skydiver


http://tommyshideout.net/files/srikandi/DialogueTut/ by Srikandi

I learnt from these

That quote pretty much holds for US copyright too, you know.


MEMod was not for profit. The Tolkien estate is British. JK Rowling is British, you should read how litigious she is in "protecting" her copyright. US and UK copyright laws are actually pretty similar these days. Not to mention the Berne convention. The error lots of people make is thinking that their interpretation of copyright law protects them. It doesn't. It is the copyright holders interpretation of copyright law that puts you at risk.

This is something that will come in handy to me as well, thanks Arcimaestro

Who actually took legal action on MEMod though? New Line Cinema also hold the rights for the Lord of the Rings series, and it's possible that it was they that took the action.

My understanding from reading the TesNexus forum was that it was the Tolkien estate. But I read it a long time ago.

Anyway, my one and only real point is that if you are considering doing a derivative work of something that is copyrighted, the best course of action is to ask permission first. Maybe Mr. Pratchett will be really cool and he might like the idea.

Well Pratchett is known for liking videogames... I'd say the chance is pretty big he has played Morrowind.

He has certainly played Oblivion as he has said in at least http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=143656.

If the original poster of this topic really wants to know about any legality issues he/she can always try contacting Terry's agent: http://www.colinsmythe.co.uk/index.html. Changes are that you will get permission since the http://discworld.atuin.net/lpc/ has been online for years.