The 24-hour wait until the merchant has money again thing

Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 8:41 pm

Is there a way to keep merchant's maximum cash the same, but get rid of the 24-hour waiting period for them to have money again? I'd like selling goods to be more like Oblivion.
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Chris Guerin
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 2:37 pm

Is there a way to keep merchant's maximum cash the same, but get rid of the 24-hour waiting period for them to have money again? I'd like selling goods to be more like Oblivion.

Change the GMST that governs the waiting time for Merchants gold refilling. (It currently is 24)
Not sure if 1 hour would be the minimum or not, as decimals may not work in this situation.

EDIT: the GMST is called fBarterGoldResetDelay
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TRIsha FEnnesse
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 3:02 pm

This would have to be done with the Construction Set and for every merchant individually? That fBarterGoldResetDelay doesn't appear in the game's config file.
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Janine Rose
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 5:18 pm

That's because it isn't in the config file.

Like Pluto said, it's a "GMST", an internal game setting, set in the "Master Files". (Morrowind.esm)
To change it, you have to use the construction set to make a plugin that changes it.
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sexy zara
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 8:16 am

Well, that was easy....

You know how freaking nice it is not to have to wait 24 hours in the same spot for the merchant's gold to reset? I only wish I had done this YEARS ago. Now it's instant after each sale, just like Oblivion.

I think I might expand upon the idea by doing something about the broken economy of Morrowind, making it more like Oblivion (less broken).
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Joey Bel
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 4:40 pm

I think I might expand upon the idea by doing something about the broken economy of Morrowind, making it more like Oblivion (less broken).


Yeah, because giving all the merchants infinite amounts of gold so you can sell enormous stocks of goods is so realistic.
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N3T4
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 12:48 pm

You know how freaking nice it is not to have to wait 24 hours in the same spot for the merchant's gold to reset?

I wouldn't know, I set mine to reset after a week. :P

Must admit that my merchants are much richer than the vanilla ones though.
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GEo LIme
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 8:38 am

Yeah, because giving all the merchants infinite amounts of gold so you can sell enormous stocks of goods is so realistic.


Where did I say I gave them infinite amounts of gold? Duh much?

I'm selling $80,000 swords for $5000. Why do they need to be worth $80,000? You're not going to go to the town merchant and buy one.

Oblivion does this better. It's rare to sell enough that the merchant's cap is reached, but it happens from time to time. Regardless, you're never inconvenienced by holding gear you can't sell. It doesn't take a week to sell all the stuff you're carrying.

I think I need to remove the Scamp Creeper and Drunken Mud Crab, then reduce the values of all the most powerful magic gear. Then you can enjoy more time adventuring away from the lure of treadmill leveling. What's the most expensive weapon or armor in Oblivion, and how much cash does the richest merchant hold (I haven't played it enough to know)?

Oh, and change the reset timing for dungeons, so they don't fill back up with monsters as soon as you close the door. Oblivion has it at a week, right? That would work, and give you reason to go out and explore, travel, have fun.

Morrowind stops being fun the moment it loses its challenge, which is right about level 15. You keep getting tougher, while the monsters stay the same and start dropping enormously expensive stuff. The challenge has to remain constant over the life of the character.
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Tha King o Geekz
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 7:48 am

Morrowind stops being fun the moment it loses its challenge, which is right about level 15. You keep getting tougher, while the monsters stay the same and start dropping enormously expensive stuff.

Huh?
Obviously you've never played Bloodmoon or Tribunal, or even fully explored all that the world has to offer.
And Leveled Lists most certainly do keep changing after level 15.

There are many economy mods available. http://www.mwmythicmods.com/realism.htm#Economy has some of them listed.

If you're going to make your own, I suggest actually knowing the mechanics of the game more before you start.
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Ella Loapaga
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 10:19 pm

You guys are funny.

I've played the game completely, mapping out and exploring every last shine, mine, and lair. I've been through Tribunal, and got bored, because nothing could hurt me. Once you've got a few stats to 100, the game becomes entirely too easy. I know the mechanics very well, thank you. I don't have to be an aspiring designer languishing in mod hell to know whether or not the game is flawed.
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Sista Sila
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 10:32 pm

Where did I say I gave them infinite amounts of gold? Duh much?

I'm selling $80,000 swords for $5000. Why do they need to be worth $80,000? You're not going to go to the town merchant and buy one.

Oblivion does this better. It's rare to sell enough that the merchant's cap is reached, but it happens from time to time. Regardless, you're never inconvenienced by holding gear you can't sell. It doesn't take a week to sell all the stuff you're carrying.

I think I need to remove the Scamp Creeper and Drunken Mud Crab, then reduce the values of all the most powerful magic gear. Then you can enjoy more time adventuring away from the lure of treadmill leveling. What's the most expensive weapon or armor in Oblivion, and how much cash does the richest merchant hold (I haven't played it enough to know)?

Oh, and change the reset timing for dungeons, so they don't fill back up with monsters as soon as you close the door. Oblivion has it at a week, right? That would work, and give you reason to go out and explore, travel, have fun.

Oblivion is 3 days, just like Morrowind.

And face it, the Oblivion system doesn't make any sense. They have infinite gold because as soon as they buy something it goes straight back up. Why is it that if you have 5 daedric weapons selling them individually will get you more money than selling them at once? I quiet like the way the Oblivion mod Enhanced Economy does it, because it's similar to Morrowind but their gold doesn't just jump back up after 24 hours, it's very dynamic. Still, each to their own.

Oh, and if you've explored 'every last shrine, mine and lair' it's time to get TR.
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!beef
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 8:24 pm

If you find the game too easy, I suggest you increase the difficulty, or, download some mods that improve the leveled lists, make stuff harder, you know. The modding community has been around for a while. I'm sure you'll find something that floats your boat
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Chantel Hopkin
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 7:31 pm

You guys are funny.

I've played the game completely, mapping out and exploring every last shine, mine, and lair. I've been through Tribunal, and got bored, because nothing could hurt me. Once you've got a few stats to 100, the game becomes entirely too easy. I know the mechanics very well, thank you. I don't have to be an aspiring designer languishing in mod hell to know whether or not the game is flawed.


Try raising up the difficulty bar, removing your mods, and stop using the console, that should do the trick.
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Annika Marziniak
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 3:12 pm

There a few people here who will actually say that MW economy works properly. As well as that, vanilla MW does have a cap on the difficulty as in it becomes a cakewalk once you reach a certain high enough level (not exactly at lev 15, but it does happen)

This is why the expansions were made.

As well as that, there are mods to expand on this.

As there seem to be a bunch of people here saying "MW is too easy" perhaps there should be a new section on the various modding collections: higher level.

Like they have mods that:
"add new land"
"change alchemy"
"add items"
ect
ect
and then
"high level" mods - for people who can sneeze almalexia into oblivion.

ST
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Kristian Perez
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:08 am

There a few people here who will actually say that MW economy works properly. As well as that, vanilla MW does have a cap on the difficulty as in it becomes a cakewalk once you reach a certain high enough level (not exactly at lev 15, but it does happen)

This is why the expansions were made.

As well as that, there are mods to expand on this.

As there seem to be a bunch of people here saying "MW is too easy" perhaps there should be a new section on the various modding collections: higher level.

Like they have mods that:
"add new land"
"change alchemy"
"add items"
ect
ect
and then
"high level" mods - for people who can sneeze almalexia into oblivion.

ST


Not saying Morrowind can't be a cakewalk, I did sneeze Almalexia into Oblivion myself, but at level 40, not BY FAR at level 15, or even much higher. Especially not in expansions. This occurs only if you play properly of course, if you for example drink up 50+ potions before every fight, sure, Alma can be crapped on at level 1.
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Andrea P
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 7:14 pm

or you could use the console to LOWER your stats and level... so much better. Try taking on dagoth ur at level 10 like I did BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAD FIGHT!!!
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Dagan Wilkin
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 9:52 am

Oblivion is 3 days, just like Morrowind.


Any lair with monsters refills with monsters the moment you leave, not in three days. I walk out, turn around and go back in, the monsters are all there to greet me again, as if I had never entered in the first place. Maybe this is because of my habit of clicking "remove corpse." Even so, I think there should be a waiting period. In the editor, the respawn is 72 hours for corpses. Maybe the "remove corpse" thing was something the designers had for testing and failed to remove?

While it makes looting for big money easy, it doesn't make a bit of sense. When you clear a dungeon in Oblivion, it's still empty when you go right back in. You have to wait (3 days, a week, whatever) before the critters return. I don't think you can remove corpses in Oblivion.

Changing this behavior would be an important part in a larger plan to discourage treadmill leveling and encourage wide-ranging exploration (aka fun).

Finally, some of you assume way to much. I've played this game since it first came out. I've got the expansions. I've got the Difficulty maxed. Once Daedra start dropping Ebony and Daedric weapons, your level can rocket up, because you can finally pay for all the training you want. That's why Oblivion limits you to five training sessions per level.
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Kelvin Diaz
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:39 am

Any lair with monsters refills with monsters the moment you leave, not in three days. I walk out, turn around and go back in, the monsters are all there to greet me again, as if I had never entered in the first place. Maybe this is because of my habit of clicking "remove corpse." Even so, I think there should be a waiting period. In the editor, the respawn is 72 hours for corpses. Maybe the "remove corpse" thing was something the designers had for testing and failed to remove?

While it makes looting for big money easy, it doesn't make a bit of sense. When you clear a dungeon in Oblivion, it's still empty when you go right back in. You have to wait (3 days, a week, whatever) before the critters return. I don't think you can remove corpses in Oblivion.

Changing this behavior would be an important part in a larger plan to discourage treadmill leveling and encourage wide-ranging exploration (aka fun).

Finally, some of you assume way to much. I've played this game since it first came out. I've got the expansions. I've got the Difficulty maxed. Once Daedra start dropping Ebony and Daedric weapons, your level can rocket up, because you can finally pay for all the training you want. That's why Oblivion limits you to five training sessions per level.

Now you mention it I'm not 100% sure about the respawn time in Morrowind, I just assumed it was three days because I've never had that problem. If I leave somewhere and go back in the monsters are dead, like when I left 'em.

There are plenty of economy mods that change item value, making training more expensive, reduce daedric and ebony weapon drops etc. Try some of them. I think you'll find the amount of time you need to wait for merchants to get more money is unimportant when the economy is better balanced.
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Angela
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:34 am

Once Daedra start dropping Ebony and Daedric weapons, your level can rocket up, because you can finally pay for all the training you want. That's why Oblivion limits you to five training sessions per level.

Yeah, I had to mod that part to rebalance the game a bit. Both the daedra loots and training cost. Now ebony/daedric equipment only show up later (replaced by dremora weapons at lower levels) and the training cost multiplier went from 10 to 50. A lot more fun for me that way.

Btw, what mods do you currently use currently Gawain? Just curious.
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Marquis deVille
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 9:35 pm

Yes, if you Dispose of Corpse the creatures will respawn as soon as you leave/return to the cell. Otherwise, it is 72 hours.
That is not something the designers forgot to remove from testing the game, it is a great feature because removing corpses decreases what the game has to remember. (keeps your Save file smaller)

And about having tons of gold to Train with... well, ummm... just stop Training.
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Susan Elizabeth
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 12:03 pm

I wouldn't know, I set mine to reset after a week. :P

Must admit that my merchants are much richer than the vanilla ones though.


If you set the restore of merchant money to a week ( or even longer) does this eat up any kind of performance./FPS/make the game crash more likely? It would seem like it would have to be remembered in the save and/or game memory, and then if you had a longer wait then you would need more merchants because you would have to wait longer and it would have to save THAT info as well (see the circular logic, here?)

I am iterested in trying to re-make the economy. I understand that it has been done already, I just wanna do it myself my way and perhaps learn some more about scripting while doing it.

Can you set it to NEVER reset? (Then I would change the merchants cash using scripts)

ST
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phil walsh
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:38 am

It should have no ill effect on gameplay. It's just a variable controlled by a GMST.
Setting it at 0 might make it never reset, but you'd have to test this to be sure. It might do something weird, like give them 0 gold to begin with also.

Doing an economy mod won't really have anything to do with scripting, but it will still be a large learning experience, I bet.
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Alycia Leann grace
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 11:53 pm

If you set the restore of merchant money to a week ( or even longer) does this eat up any kind of performance./FPS/make the game crash more likely? It would seem like it would have to be remembered in the save and/or game memory, and then if you had a longer wait then you would need more merchants because you would have to wait longer and it would have to save THAT info as well (see the circular logic, here?)

I am iterested in trying to re-make the economy. I understand that it has been done already, I just wanna do it myself my way and perhaps learn some more about scripting while doing it.

Can you set it to NEVER reset? (Then I would change the merchants cash using scripts)

ST

As far as I can tell, it didn't have any bad effect on the FPS or the CTD frequency. I never tried to set it to not reset at all though.
And making your own economy mod is a good idea. It's a great way to learn and you'll be able to make it according to your own preferences.
Anyway, good luck with your mod!
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Lucky Girl
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 10:50 am

Yes, if you Dispose of Corpse the creatures will respawn as soon as you leave/return to the cell. Otherwise, it is 72 hours.
That is not something the designers forgot to remove from testing the game, it is a great feature because removing corpses decreases what the game has to remember. (keeps your Save file smaller)

And about having tons of gold to Train with... well, ummm... just stop Training.

But...but...but....I CAN'T HELP MYSELF!!!

However, if I could fix it so that you can only train five times like in Oblivion, I would. But then, it is easier to get many skills up on your own in Oblivion than in it is Morrowind.

Notice they got rid of "Dispose of Corpse" in Oblivion, great feature or not.

I'm going to cut the Creeper's gold to 50, the Mudcrab to 100 (even though I'd never bother looking for him, anyway). I'm going to reduce the value of Ebony and Daedric equipment to 10% of existing. Add a crushing disposition penalty for a failed barter. Reduce the effectiveness of bribes. Raise merchant's Mercantile score.

My problem with existing economy mods is that they do things I feel alter the way the game plays, and alter the traditional experience of things a bit much. I think some are too complicated.
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Liv Brown
 
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Post » Tue Nov 09, 2010 9:29 am

I'm going to cut the Creeper's gold to 50, the Mudcrab to 100 (even though I'd never bother looking for him, anyway). I'm going to reduce the value of Ebony and Daedric equipment to 10% of existing. Add a crushing disposition penalty for a failed barter. Reduce the effectiveness of bribes. Raise merchant's Mercantile score.

You might be interested in the Code Patch feature named "permanent barter disposition changes". Arguing with a merchant down to 20 dispo is now a bad idea.
About training, multiplying the GMST by 5 is an efficient way to limit your training sessions. (especially if you balance the rest of your economy)
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Nienna garcia
 
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