Moral responsibility in the Power of the Atom (spoilers)

Post » Sat Dec 04, 2010 4:02 pm

Following on from the topic about the Replicated Man, I had a couple of questions about this quest - one that pretty much everyone's done at the start of the game I imagine.

(1.). If you choose the bad route of blowing Megaton up, who is ultimately morally responsible for the destruction? Obviously you as the player are the one to press the button, but Mr Burke is the one who gives you the Pulse Charge and the detonator, while none of it would have happened if Mr Tenpenny hadn't said "I don't like looking at that town over there, someone get rid of it (parallels to Henry II and "will no one rid me of this turbulent priest?") Or if you think all 3 of you, who bears most responsbility?

(2.). If you tell Lucas Simms about Burke, he runs off to arrest him but gets killed - should you as the player feel guilty? You're the one who's put Lucas in that position, but he's chosen to go, and Mr Burke is the one who pulls the trigger?
User avatar
keri seymour
 
Posts: 3361
Joined: Thu Oct 19, 2006 4:09 am

Post » Sun Dec 05, 2010 4:08 am

Hey you do know Simms does not have to die, you can help him against burk. Like say shooting the gun out of Burkes hand. (or just drilling him with bullets).

"Whats that make us? Big damn heroes sir."
User avatar
Tamara Dost
 
Posts: 3445
Joined: Mon Mar 12, 2007 12:20 pm

Post » Sat Dec 04, 2010 4:45 pm

1. The most important in the chain of events is Mr Burke. After speaking to Tenpenny its evident he would never have done anything by himself. The PC wouldn't have had means or motive without Burke who could probably have eventually found some other scum if the PC didn't disarm the bomb and/or turn Burke in. That doesn't make the character any less guilty though.

2. No need to feel guilty if Burke kills Simms. Burke is a criminal, Simms is the (self-appointed) Sheriff. He was trying to do his job and the responsibility for his death is Burkes.
User avatar
Sunny Under
 
Posts: 3368
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2007 5:31 pm

Post » Sun Dec 05, 2010 7:25 am

You have the greatest moral responsibility. Sure, Burke and Tenpenny aren't good guys either, but you set in motion all events leading to trigger the bomb. I kill Burke before he has a chance to kill Simms, or the other route, I just disarm the damn thing and let the hit squad roll.
User avatar
sam smith
 
Posts: 3386
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2007 3:55 am

Post » Sun Dec 05, 2010 5:54 am

Doing it makes the LW th worst sort of murderer. And you can save Simms if you go with him and plug Burke after he pulls down on Simms. I always go along and blow Burke's head off with a shotgun before he can shoot.
User avatar
MR.BIGG
 
Posts: 3373
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2007 7:51 am

Post » Sun Dec 05, 2010 4:21 am

On my first playthough, I was competely taken by suprise by Burke's attack and was unable to save Simms. I was left open-mouthed in horror, and when Simms' little boy later apporached me with my house key my heart nearly broke. So yeah, I did feel responsible for Lucas' death, even though it was only my fault in a tangential way.

On detonating the bomb, the player's just as culpable as Tenpenny and Burke. Tenpenny orders the hit, Burke finds the assassin (you) and you pull the trigger. Tenpenny's motive is the flakiest though, for you and Burke it's just money but him? Why does he want the town gone? Because it spoils the view from his balcony? Man's a lunatic.
User avatar
Gisela Amaya
 
Posts: 3424
Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2007 4:29 pm

Post » Sat Dec 04, 2010 5:55 pm

The way I c it is that Ten Penny is the one who everyone bows down and serves. If the wanderer does no do anything about it, someone else is going to blow up the town.
User avatar
Brian Newman
 
Posts: 3466
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2007 3:36 pm

Post » Sun Dec 05, 2010 7:23 am

I'm wondering why Burke just waits around Moriartys in the hope that a complete stranger will turn up who might want to press the button. Surely it would be quicker to do it himself? Unless he's either more moral than he seems and doesn't want that on his conscience or he just enjoys corrupting someone. Strangely I've never thought about this kind of thing on previous games
User avatar
Kristian Perez
 
Posts: 3365
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2007 3:03 am

Post » Sun Dec 05, 2010 2:34 am

Burke and the player would be responsible. IIRC Tenpenny simply complained about Megaton on the horizon, he never ordered Burke to get rid of it. And whilst he did go along with Burke's plan to blow it up, Burke told him that the settlers would be evacuated first.
User avatar
Elizabeth Lysons
 
Posts: 3474
Joined: Fri Feb 02, 2007 7:16 am

Post » Sat Dec 04, 2010 7:39 pm

You have the greatest moral responsibility. Sure, Burke and Tenpenny aren't good guys either, but you set in motion all events leading to trigger the bomb. I kill Burke before he has a chance to kill Simms, or the other route, I just disarm the damn thing and let the hit squad roll.


Agree, your the trigger man (litterally). You not only set the charges but pushed the button.
Tenpenny may be senile, as the impression I got was Mr. Burke told his boss Megaton was structurally unsafe and would be evaucated before blowing it up.

I'm wondering why Burke just waits around Moriartys in the hope that a complete stranger will turn up who might want to press the button. Surely it would be quicker to do it himself? Unless he's either more moral than he seems and doesn't want that on his conscience or he just enjoys corrupting someone. Strangely I've never thought about this kind of thing on previous games

The most likely reason Burke won't do it himself is he doesn't have the necessary explosives skill and if he's caught tampering with the bomb he's likely to get shot in the back of the head. Even if he's successful its possible someone who left Megaton before the explosion could remember Mr. Burke tampering with the bomb. So in short why take any risks himself? Its not like Megaton is a threat its just an eyesore he can afford to take his time

Also according to the offical game guide, Andy had been negotiating with Mr. Burke about blowing up Megaton inexchange for moving the bar to Tenpenny Tower. (and its just as likely Andy has no explosive expertise either). So it could simply be he's waiting to finalize that deal but if a better agent should show himself that's fine.
User avatar
Tracy Byworth
 
Posts: 3403
Joined: Sun Jul 02, 2006 10:09 pm

Post » Sat Dec 04, 2010 6:25 pm

It's simple.

You set the trigger, you go to Burke, you blow up Megaton, you bad person.

Burkes bad, Tenpenny bad.

But afterall your just a mercenery wandering the wastes and the real bad guys are Burke and Tenpenny.

You don't know these people, they're obviously just a cool town with a bomb in the middle of it, and you need caps.

So you bad, Burke and Tenpenny double bad.

Thats the thinking my evil character went with.

The worst people in it are Burke and Tenpenny.

Your just a random mercenery type with the nessesery skills to set it up.

Burke probabely does not have the skill to set it up or he would do it himself.

He is some kind of nuclear lover.

He is realy enraptured and happy by the exploding bomb.

He questions Gob on being a ghoul.

He probabely really wanted to blow it up.

And Tenpennys land deal that needed Megaton destroyed and the land claimed was perfect for him.

And Tenpenny is not in the least but senile.

He is one of the sharpest, cleverest, and most evil people in the game.
User avatar
Alisia Lisha
 
Posts: 3480
Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2006 8:52 pm

Post » Sat Dec 04, 2010 10:21 pm

You have the greatest moral responsibility. Sure, Burke and Tenpenny aren't good guys either, but you set in motion all events leading to trigger the bomb. I kill Burke before he has a chance to kill Simms, or the other route, I just disarm the damn thing and let the hit squad roll.


You don't set into motion the events leading to triggering the bomb, Tenpenny does
In law you'd all be equally culpable. Its a conspiracy. Tenpenny wants it done, Burke provides the means, the PC does it.
The person who pays for or arranges a murder is just as guilty as the person who carries it out
User avatar
Solène We
 
Posts: 3470
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2007 7:04 am

Post » Sat Dec 04, 2010 10:38 pm

I always let Simms get killed because I want his hat. :evil:
User avatar
Siobhan Thompson
 
Posts: 3443
Joined: Sun Nov 12, 2006 10:40 am

Post » Sat Dec 04, 2010 6:43 pm

Thanks for all of the replies, it's strange though that the game rewards you with evil karma for blowing the town up, but donating money to the Church of the Children of Atom (an organisation who worship nuclear explosions and who's leader has a terminal entry considering detonating the bomb) is rewarded with good karma. Supporting detonating the bomb good, actually doing it bad. Weird.
User avatar
Eve(G)
 
Posts: 3546
Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2007 11:45 am

Post » Sat Dec 04, 2010 6:26 pm

Thanks for all of the replies, it's strange though that the game rewards you with evil karma for blowing the town up, but donating money to the Church of the Children of Atom (an organisation who worship nuclear explosions and who's leader has a terminal entry considering detonating the bomb) is rewarded with good karma. Supporting detonating the bomb good, actually doing it bad. Weird.



Disarming the bomb and shooting Burke gets you good karma, as does shooting Tenpenny. Though if I do that, I also shoot Confessor Cromwell because of the racket he makes; and Moriarty, and Jericho. Megaton is a nice quiet town when I am though.
User avatar
Kelly Tomlinson
 
Posts: 3503
Joined: Sat Jul 08, 2006 11:57 pm

Post » Sat Dec 04, 2010 9:13 pm

I never dentonated the bomb. What happens to the town if you do
User avatar
Dalley hussain
 
Posts: 3480
Joined: Sun Jun 18, 2006 2:45 am

Post » Sat Dec 04, 2010 6:14 pm

I played the Simms-Burke confrontation yesterday and failed to save Lucas Simms. Felt a bit sad on seeing his body, and when I spoke to Harden but sadly that's the wasteland. The real bad thing, like one of the NPCs said, is that now Megaton is controlled solely by Moriarty. Now I've got visions of coming back there and finding a town like Chicago in the Al Capone era.
User avatar
Dina Boudreau
 
Posts: 3410
Joined: Thu Jan 04, 2007 10:59 pm

Post » Sun Dec 05, 2010 1:40 am

I played the Simms-Burke confrontation yesterday and failed to save Lucas Simms. Felt a bit sad on seeing his body, and when I spoke to Harden but sadly that's the wasteland. The real bad thing, like one of the NPCs said, is that now Megaton is controlled solely by Moriarty. Now I've got visions of coming back there and finding a town like Chicago in the Al Capone era.


Spoiler about Moriarty.....
Spoiler
If you kill him, after about 7 days, Gob's name appears on the saloon. Of course, the whole town will freak out when you off Moriarty, just run and hide for three days. I try to fit this into each roleplay.

User avatar
Emmie Cate
 
Posts: 3372
Joined: Sun Mar 11, 2007 12:01 am

Post » Sat Dec 04, 2010 5:58 pm

I never dentonated the bomb. What happens to the town if you do

I don't know, what normally happens when you set an atom bomb off in the center of a town?
User avatar
Rachel Cafferty
 
Posts: 3442
Joined: Thu Jun 22, 2006 1:48 am

Post » Sun Dec 05, 2010 3:57 am

I don't know, what normally happens when you set an atom bomb off in the center of a town?


It will turn all the inhabitants into pink fluffy unicorns dancing on rainbows!
User avatar
Lyd
 
Posts: 3335
Joined: Sat Aug 26, 2006 2:56 pm

Post » Sun Dec 05, 2010 6:04 am

(1.). If you choose the bad route of blowing Megaton up, who is ultimately morally responsible for the destruction? Obviously you as the player are the one to press the button, but Mr Burke is the one who gives you the Pulse Charge and the detonator, while none of it would have happened if Mr Tenpenny hadn't said "I don't like looking at that town over there, someone get rid of it (parallels to Henry II and "will no one rid me of this turbulent priest?") Or if you think all 3 of you, who bears most responsbility?

A. I think there's more than enough blood spilt to condemn all three of you. Matter of fact, if I were James, my conversation with my wayward LW would sound like this:

Me: "Is it true, did you blow up Megaton?"
LW: "Well, yes. So what?"
Me: "So this, you little monster." (shoots him between the eyes)


(2.). If you tell Lucas Simms about Burke, he runs off to arrest him but gets killed - should you as the player feel guilty? You're the one who's put Lucas in that position, but he's chosen to go, and Mr Burke is the one who pulls the trigger?

A. No, not really. Simms was the sheriff of Megaton, and dealing with malefactors like Burke is his job. The fact that he chose to turn his back on a suspect without patting him down for weapons shows excruciatingly bad judgment on his part.

Still, I generally choose to deal with Burke another way. Seducing him (as a Black Widow-equipped female), blowing him away myself, or just disarming the bomb right off (and therefore never encountering him) all work fine.
User avatar
joeK
 
Posts: 3370
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2007 10:22 am


Return to Fallout 3