Unkillable NPC's : V - Skyrim

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:56 am

Bethesda usually learns from mistakes, though, and they ARE on a new engine now, so it's not too far-fetched to believe that the cities (of which there are only FIVE) AREN'T open.

Sorry but what do open city's have to do with Unkillable npcs? And also... I want open city's and levitation... In Oblivion it made me really mad that the only way to enter the city was a main gate covered with guards... because of this my char shopped in Bruma! The only city with a secret exit...

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 1:57 am

Once upon a time, a rather angry poster came to the forums, ranting about the horrible, terrible, miserable, piece of crap game that was Morrowind.

He complained there was nothing to do. There were no quests, no jobs anywhere. Guards were always after his pc, everywhere.

After a series of questions, forum regulars figured out why he was having such a horrible time playing Morrowind.

He created a custom class; Murderer. He killed any npc he thought "dissed" his character. If he saw an npc with armor or a weapon he wanted, he killed them for it.

He killed just about every quest giver in the game, along with most of the named npcs that don't respawn. Even if he hadn't killed the quest giver, he had killed whoever you needed to talk to, find, or make the delivery to. The guards were after him because of the death warrant, the ordinators were after him simply because he kept killing them for calling him "scum".

When we pointed out that he had to have seen, several times over, the "You have severed the thread of prophecy" message, he admitted he had, but ignored it, since "you can do whatever you want in a Bethesda game." We told him the reason he couldn't find any quests was because he killed everyone. He couldn't finish the main quest because he not only killed Vivec, he killed Yagrum, Fyr, his daughters, most of the Ashlander clans, and most of Houses Hlallu and Redoran. He wiped out the wierdos who live in the mushrooms without stairs, too, but the Telvanni are the only ones you can kill without borking the main quest. He was absolutely pissed; you were supposed to be able to play the game your way, and his way was to kill everything and everyone. Bethesda should have considered that some people wanted to play that way and still make it possible to finish the game. He didn't appreciate finding out that there was an alternate path to let you finish the game, except that he killed everyone involved in that path, too. It was entirely Bethesda's fault for allowing him to ruin his game. I don't think he came back to the forums after that.

I don't think I want everyone essential. If things happen outside the player's control like in Oblivion though, it might be necessary to have some of the npcs set as essential, at least until you don't need them for a major quest anymore.

» Mon Mar 07, 2011 8:31 pm

Once upon a time, a rather angry poster came to the forums, ranting about the horrible, terrible, miserable, piece of crap game that was Morrowind.

He complained there was nothing to do. There were no quests, no jobs anywhere. Guards were always after his pc, everywhere.

After a series of questions, forum regulars figured out why he was having such a horrible time playing Morrowind.

He created a custom class; Murderer. He killed any npc he thought "dissed" his character. If he saw an npc with armor or a weapon he wanted, he killed them for it.

He killed just about every quest giver in the game, along with most of the named npcs that don't respawn. Even if he hadn't killed the quest giver, he had killed whoever you needed to talk to, find, or make the delivery to. The guards were after him because of the death warrant, the ordinators were after him simply because he kept killing them for calling him "scum".

When we pointed out that he had to have seen, several times over, the "You have severed the thread of prophecy" message, he admitted he had, but ignored it, since "you can do whatever you want in a Bethesda game." We told him the reason he couldn't find any quests was because he killed everyone. He couldn't finish the main quest because he not only killed Vivec, he killed Yagrum, Fyr, his daughters, most of the Ashlander clans, and most of Houses Hlallu and Redoran. He wiped out the wierdos who live in the mushrooms without stairs, too, but the Telvanni are the only ones you can kill without borking the main quest. He was absolutely pissed; you were supposed to be able to play the game your way, and his way was to kill everything and everyone. Bethesda should have considered that some people wanted to play that way and still make it possible to finish the game. He didn't appreciate finding out that there was an alternate path to let you finish the game, except that he killed everyone involved in that path, too. It was entirely Bethesda's fault for allowing him to ruin his game. I don't think he came back to the forums after that.

I don't think I want everyone essential. If things happen outside the player's control like in Oblivion though, it might be necessary to have some of the npcs set as essential, at least until you don't need them for a major quest anymore.

A thing I don't understand about this... why didn't he just create a new character... and I can't see how Bethesda "still allowed him to play the game and complete it in his own way" By simply not allowing him to play his way...

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:43 am

Unkillable storyline characters? Know who else is an important character who you can't complete the main story if they're dead? The PC. Clearly they should be unkillable as well.

Frankly, if you kill the main story characters, that's your own fault. I don't see any benefit in removing consequences from stupid things.

The only reason I see to have them, is that with the inclusion of Radiant AI, it might not always be the PC who is involved in killing/getting them killed. It's not really the player's fault if Caius ran out of money from his skooma habit, and tried to walk out of the fighters guild with a little brea but ended up with a sword in his lung.

» Mon Mar 07, 2011 11:33 pm

Once upon a time, a rather angry poster came to the forums, ranting about the horrible, terrible, miserable, piece of crap game that was Morrowind.

He complained there was nothing to do. There were no quests, no jobs anywhere. Guards were always after his pc, everywhere.

After a series of questions, forum regulars figured out why he was having such a horrible time playing Morrowind.

He created a custom class; Murderer. He killed any npc he thought "dissed" his character. If he saw an npc with armor or a weapon he wanted, he killed them for it.

He killed just about every quest giver in the game, along with most of the named npcs that don't respawn. Even if he hadn't killed the quest giver, he had killed whoever you needed to talk to, find, or make the delivery to. The guards were after him because of the death warrant, the ordinators were after him simply because he kept killing them for calling him "scum".

When we pointed out that he had to have seen, several times over, the "You have severed the thread of prophecy" message, he admitted he had, but ignored it, since "you can do whatever you want in a Bethesda game." We told him the reason he couldn't find any quests was because he killed everyone. He couldn't finish the main quest because he not only killed Vivec, he killed Yagrum, Fyr, his daughters, most of the Ashlander clans, and most of Houses Hlallu and Redoran. He wiped out the wierdos who live in the mushrooms without stairs, too, but the Telvanni are the only ones you can kill without borking the main quest. He was absolutely pissed; you were supposed to be able to play the game your way, and his way was to kill everything and everyone. Bethesda should have considered that some people wanted to play that way and still make it possible to finish the game. He didn't appreciate finding out that there was an alternate path to let you finish the game, except that he killed everyone involved in that path, too. It was entirely Bethesda's fault for allowing him to ruin his game. I don't think he came back to the forums after that.

I don't think I want everyone essential. If things happen outside the player's control like in Oblivion though, it might be necessary to have some of the npcs set as essential, at least until you don't need them for a major quest anymore.

Of course it would be an excelent idea to mark npcs important to the story. And give them at least two [though not unlimited] replacements.

» Mon Mar 07, 2011 10:40 pm

Unkillable storyline characters? Know who else is an important character who you can't complete the main story if they're dead? The PC. Clearly they should be unkillable as well.

Frankly, if you kill the main story characters, that's your own fault. I don't see any benefit in removing consequences from stupid things.

The only reason I see to have them, is that with the inclusion of Radiant AI, it might not always be the PC who is involved in killing/getting them killed. It's not really the player's fault if Caius ran out of money from his skooma habit, and tried to walk out of the fighters guild with a little brea but ended up with a sword in his lung.

I'm planing on making a mod witch tags the player as "essential"... "So you think you can kill me! HA! I can only be knocked unconsius...

» Mon Mar 07, 2011 10:16 pm

Unkillable storyline characters? Know who else is an important character who you can't complete the main story if they're dead? The PC. Clearly they should be unkillable as well.

Frankly, if you kill the main story characters, that's your own fault. I don't see any benefit in removing consequences from stupid things.

The only reason I see to have them, is that with the inclusion of Radiant AI, it might not always be the PC who is involved in killing/getting them killed. It's not really the player's fault if Caius ran out of money from his skooma habit, and tried to walk out of the fighters guild with a little brea but ended up with a sword in his lung.

Well this gives me an idea: Being marked essential makes the guy unable to getting killed by other people than the pc...

» Mon Mar 07, 2011 9:54 pm

But they arent children. They are pixels.

I really dont get it.

It kind of reminds me of the 1930's where there were people totally against their kids reading donald duck cartoons.
Because its not wholesome.

Silly people.

Anyway, I never kill random people. I only kill when I absolutely have to, or they attack first.
(Nightmares about oblivion, reloading and reloading cause I didnt want any named NPC to die at the battle for Bruma)
I liked Morrowinds system.
Maybe they can make it that if you kill a child you lose the favour of the gods and the main quest is broken?

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 5:18 am

But that guy DID get to play the game HIS way, which was to kill people-he got to kill a TON of people-who cares about quests when killing the quest-givers is just SO DARN FUN!!

Seriously, somebody should've just told him to create a new character and have him join the Morag Tong.

» Tue Mar 08, 2011 3:13 am

i assume their wont be that much children npcs in skyrim

» Mon Mar 07, 2011 11:32 pm

I do not want them, Sure they can't be killed, but they kill Immersion.
And the same reason i don't want Children. Sure they give the illusion of a living world, but all they are going to say is probably "Sorry I'm not allowed to talk to strangers." And magically have anything threatening phase right through them.