For textures (and sometimes meshes as well), there's also the fact that if you use resources from certain cg-resource-type websites, you can't give people permission to modify them because that would violate your license agreement with the site.

Otherwise, IMO a lot of the difference is in how much of yourself you put into your work (if you see what I mean), and why you made it in the first place. Personally, I liked making toys for other kids back when I was a kid, I didn't mind if they broke them or scribbled all over them as long as they enjoyed themselves, and I still like that sort of thing now. But there are also things I make for myself and put a lot of myself into. I often don't share those at all, and if I did I'd probably want to restrict what other people did with them.

What do you say we give this a little bumpity-bump? We seem to have a lot of new modders showing up lately, and it's going to increase. Perhaps us "old-timers" ought to help everyone else understand how we've managed to stay such a vibrant community for so long.

with a lot of schism, arguments, clashings, headbuttings, missunderstandings, over reations, demands, ego-grooming and just miss reading thats been going on recently, it couldnt be more important than now to bump this thread. Perhaps some "old-timers" need to be reminded about how this community stays strong. Just something to think about.

...and no one more suitable than you to bump it

I didnt bump it....

oh yes, approve the bump, and I repeat what I always say.

People shouldn't be so restrictive about licensing their works.
Consider that this happens even for mods that are largely based upon original Bethesda's works....
If I reuse an original Bethesda texture, and make it darker,

http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/8793/txabonemoldgahjulancuir.jpg

something that takes me 5-6 seconds, then I wouldn't say
"this work is MINE, and you cannot modify/redistribute it without my written consense, consense that most likely I am not going to give"
I would say:
"since my work is largely based upon someone's else work, and they allowed me to modify it and redistribute it, the least I can do, is to grant the same rights to the others that will use it."

And, even if I make something 100% original, when it comes to mods, consiidering that what I have done, is thanks to the ones who made Blender, NifSkope, Nif scripts, Gimp, Morrowind Scripting for Dummies etc... the least I can do, is to say "reuse at will".
I cannot really imagine why to say no.

to tell the truth, I'd like to add as condition "reuse just if you make something creative with it" but I have not done it yet,

I have some suggestions for additional points which are usually neglected by the TES III modding community

7. Criticism of your mod is not an attack against your person. If you are offered actual negative critism beyond derivates of "this svcks", you should take the time to think about it and at least respond with the same level of politeness offered to you (sometimes, it even pays off to be more polite than your critic). Very rarely should you respond with stock answers like "I do this as a hobby, don't criticise me", "then don't use the mod", or "I'm quitting the community because you attacked me".
You certainly don't owe anything to the people who download your mod, but they don't owe you anything either. Mutual respect is beneficial for both sides of the mod debate.

8. The internet is a vast place. If you offer your mod for download, inevitably someone will upload it somewhere else - be it as a favor for a friend who's blocked from download sites, as a means to subversly distribute the mod as their own, or even because they didn't really think about what they were doing. The most important thing to do is to keep calm and notify the authorities in question that you're really, really not okay with it. Offering the person up for ostracization should be your last method, not your first. Consequently, someone else going nuts about your mod is not something you should encourage. Ultimately, it's your copyright.

9. If you declare that you're okay with distribution method a (usually "I don't really care") in the readmes of your mods, later change your mind and declare distribution method b (usually "I really do care, please don't redistribute without asking me first") on a public forum, don't be surprised if not all people actually frequent this one forum and alternate downloads of your mod, which used to be perfectly fine until you changed your mind, keep cropping up all over the place.

10. Decide what you want and then stick to it. Telling off people who upload your mods against your wishes or put it in their big compilation is perfectly understandable. Doing so while at the same time gushing at a games magazine doing the very same thing makes you look like hypocrit. At least the guys on the internet don't make money with your mod.

Im in need toanswer to this commentary (as other veiled ones) cause I feel I has been included in this category, lol. I'm the childish modder that rage quit for strange ego reasons.

Well, its fairly evident everyone have a extreme different point of view depending of its modding implication. In my case I'm not doing a quest for a specific game in a specific engine. With this specificities I also can ask me, why one modder will not share his work with the community?, hah?.
In my own case, (an any particular work have its own particularities) I'm doing art material. A good amount of this art material is generic art, not specific for the game. This means than can be used in any other game or engine, in any other platform and for commercial purposes. Oh yes? money. Perhaps any one here knows that the morrowind compendium mod received money through paypal?. Any one can relate why in hell that mod was named compendium? Creating the confusion was part of the game. Oh, this project has restarted one more time, XD.

Its my prerogative and my responsibility to make the correct use of this material. In a closed environment, friendly and secure I or any other artist can take the decision to share his own material for free. In fact It was my first intention. Now I learned a lot more about the real situation with the game modding and development in general.
This is not a secure environment with a limited people interested. There are a mass of players of all around the planet downloading all material than they can get. Also people interested in art material for other reasons, you can imagine that.

I decided to delete my project for the net cause I don't want any worry with modding. I only want the relax to learn to become a better artist and the fun to mod a game. I don't want to stay alert of every coming of trolls. And I had been trolled a lot.
I taked some time on the net to read the reactions for all kind of community gamers about our mods and how they can be shared. The fact was a smack in my face. A lot of sites treated us and me specifically with a good amount of nice adjectives, talking of rpgwatch, rpgcodex, reddit (not specifically a game community), and german, italian, russian forums ....I forgot the name of the majority of game pages, some of they commercial. Every word was an insult for my intelligence. I had been insulted because I don't allow the use of my material in projects that stolen my and others art for money, superb.
I was in need that this forum community understand my real concerns and in need of direct support, but the reaction was the silence or the opposite with a good amount of people. Please don't start a discussion about that specific situation...now its too late to solve anything. I'm only trying to explain that there are a lot of different points of view about the same matter.

@ connary

thanks for developping your point of view towards this aspect of modding. Now I understand the situation. Farewell friend..

Do you mean me?

Seriously, this should probably be issue #0 on the list. If you don't want to have a discussion about a certain issue and nobody is actually discussing it, don't actively work on bringing it up or something like this.

Please don't turn this discussion into any sort of flame war. That would be the ultimate in irony....

Argh I really want to say something but I feel like it will be taken the wrong way and I will be excomunicated from the community.

Sigh - I am going to say this and if I get hate for it then so be: Connary, you've taken a post from april 2010 - made about 8 months be fore you left our community and now your using it as though its talking about you. You were still about, though not as active as you ahd been and yes you had a little spat before, but I can not see why you posted your response to that, talking about the current issuies.

I mean no offence but dragging up old stuff jsut seems a pointless exercise and then trying to fit a situation around a current one seems.... rather silly.

Now I got a lot of stick for pulling some anger out on a forumer goer over your work connary, and you left because of those comments which many have taken that I am the cause of your demise and its my fault you left yada yada and I most likly to get a lot of stick here now for this post - but I simply do not care anymore when someone leaves the community. People come and go all the time and I respect their decissions and reasons but I am ultimatly left with nothing else. Class that as rude but people come and go all the time - what makes individual cases so special? Yes I liked their work (their being those that leave), their ideas and thoughts were also welcome but if they (again talking in general here) left the community I am not going to feel a great ammount of emotion.

This is because people come and go all the time, that is how life works. Yes I will be sad for a bit but I will move on. What I dont understand is those that make a grand exit, then come back saying why then whenever a thread about copyright, forum ethics and conduct, the use of resources in another mod etc... you have to come in and say "Oh I left cause of this this this and this, this is wrong that is wrong and if its done this way then the world is doomed to be stuck up the rear end of some black hole" - essentially I am tired of reading the excuses and I dont want to be the one to make you stay away for ever but WE GET IT.

So flame me, ban me, spam me, hate me - but I really dont understand all the Melancholy drama.

This is the only thing you say here that makes me want to comment, because I have seen lots of direct support of you on this forum. Granted, its poor elsewhere, and that's largely attributed to the internet trolls that don't tend to post here (thank god). I think there are many people who frequent this board who support your stance and see that you have every right to do what you want to do with your content. They might not agree with you, but agreement is not a requirement to respect.

I'm glad you still are here, reading!

Flig, all-in-all, good points.

Farewell Connary. I'm surprised you endured the net children so much, may you walk on worm sands.

I like to make the world a better place. If that means someone gets a little extra enjoyment from playing Morrowind because they are using my mods, then I think that is really cool.

I've come across situations where mods have become lost forever because modder sites shut down and took all the files with them, and the original mod authors moved on from modding morrowind and did not re-upload their mods. That's why I do not mind if people re-upload my stuff to other sites. If I stop modding, or if I can't maintain my files, then I would want my mods - and their resources - to be re-uploaded so that other people can enjoy them or make use of them in their own mods.

I grew up hearing the whole thing about science "standing on the shoulders of giants" - new discoveries are based on previous research and previous discoveries by other people. I look for modder resources all the time, and I use them sometimes, too. I am happy that although it isn't a playable mod, the person who made the meshes/textures decided to upload them anyway. Likewise, I would not want to impede anyone from utilizing anything from my mods into their own creative endeavor.

That's just my perspective on it. I feel like I am part of a community where sharing is so important. If others had not shared their work and resources, I might not have been inspired or have the meshes I needed to make some of my own mods.

P.S. I LOVE YOU GUYS! :hugs:

I agree with Midgetalien, just because idiots decided to take someone on tooth (and they usually do for most people, not only specific ones like Connary in this very instance) doesn't mean that you need to leave, especially with double the amount of support you actually get. Same goes with feeling that you're being called out for every reference mentioned after that.


Also I'd like to add from personal unpleasant experience I recently had-

Try taking constructive criticism as what it is - constructive criticism, instead of childishly burn out taking it as an insult. Not all will like the work, and some people actually do like to give helpful advices without preparing it with some poison in it. And those should be replied to nicely, even if you do not agree with it.

I do have add another advice that goes for myself too- if you do run into arrogant and rude response do not let yourself get pulled in further personal flame war, and learn how to leave a fight with dignity and in time. Something I should work on, I admit, I totally piss off when I see overly ignorant reply.

Tho some people should also learn to judge the situation properly.

You are trying to be cynical? or perhaps naive? Discussing here about a good relations between community but take profit of the first opportunity to slap someone you don't like in the face. Definitely funny.



This as become a shiny irony, I'm so sorry.




Its curious, trying to explain my concerns had 0 interest or are a pointless exercise for a few ones, lol. Well, you know very well about drama, I'm talking about decisions. If you don't like it is your fault.



I don't say in any part that ALL people....but you know.




Farewelll then.

You've completly missed the point - your trying to take what I've said in general and made it out to be about you. I now really dont care about you or your work. I've never said anything about your work, I never said your concerns were no intresting - I said that you leaving would have no lasting impact on me. You've just proven to me a point that others have made and I refused to believe. YOu want to talk about drama? Oh I havnt started yet. As you you talking about decisions? your decision you leave? If I dont like that its my fault? Make sense man! I really couldnt care any less at the moment - you keep dragging up your reasons in threads that have nothing to do with your or your reasons to leave. YOu can post a comment that doesnt ahve to centre around you you know?

I posted a logical, non-violent, opintioned and yet tasteful (as in non-offensive) post and you've lashed out. Whos the drama queen here?

:shakehead:

My opinion is that I don't care.......

I care about the community here, but I do not care very much about how what I do is received or used. The only time I get defensive is when somebody disrespects other people, or talks to me like I am a child. :whistling:

I agree with those who have mentioned critique of others work. I personally avoid threads with work that I do not find very good, I do not want to start a fight with somebody who can not handle the truth. The community needs to lighten up when it comes to critique, it is one of the best ways to improve your work, getting advice and so on from people who are more experienced or anybody who might have a good idea. :foodndrink:

And smiley face. :liplick: :hubbahubba:

OP close request.