So, I am making a small mod that alters Dagoth Ur, the 7 ash vampires, Vivec, Almalexia and Her Hands. The idea is to make them tougher than they are in the original game, and change a few things that do not make sense.

Reasons:

*** Warning: Spoilers below ***

- If you have been far enough into the game, raised your skills decently and done other quests before the Main Quest, killing Dagoth Ur will be nothing more than a mere formality. This mod is meant to fix that. I felt the encounter with the Big Bad Wolf should be challenging even for the high level character with a bunch of powerful artifacts.

- The original Dagoth Ur is actually weaker than the Tribunal, which doesn't quite make sense. The very reason of the Main Quest is that the Tribunal was unable to defeat Dagoth Ur in the first place, so you are sent to do the dirty job in their stead. Fine. Now if you open the CS, you will find that Vivec and Almalexia have much better stats/abilities than the poor old Dagoth. I imagine this was meant to compensate the fact that Dagoth Ur is by far the hardest to kill until the Heart of Lorkhan is destroyed; having said that, you don't see how three gods could not be up to the task.

- When the Heart is destroyed, Dagoth Ur is severely weakened, while Vivec and Almalexia are not (their stats/abilities remain the same, whether the Heart has been killed or not): this is not fair.

- Her Hands benefit from Almalexia's divine power to some extent, while the ash vampires don't get anything interesting from their connection with Dagoth Ur (save for their devastating smile of course). This also is not fair.

I thus want to make changes so that:
- Vivec is stronger (more abilities);
- Almalexia is stronger (more abilities);
- Dagoth Ur is WAY stronger (more abilities, more health, more magicka, more melee damage, more everything);
- When the Heart is destroyed, Dagoth Ur, Vivec and Almalexia are weakened all three;
- Ash vampires have (lesser) divine abilities, due to their connection with their Lord;
- When Almalexia is killed, Her Hands are weakened as well (abilities reduced)
- Once you have killed Almalexia, Her Hands will attack you on sight

The changes I plan:

Almalexia

Without the mod:
Health: 3000 pts
Magicka: 1500 pts
Abilities: Resist Common Disease 100 pts, Resist Fire 100 pts, Resist Frost 50 pts, Resist Magicka 50 pts, Resist Normal Weapons 100 pts, Resist Paralysis 100 pts, Resist Poison 100 pts, Resist Shock 50 pts

With the mod:
1) Before the Heart is killed:
Health: 4000 pts
Magicka: 2500 pts
Abilities: Same as above + 50% Reflect (see "Her Mirror", one of Her Hands' abilities), Fortify Strength 75 pts, Fortify Attack 75 pts (see Vivec and Dagoth Ur), Fortify Agility 75 pts, Restore Health 10-20 pts

2) After the Heart is killed:
Health: 3000 pts
Magicka: 1500 pts
Abilities: Same as without the mod + 40% Reflect, Fortify Strength 50 pts, Fortify Attack 20 pts


Vivec

Without the mod:
Health: 3000 pts
Magicka 10000 pts
Divine Abilities: Fortify Strength 100 pts, Fortify Attack 50 pts

With the mod:
1) Before the Heart is killed:
Health: 4000 pts
Magicka: 10000 pts
Divine Abilities: Same as without the mod, + Spell Absorption 75 pts (see "Vivec's Feast", a purchasable spell), Restore Health 20 pts, Restore Magicka 20 pts

2) After the Heart is killed:
Health: 3000 pts
Magicka: 7000 pts
Divine Abilities: Fortify Strength 75 pts, Fortify Attack 30 pts, Spell Absorption 25 pts, Restore Health 10 pts


Dagoth Ur, 1st form (outside Akulakhan's Chamber)

Without the mod:
Health: 300
Magicka: 300
50-75 pts / 25-100 / 60-60 pts melee
Divine Abilities: Fortify Strength 100 pts, Fortify Attack 50 pts
"Wrath of Dagoth": Damage Health 5-50 pts for 3 secs, Damage Strength, Speed, Endurance, Agility, Willpower, Luck 1-3 pts on target

With the mod:
Health: 6000 pts
Magicka: 3000 pts
100-150 / 50-200 / 120-120 pts melee
Divine Abilities: Same as without the mod, + Spell Absorption 75 pts, Restore Health 20 pts, Restore Magicka 20 pts
"Wrath of Dagoth": Damage Health 50-75 pts for 3 secs, Damage Strength, Speed, Endurance, Agility, Willpower, Luck 1-3 pts on target


Dagoth Ur, 2nd form (inside Akulakhan's Chamber)

Without the mod:
Health: 1000 pts (reset every frame)
50-75 / 25-100 / 75-75 pts melee
Divine Abilities: Fortify Strength 100 pts, Fortify Attack 50 pts
"Wrath of Dagoth": Damage Health 5-50 pts for 3 secs, Damage Strength, Speed, Endurance, Agility, Willpower, Luck 1-3 pts on target

With the mod:
1) Before the Heart is killed
Health: 10000 pts reset every frame (so he will be much harder to kill "accidentaly", no more risk to break the main quest)
100-150 / 50-200 / 150-150 pts melee
Divine Abilities: See Vivec
"Wrath of Dagoth": Damage Health 50-75 pts for 3 secs, Damage Strength, Speed, Endurance, Agility, Willpower, Luck 1-3 pts on target

2) After the Heart is killed
Health: 2000 pts
Magicka: 1000 pts
100-150 / 50-200 / 150-150 pts melee
Divine Abilities: See Vivec
"Wrath of Dagoth": Same as above


Ash Vampires:

Adds "divine" abilities: Spell Absorption 20 pts, Reflect 20 pts, Restore Health 5 pts, Fortify Strength and Endurance 50 pts each (see Corprus)


Her Hands: still thinking.


The reason why I am posting this now is that I suddenly thought that, probably, this had been done before... In which case I would be grateful if somebody could tell me where to find the relevant mod, I will save my time and there is no point in a redundant mod anyway.
In case this has not been done yet (???) feel free to comment on the changes I plan.

Thanks in advance

You should make Almalexia run slower. She looks weird when she runs so fast.

It would be nice to see those battles become more interesting via some scripts as well as more challenging as opposed to the barrage of slashing and spells that they are.

Suggestion for the hands, I think they are tough enough pre-heart destruction. Maybe they could just lose some of their divine ability after the heart is destroyed and all of it once/if Almalexia has been killed.

I agree. The disappointment of those battles isn't really that they aren't harder than other battles, but they aren't any different than other battles. Personally, I found the large robot battle before Almalexia (was it Imperfect? something like that?) more interesting if not simply because it was large that made it different from other battles up to that point.

Understandably, that might be outside the scope of your purpose, but if you have the ability adding some scripts and making those battles more unique would be do a lot more towards making them fun and memorable fights. I know it's not as simple as it sounds though. I've been working on a small dungeon expansion mod and finished most of it but got stuck with some scripting problems that I haven't quite figured out how to work my way around.

... I think this is a really, really good idea. The abilities may need tweaking slightly (for instance, I don't think any of the gods should have Restore Health after the Heart is destroyed), but otherwise I'd say you've got it pretty much exactly right. The only thing I disagree on is the Hands attacking you after Almalexia's death - remember that they don't know you've killed her, and won't believe you if you tell them so. Maybe make it so they only attack you if you're stupid enough to mention it to them?

Scripted events during the battles could be fun as well, but that might be best addressed with a separate mod (for those of us who just want the 'boss battles' to be more of a challenge, without changing them too much). Are you thinking of doing anything with Hircine in Bloodmoon, btw?

These are great ideas.

I would like the heartwights / ash vampires to automatically respawn like they are supposed to (IIRC some documents in the game suggest they regenerate in the heart chamber if killed).
They should also be significantly stronger.

I'm not sure but the Greater Dwemer Ruins mod might already tweak Dagoth Ur's or ash vampire's stats.

BTW, it is possible in vanilla Morrowind to directly kill Dagoth Ur in the heart chamber with the right kind of weapon. The kind of weapon I'm talking about uses the cast-on-target glitch so that it imparts permanent and exponentially increasing Weakness to Magicka, combined with a small amount of Damage Health. I'm not sure but this could be dangerous if the enemy has Reflect, unless perhaps the player has Resist Magicka 100%. Against an enemy with 100% Resist Magic or 100% Reflect, it's probably ineffective.

Suggestion: make it modular or include an option without dagoth ur. Else it will conflict with Darknut's GDR.

I agree about the GDR. I think Darknut did plenty well with dagoth ur.

Thanks for feedback!



Sounds like a good idea, my knowledge in scripting is very limited to date but it is worth trying. Any suggestions?


Re the Hands: It would make sense that they attack you -- their abilities are weakened, so they "sense" something has happened, and besides you come back with Almalexia's sword. But yes, I may make it so their attack is triggered only if you are brandishing Hopesfire, or talk to them while having Hopesfire in your inventory... Something like that.
Re Bloodmoon: for the time being I am working on what is related to the War of the First Council, with which Hircine has nothing to do. Plus from my point of view, it would take a lot more than just tweaking Hircine to make the Bloodmoon quest interesting, which is way beyond the scope of this mod.


Sorry, I am missing a part here. What exactly do you have in mind? To make all the ash vampires you have killed wait for you in Akulakhan's Chamber for the final party?


Noted, I may have a look into it and see what he tweaked. In the principle, a modular version is no big deal.

Killing the ash vampires does/should weaken Dagoth Ur, right? Having them respawn in the final chamber seems like a great idea but I think it should be ensured that the player hunting down and killing them all is still somehow the more preferable option than leaving them alone and not having them appear in the chamber.

The hands: I always thought it was stupid that everyone had practically the same response regarding almalexia's disappearance. It would be nice to see that small portion of dialogue expanded upon if it isn't beyond the scope of this mod, possibly with different outcomes depending on your dialogue choices with them? Perhaps a small chance of persuading them that it is a blessing that they have been released from her service and some of them take the oppertunity to reture? Perhaps one of them wants to be taken to the scene of the crime or have it proven by the fact that you now hold her sword? And of course the 'Imma kill you' option. Just some suggestions... Not sure if I like the idea of having that whole stack of expensive enchanted armour as a reward though... but maybe other people thing it would be worthwhile.

The battles: I'll start with Vivec as the battle with him was the most disappointing for me. This guy is supposed to be capable of amazing things, right? Instead you are just trapped in a hole with him whilst he shoots fireballs at you. I think I remember reading that he is able to 'awaken' from death or something of the sort, so if he is killed before the heart has been destroyed, he shouldn't be permanently killable.

Ideas for twists on the battle:
- Transformation, change into something with a more formiddable appearance.
- Conjuration, summon perhaps some weaker creatures or clones of himself, being a god he should have some degree of omnipresence.
- Teleportation, take you to a more interesting plane of battle to his advantage.
- Scale, make himself huge (eh, why not, imperfect was a pretty cool fight, I might have him go for a more physical assault in this form though).
- Astral form: Perhaps after being knocked out once? He could fly and be partly invisible in this form for aesthetics. I think he should be closer to invulnerable in this state but weaker on the offensive to balance things out. (this form shouldnt be available if the heart has been destroyed)
- The warrior: Finally he should attack you with his spear (a new artifact?) in the form that he is depicted in, in the statues and stories and you can loot the spear from him after as a reward for all the extra trouble that you went through

I think the UESP says that this is a bug in the game, and while it should (it is specifically part of Vivec's battle plans he gives you, in order to soften up Dagoth Ur) there is no evidence that this is actually occuring. At the very least this bug should be fixed, so that each vamp killed means a distinct reduction in his power. As a compensation the ash vampires should indeed be made stronger.

I'm interested to see how this works out. The underlying premise that you as a single non-god player can succeed where three gods failed is... bizarre, to say the least. The stats obviously need looking into. I definitely like the idea of stat reduction for the Tribunal when the Heart of Lorkhan is destroyed, even if it is a reduction to vanilla from an enhanced level.

Hahaha, see what he tweaked? He rewrote the entire ending sequence.

Nice idea.

Tho I don't see why should Her Hands attack you on sight, no one even knows you killed Alma, and even when you say it to someone they don't belive you. They can't even know by "connecting" with her, since she's dead, nothing to connect with there

EDIT: on a side note, maybe they should attack if you tell THEM you killed Alma.

I'm not sure the Hands should lose any powers after Almalexia is killed. She's already lost her divine powers, after all (assuming you've finished the MW main quest), so I'm guessing the powers she gave them are permanent effects, like the reward you receive for http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Tribunal:The_Missing_Hand. As for the sword, she could have given it to you (assuming you even have it, and that they notice you have it.)

As far as I know the script that weakens Dagoth Ur depending on the number of ash vampires killed was broken in the original game, but has been fixed since (in the Morrowind Patch Project, IIRC)



Had a look in the CS and Darknut effectivily made a lot of things, however very little changes were made to the scripts I had in mind (e.g. the script attached to the Heart of Lorkhan) so it shouldn't be that difficult to make the mod I have in mind and his compatible, although I would have to play GDR to see exactly what's going on...
Anyway, my plan is to make it modular (1 separate esp for each god) so that everyone can choose.



I see your point and maybe it would be more consistent to leave the Hands alone after all... although having an excuse to kill them sounded very nice to me (God, I hate Ordinators)

Her Hands are actually kind of rough. Do they really need to be changed?

They are really easy if you're higher level like 40 or so and with decent equipment, so yeah, I think they should.

My goodness, I had not foreseen it would take such a long time to change a script - scripting is indeed more subtle than expected. But I am done with it and I am pretty happy with the result. I tested the mod and as far as I can see, my scripts are running flawlessly, so I realease it to see what you think.

http://www.2shared.com/file/hG8fnApJ/Tougher_Deities_-_Heart_of_Lor.html

So, here is the first part of my project: the Heart of Lorkhan.

Initially I just intended to slightly change the LorkhanHeart script so as to add a few features. But this script in so awkwardly written (in respect of my purpose) that I eventually had to rewrite it from scratch, more or less. In the meantime, I had new ideas which I put into the final script; I hope you will find them interesting.

It thus occured to me that, while Almalexia, Vivec, Sotha Sil and Dagoth Ur became gods by tickling the Heart with Kangrenac's Tools (the very tools you are given to destroy it), when YOU, the Nerevarine, hit the Heart with Keening and Sunder, nothing happens. Not the slightest abilities you could use to con people and get your own worshippers. Nada. Peanuts. Kind of frustrating, isn't it? So I remade the script so that it is now *possible* to get "divine abilities". Such abilities will be permanent - they will remain after the Heart is destroyed, although its death will weaken them.

Some will say that, given my initial purpose (i.e. to make the encounters with the gods more challenging), it is rather contradictory to grant the player new abilities. Well the thing is, the abilities you will get depend on the way you handle the Heart (and your luck at it!) and not all those abilities are good; some may be a handicap in your fight against Dagoth Ur, and some will even make the game unplayable. (!) Hey, the Heart does not grant power willingly...
I made it so it is possible for the player to end up with nothing but pretty good things, but this may require a good deal of patience and/or luck; and let us not forget that while you experiment on the Heart, Dagoth Ur will keep attacking you which is why, despite the new powers you may get, at the end of the day the whole thing is more tricky.

(Not to mention the fact that handling the Heart wrongly will lead to certain death )

When I say I "tested" the mod, I only mean that everything works as expected. I do not mean it is balanced (not quite sure about that, at this point). Some may find this too easy, some others too difficult... I may amend the mod depending on the general feedback I get.

Here's the Readme included in the archive: