Advantages and Disadvantages. : V - Skyrim

» Tue May 17, 2011 9:47 am

That is pretty much saying that in the Elder Scroll perspective, Birthsigns and "Oblivion" perk are the "same"; for a Fallout example, Traits and Perk are the same as well.

Remember that Birthsign is a "bastardized" version of Advantages and Disadvantages and Oblivion have shown to have both system.

Also remember that inherent does not automatically mean "gain" or "learn". That is what make Birthsigns/Advantages and Disadvantages/Trait different from Perks.

I agree :nods: the birth sign system (though nice) was not as good as the A/D system.

» Tue May 17, 2011 3:06 pm

Definitely has potential to be a sweet system, but it looks like perks is about as close as we are gonna get.

» Tue May 17, 2011 10:14 am

Was there a mod for this in OB or MW?

» Tue May 17, 2011 7:09 am

The only thing I found utterly dull was making characters of the same race. I just couldn't really get the feel of a unique character except through aesthetic means. I loved this feature in Daggerfall, and it'd be great to see it make a return.

» Tue May 17, 2011 9:31 am

Still it's probably as unlikely as bringing back attributes like they had them for daggerfall or arena.

» Tue May 17, 2011 12:37 pm

I'm a believer that any "perk" you choose should have a cost associated with it. And not a monetary one, that's too easy.

» Tue May 17, 2011 3:27 am

Advantages and disadvantages have continued to figure in TES--unless you roll Bretons. ;-)

» Tue May 17, 2011 10:40 am

They're moving away from making choices at the start more and more with each installment, so the chance of them doing this again is very, very small. Basically, nobody who plays the game for the first time without reading into it a lot will have a clue into what they have to choose. That's a huge downside to the system, particularly from a business point of view. Simply said, people that are overwhelmed with complex choices that early on in the game are more likely to throw the game aside. And that will hurt sales in the long run.

They're moving more towards making these choices as you play (perks are a good example) so you might see some perks with effects similar to the old advantages/disadvantages.

» Tue May 17, 2011 4:33 am

Fallout New Vegas has 'em. And some reasonably interesting ones at that.

I love these in RPGs, they are generally linked to a little detail on your character's background, so they have a dual function of altering gameplay a little (especially the first couple of levels) and fleshing out your character's background. And they can always just be ignored if they don't fit or you don't like the advantages / disadvantages.

Slower levelling is a fine penalty for taking advantages, but only if the world is not overly level-scaled...

» Tue May 17, 2011 1:47 pm

Not completely true. Advantages and Disadvantages is inherent trait that one can put themselves to be strong/weak as certain parts right at the beginning of the game, in which I assume the perk in talking involve leveling up and obtain certain ability through this (alias Fallout). For example, I can make my self resistance to magic but I have to "equal" or balance it out by either making myself have the ability to burn be in the sunlight, not being able to use a certain type of weapon, and/or become afraid of a certain type of monster. Its basically customizable Birthsign System/Trait System on steroid.

If one want to have a good idea of what http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Daggerfall:ClassMaker#Special_Advantages and http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Daggerfall:ClassMaker#Special_Disadvantages, just click the respected link.

Yes advantages and disadvantages was cool, however I mostly used them to gain advantages myself. High elf with critical weakness to paralyze, not allowed using orcish armour; high elfs was immune to paralyze and orcish armour was rarer than daeric.
The problem here is that most players would use it to exploit and/ or wreck their character.
But it had been cool as a design your birthsign tool.

» Tue May 17, 2011 8:39 am

but one of the most enjoyable things about having a character is making the character. I really love character creating, to me it's very essential in personalizing him. The new method in my opinion makes him less personal in the beginning, but as you grow making more and more personal, sure it's a different approach but I still like the original.

Its not that your not making your character its that your character is made during game not right at the start. The things you do make your character.

» Tue May 17, 2011 1:09 am

I would say leave it with the awesome game Daggerfall as it wouldn't fit in Skyrim. It's a great system that I loved in Daggerfall but just like Morrowind, things from it don't need to put in a game that the feature doesn't fit in.

» Tue May 17, 2011 11:35 am

This would add lots of depths for role playing I think, so I'm all for it

» Tue May 17, 2011 1:56 am

This would add lots of depths for role playing I think, so I'm all for it

I feel ya. :wink_smile:

» Tue May 17, 2011 9:10 am

Reminds me of traits from the FO series.

Of course I would welcome it.

But I would get rid of the whole slowing leveling. I would make it that if you picked an advantage, you MUST pick something to equal it in disadvantage. but that could get tricky.

» Tue May 17, 2011 11:57 am

Reminds me of traits from the FO series.

Of course I would welcome it.

But I would get rid of the whole slowing leveling. I would make it that if you picked an advantage, you MUST pick something to equal it in disadvantage. but that could get tricky.

I really liked it, if you made the game harder you could level faster (assuming you can handle it

) and if you make it easier than you'll need to work harder, though adversity comes strength. but I like the option of balancing it too.

» Tue May 17, 2011 1:55 pm

I really liked it, if you made the game harder you could level faster (assuming you can handle it

) and if you make it easier than you'll need to work harder, though adversity comes strength. but I like the option of balancing it too.

My favorite mechanic of it is that you can choose to have these buffs/debuffs only in certain areas or during night or day.

Would allow people who want to RP a vampire or werwolf to make something from scratch.

Also a weakness to weaponry is good for werewolf PC to be weak against silver weaponry.

» Tue May 17, 2011 10:23 am

It made classes mean more, but in a classless game like Skyrim, it can't be implanted.

And why not?

New Vegas is a classless game, and a similar system is in it.

» Tue May 17, 2011 5:00 am

My favorite mechanic of it is that you can choose to have these buffs/debuffs only in certain areas or during night or day.

Would allow people who want to RP a vampire or werwolf to make something from scratch.

Also a weakness to weaponry is good for werewolf PC to be weak against silver weaponry.

If i'm not mistaken you can become a were-wolf in daggerfall.

» Tue May 17, 2011 9:44 am

Not at start no. However, I would like to see it worked into Skyrim's perk system. Every level up you can pick a perk that can give you a healthy advantage, but also give you an advantage at the same time. Should be worked into birthsigns as usual too.

» Tue May 17, 2011 11:34 am

If i'm not mistaken you can become a were-wolf in daggerfall.

Probably, but it still helps in rping none the less.

» Tue May 17, 2011 5:49 am

Not at start no. However, I would like to see it worked into Skyrim's perk system. Every level up you can pick a perk that can give you a healthy advantage, but also give you an advantage at the same time. Should be worked into birthsigns as usual too.

Probably, but it still helps in rping none the less.

I wonder what the advantages and disadvantages are to having it at the start as opposed to being implemented through the course of the game?

» Tue May 17, 2011 12:48 pm

Sounds interesting, but I don't think it will be in Skyrim. Maybe the next game :thumbsup:

» Tue May 17, 2011 11:09 am

I loved that system in Daggerfall, but I'm doubtful that they'd bring it back for future games. There have been two games since with no (dis)advantages system whatsoever, and I'm thinking it's gone for good.

It'd be nice if it came back, though, I thought it was a great system.

» Tue May 17, 2011 4:32 am

I fully approve of this. As much as I love Morrowind (my favorite TES game by far) their decision to replace it with birthsign was less than appreciated, to me.

And it was conflicting with the whole lunar-based morphology of the playable Khajit in the game, I recall.