Best way to archive important files?

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 7:12 am

I think that having a file on multiple HDDs might be a bad idea since they are vulnerable to the same kind of environments.

Other than burning onto DVDs, are there other media that can be used as third/fourth etc... formats for backup along with the HDDs?
User avatar
maya papps
 
Posts: 3468
Joined: Mon Aug 07, 2006 3:44 pm

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 2:41 pm

dropbox
User avatar
Dalley hussain
 
Posts: 3480
Joined: Sun Jun 18, 2006 2:45 am

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 9:07 am

You can use online storage. such as carbonite which is a good site:
http://www.carbonite.com/

But I just 7-zip my files and store them on an external hard drive because I don't have the bandwidth to to that.
User avatar
meg knight
 
Posts: 3463
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2006 4:20 am

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 6:38 am

DVDs are worthless for data backups. Why?

1. DVDs are local and limited in writes, making them cumbersome for backups and no better than an offline HDD

2. Burned media has a short lifespan and very prone to weather conditions such as heat, humidity, and sun exposure. Archival-grade optical media is not something in the realm of feasibility for anything other than large companies

HDDs, Solid-state storage, and off-site storage are the only forms of storage worth considering. Here is my modified version of the 3-2-1 rule for data backups

3 - 3 copies of any important file on 3 different storage devices (aka: your primary copy and two redundancies)

2 - In two states (one online -- as in currently active, and one offline -- as in not powered)

1 - and one backup is not in the same place as your primary copy

Ideally 1 means off-site storage, but that is not always simple to implement. It at least should not be in the same room as your PC.

Some ways to accomplish 1 include:

1. NAS on the other end of your house

2. Backing up to a friend's computer over the Internet (there are techy ways to do this, and for the rest there is CrashPlan)

3. Setting up a backup trade program with a friend (You have three copies: primary, backup 1, and backup 2. Backup 1 and 2 are encrypted. You give backup 1 to your friend at the beginning of the month and he gives you his backup 1. Throughout the month you back up to backup 2. At the beginning of the next month, your friend and you swap your held backups. Now you backup to backup 1 throughout the month and your friend has your backup 2. You keep swapping at the beginning of every month -- an effective offline off-site backup system)

4. You keep an encrypted backup at your work. (works like the above, but your off-site backup gets kept at work instead of a friend's house)

5. use a cloud service (Carbonite, CrashPlan, etc)

dropbox

Dropbox's premium offerings just aren't price-competitive for online backups. Dropbox's main aim is for file syncing, not data backups. Great for projects, otherwise not much.
User avatar
Elizabeth Lysons
 
Posts: 3474
Joined: Fri Feb 02, 2007 7:16 am

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 3:04 pm

HDDs, Solid-state storage, and off-site storage are the only forms of storage worth considering. Here is my modified version of the 3-2-1 rule for data backups


I thought that SSDs, along with all flash memory, are unreliable?
User avatar
Amy Melissa
 
Posts: 3390
Joined: Fri Jun 23, 2006 2:35 pm

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 12:33 am

Dropbox's premium offerings just aren't price-competitive for online backups. Dropbox's main aim is for file syncing, not data backups. Great for projects, otherwise not much.

It might be a bit expensive, but it's extremely convenient.

I backup my laptop hard drive every 2 weeks to an external drive, but I use 100GB dropbox account for work related files and it is always synced on desktop/laptop/work computer/iphone without thinking about it.

I went through a few different laptops during 2010 and it was convenient to have everything on dropbox.
User avatar
-__^
 
Posts: 3420
Joined: Mon Nov 20, 2006 4:48 pm

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 4:13 am

I thought that SSDs, along with all flash memory, are unreliable?


The life expectancy for most current SSDs is much longer than traditional hard drives.
User avatar
Amy Melissa
 
Posts: 3390
Joined: Fri Jun 23, 2006 2:35 pm

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 8:55 am

The life expectancy for most current SSDs is much longer than traditional hard drives.

Which brand offers the most reliable SSDs? (speed doesn't matter).
User avatar
Amanda Leis
 
Posts: 3518
Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2006 1:57 am

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 5:45 am

I thought that SSDs, along with all flash memory, are unreliable?

They are limited in some respects, and much more expensive per gibibyte, but they don't share the same weaknesses as regular magnetic drives, so they are an acceptable medium for backups.

The life expectancy for most current SSDs is much longer than traditional hard drives.

Depends on what you are doing. Their life expectancy is neither necessarily longer nor necessarily shorter. This is why they are an acceptable medium for backup, as they are just plain different.

It might be a bit expensive, but it's extremely convenient.

I backup my laptop hard drive every 2 weeks to an external drive, but I use 100GB dropbox account for work related files and it is always synced on desktop/laptop/work computer/iphone without thinking about it.

I went through a few different laptops during 2010 and it was convenient to have everything on dropbox.

Like I said, Dropbox is great for syncing, but absolutely horrible for online backups. Don't get me wrong, I love Dropbox for what it is, but let's take a look at the paid-service alternatives:

Remember: Dropbox is $200/yr for 100 GiBs

https://www.sugarsync.com/products/sync_pricing.html: $150/yr for 100 GiB, but we can still do better. Not to mention it isn't limited to a single folder like Dropbox

https://spideroak.com/pricing: $100/yr for 100 GiB, once again it isn't limited to a single folder like Dropbox, but I think we can still do better.

http://www.wuala.com/en/pricing/: $130/yr for 100 GiB, BUT you can trade your local storage for free backup storage, meaning it could potentially be almost free. However, we still might just barely be able to do better

http://explore.live.com/windows-live-mesh-sync-p2p-using?os=other: Completely free for up to potentially 400 GiB, but it is completely Peer-to-Peer syncing, you don't get the cloud aspect.

Not to mention for just cloud-based backups the standard price is between $50-75 unlimited, significantly less than Dropbox, and CrashPlan can potentially do it unlimited for free.

Edit: two more services:

http://www.livedrive.com/Promotion/mozy - $128/yr through their promotional offer for unlimited backup and syncing.

http://us.trendmicro.com/us/products/personal/safe-sync/index.html - $60/yr for unlimited syncing and backup


So in case you haven't gotten it yet: Dropbox just doesn't offer competitive prices at all, but I still love their free service
User avatar
Lynette Wilson
 
Posts: 3424
Joined: Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:20 pm

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 10:53 am

I would say external storage and then some off site location, however if you do have data that will not change often you could use DVDs even with their limited life. By the time the DVD dies (assuming its taken care of so in good condition) will probably outlast the need for the data on the disc itself. Hard drives are a good place to store stuff, if you are worried about a failure setup some version of RAID that would give the amount of redundancy you would like.
User avatar
Aman Bhattal
 
Posts: 3424
Joined: Sun Dec 17, 2006 12:01 am

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 3:29 pm

My 2 cents....

DVDs are worthless for data backups. Why?

1. DVDs are local and limited in writes, making them cumbersome for backups and no better than an offline HDD

2. Burned media has a short lifespan and very prone to weather conditions such as heat, humidity, and sun exposure. Archival-grade optical media is not something in the realm of feasibility for anything other than large companies


Not entirely true. Yes, they are local and limited in writes, but for periodic archiving, the DVD is 100X more durable than any solid-state or external HDD storage which can be affected by magnetic and EM discharge. A quality brand DVD can last upwards to 50 years with proper storage. Archival-quality media IS NOT all that expensive. I do file archiving for a law office and we use Taiyo Yuden which is rated near the top for quality and durability. You might have to shop around to get the best price, but it's not all that more expensive than what you get from brand names in stores.

HDDs, Solid-state storage, and off-site storage are the only forms of storage worth considering. Here is my modified version of the 3-2-1 rule for data backups

3 - 3 copies of any important file on 3 different storage devices (aka: your primary copy and two redundancies)

2 - In two states (one online -- as in currently active, and one offline -- as in not powered)

1 - and one backup is not in the same place as your primary copy


Solid state or external HDDs are great for routine backups of files...especially files prone to change over time. An image to more than one external drive is more than enough redundancy for most people (what are the odds of BOTH drives failing at the same time as the source HDD).

Online backups are of mixed value.

First, time to perform. If you don't have broadband...forget it. You'd never get it done over dial-up.

Second, security. Anything NOT in your possession is always subject to someone trying to steal it. For 99% of PC users, maybe you have nothing to fear, but I would never advise online archiving for anything proprietary, R&D, etc. For all the promise of encryption, security, etc., until an online backup service agrees to contractually indemnify someone for any and all harm that comes from their file storage being breached, never trust it for personal information that could be used to steal your identity or anything that could compromise you legally if it fell into the wrong hands.

Admittedly, I'm paranoid, so I really don't trust online archiving for ANYTHING I'm not already comfortable with sharing with anyone who is interested.
User avatar
latrina
 
Posts: 3440
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:31 pm

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 2:20 am

My 2 cents....



Not entirely true. Yes, they are local and limited in writes, but for periodic archiving, the DVD is 100X more durable than any solid-state or external HDD storage which can be affected by magnetic and EM discharge. A quality brand DVD can last upwards to 50 years with proper storage. Archival-quality media IS NOT all that expensive. I do file archiving for a law office and we use Taiyo Yuden which is rated near the top for quality and durability. You might have to shop around to get the best price, but it's not all that more expensive than what you get from brand names in stores.

You are, like most people, mistaking pressed DVDs with burned DVDs. Burned DVDs are created by a chemical reaction and is by it's very nature volitile. The life expectancy of a burned disc is under 7 years (it can of course be extended 3 or 4 times with extreme care and a solidly made disc, but not what most people do). Life expectancy of a pressed disc is 50-200 years depending on the reflective metal used. All DVDs are susceptible to heat and direct light exposure, but the chemicals in burned DVDs make them much more susceptible to it. So unless you are keeping them in your refrigerated closet, your standard burned disc just doesn't last. I've killed burned media in under 6 months by putting it in my car during the summer.

EM discharge won't harm your backups so long as you keep one offline at all times, though magnetic can still wreak havoc with an HDD offline, but that would be deliberate and have to be a strong force, unlike how easy it is to have accidental damage occur to your burned DVDs.

Maybe it's becuase of where I live, but burned media is faaaaaaar too susceptible to environmental conditions for me to consider it a viable method of archival anymore. Now if I could press my own DVDs, I'd be all-in, but I don't have that capability :P

Online backups are of mixed value.

First, time to perform. If you don't have broadband...forget it. You'd never get it done over dial-up.

Which is why many online backup service providers will mail you a drive to put your data on for initial backup.

Second, security. Anything NOT in your possession is always subject to someone trying to steal it. For 99% of PC users, maybe you have nothing to fear, but I would never advise online archiving for anything proprietary, R&D, etc. For all the promise of encryption, security, etc., until an online backup service agrees to contractually indemnify someone for any and all harm that comes from their file storage being breached, never trust it for personal information that could be used to steal your identity or anything that could compromise you legally if it fell into the wrong hands.

Admittedly, I'm paranoid, so I really don't trust online archiving for ANYTHING I'm not already comfortable with sharing with anyone who is interested.

1. If your computer is online, the risk is just about the same. Unlike the backup your data isn't encrypted and offline, but online and unencrypted with generally very weak protections in place compared to a company

2. You can do online backups to another computer in your possession/friend's computer

I don't like cloud-based services for a number of reasons, but what you said right here just isn't true. Of course you definitely shouldn't be backing up confidential work files to another service, but that's because you could lose your job over that. Also any technical work environment does their own backup, which is also online. Online backups are important because it is off-site.
User avatar
Tinkerbells
 
Posts: 3432
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2006 10:22 pm

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 12:35 pm

It depends how much you want to store and how often I guess.
For me DVD's and CD's are handy and at least can be stored with the software I need to use them with.
Online sites for videos and photos that I may want in the future but don't need day to day.
User avatar
Jessie Rae Brouillette
 
Posts: 3469
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 9:50 am

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 12:23 pm

I tend to use Wuala for backing up my data ('important' stuff like classwork and my mod work for Oblivion). I don't use it for anything I want to keep confidential (but then again I don't store much banking / financial stuff on my computer - I go to a bank for that).

Wuala uses http://www.daemonology.net/blog/2008-11-07-wuala-security.html (warning: lots of crypto-speak in the link) - but if you're reallllly paranoid, you could easily set it up to encrypt your sensitive data using something like TrueCrypt before letting Wuala get at it. An easy example would be to have a WualaData folder and a Data folder / TrueCrypt volume file. Everything goes into the TrueCrypt volume, then into the WualaData folder, which is then backed up to Wuala or synced to your off-site system once it detects changes (this last bit is useful if Wuala goes "poof" tomorrow).

I personally consider Wuala to be a great cloud storage service - if you have spare hard-drive space and some time, you can basically "get out" as much as you put in to the cloud (uptime notwithstanding).
User avatar
Lauren Graves
 
Posts: 3343
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2006 6:03 pm

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 9:33 am

I've killed burned media in under 6 months by putting it in my car during the summer.


Well....DUH!

:lol:
User avatar
Natasha Biss
 
Posts: 3491
Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 8:47 am

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 3:33 am

Well....DUH!

:lol:

:rolleyes: the point is that burned media is faaar to susceptible to the environment to be honestly considered quality archival media. They are just too volatile and require significant upkeep over HDDs and solid-state. Yeah, they can last a couple decades with extreme care, but an HDD can easily last a couple decades and then some without any issues by only having it powered-on during backups. Not to mention so long as the platters are not exposed to strong magnetic fields -- which don't really exist in your home -- data recovery is always possible from the platters. Burned media, on the other hand, degrades over time and eventually the dyes are damaged beyond recovery.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optical_disc_recording_technologies#Longevity

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CD-R#Expected_lifespan

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD_recordable#Longevity

The best consumer option, IMO, is solid-state media, but it is quite expensive. It is the most expensive, but also least volatile digital storage medium accessible to your average consumer. HDDs have spinning parts so they are a little more volitile than SDDs as well as having a few more risks in environmental damage, but overall still a solid backup option. Both are effectively backup and forget options.
User avatar
Ron
 
Posts: 3408
Joined: Tue Jan 16, 2007 4:34 am

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 2:13 am

Aren't SSDs also vulnerable to EM fields?
User avatar
Angel Torres
 
Posts: 3553
Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 7:08 am

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 5:01 am

Aren't SSDs also vulnerable to EM fields?

A common mis-belief is that an EMP would fry all electronics. It just isn't true. Your electronic needs be on to be damaged.

SSDs are more vulnerable to EM fields, but so long as they are unplugged, any EM field you are going to be exposed to won't cause them any troubles. (every electronic produces an EM field, so if just any field could hurt them, they'd be FUBAR'd from the start. If it was next to a transformer exploding, it might be damaged, but the transformer exploding would probably do more damage to it than the em field it produces :P)

On the other hand, sunlight and heat, which damage burned media, are everywhere in plenty large quantities to destroy burned media.
User avatar
A Boy called Marilyn
 
Posts: 3391
Joined: Sat May 26, 2007 7:17 am

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 3:06 am

A common mis-belief is that an EMP would fry all electronics. It just isn't true. Your electronic needs be on to be damaged.
Indeed. EMPs will also only damage unshielded electronics, as well. Basically most, if not all, military-grade electronics is shielded in some form against EMP. Putting electronics inside a Faraday cage would also protect them against an EMP field.
User avatar
Emmi Coolahan
 
Posts: 3335
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2007 9:14 pm

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 12:36 pm

Compress it to RAR, recompress it with 7z, mux it into an MKV container, burn it to a CD, rip the CD to an ISO, prepare it with ECM, compress it with UHA, burn it to a DVD and rip it, embed the ISO in an image, save it to a flash drive, put the flash drive in a steel safe, put the safe in your car trunk and put the car at the bottom of the South Pacific Ocean.
User avatar
sarah simon-rogaume
 
Posts: 3383
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2007 4:41 am

Post » Tue May 17, 2011 8:00 am

Compress it to RAR, recompress it with 7z, mux it into an MKV container, burn it to a CD, rip the CD to an ISO, prepare it with ECM, compress it with UHA, burn it to a DVD and rip it, embed the ISO in an image, save it to a flash drive, put the flash drive in a steel safe, put the safe in your car trunk and put the car at the bottom of the South Pacific Ocean.
Rube Goldberg's guide to information preservation? :P
User avatar
Yama Pi
 
Posts: 3384
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2007 3:51 am


Return to Othor Games