When I started oblivion for the 2nd time, I felt as if by the time I was level 3, I was already powerful. Think about it, i already had 3k gold and better then most of the npc's out there. I already had a fine steel bow and sword. Then the next day I beat the game and Im now level 15 with insanely good stuff. In oblivion you level up way to fast and you become way to powerful to quick. I hope in skyrim there will be a level difficulty slider, so you can set how much longer or faster you level up.

Also It would be nice if you stared out only using crapy stuff like a knife or a dager, then you can get small upgrades from time to time. Also you get money to fast and it makes you feel like you can buy anything you want or need.


basicly It would be nice if it took you longer to level, get nice weapons, get money.
I don't want it to be so slow it bores you and makes it not fun, nor do I want to be god like by the time im level 20

EDIT: This would also make thievery more useful if you where poor.
EDIT 2: Im sick and don't feel well so thats why my grammer svcks 2day

typing toO fast to spell toO correctly. lol, but i get what you mean. You are supposed to feel powerful but sometimes you just felt like god. I'm hoping that with the new engine and level scaling that they will find a good balance.

Yeah I agree.. all you really have to do to prevent this in Oblivion is:

1. Slow the pace of leveling

2. Make the gold supply more sane (or have more useful gold sinks)

Oblivion, Fallout3's pacing was way way too fast..

part of that is fixed with the new way enemy levels, so it′s more likly youl encounter mobs that whop your butt if your not the right level.

sorry about the grammer and spelling, but I have been sick all week and its hard to type lately. =(

Yes! I miss this from Morrowind. To scraqe out your left over cash for some small upgrades or to roam the country side trying to find money to sustain youself. Skyrim needs to have this feel. The feel of uprising and challenge - it is imprtant. (especially in a RPG)

If you're on PC there are many, many choices for mods to fix this

In fact, I'm sure I remember that there were mods that slowed the leveling (albeit basic ones) within a day or two of the game being released

True, however it also give me the option to do raids on bandits in the level 5 dungeons at level 3 and take their gear. the quest in Oblvion where you was locked inside a fort and attacked by hunters was a nice way to get good stuff around level 10-12 as they had pretty high level and good stuff.
Yes going after stronger enemies are dangerous but doable if you are well prepared with lots of healing potions and careful.

It seemed to sort of flip between Morrowind and Oblivion. In Morrowind you worked your way up (walking into certain dungeons you would die almost instantly at a low level), but at higher levels you could defeat everything easily. In Oblivion you started off with better equipment, but as you went along you were not as powerful over other enemies. I believe it was more balanced in Fallout 3, I did not really start to feel really powerful until I was around level 30 (and even then there were times I had to go scrounging for ammo).

It's funny, because level scaling was designed to fix this, and it came nowhere close.

There do need to be more money sinks and more difficulty. You should be wearing iron or steel up to level 10 or so, and even after that only having a few pieces of more expensive armor. I think basically, less gold given as a result of quests, more long term punishments as a thief. Like, even if you are caught and go to jail, guards should recognize you, follow you, beat you up, even if you haven't committed a crime yet.

So basically, you make less gold, it's hard to make easy money stealing, and most of what you do make goes to buying new equipment or fixing your old stuff.

I found earning money a lot easier in Morrowind. :shrug:

This thread should be called "too powerful too quickly"

The problem in Morrowind was that there were several relatively valuable items that were available early in the game, and it wasn't that hard for low level characters to get them. Then, by selling them to Creeper for full value you could get several thousand gold soon after pitching up in Balmora.

Once you start doing quests you often ended up with super expensive bits of Daedric or Glass Armour, which meant that by Level 5 or around that point, you essentially already had more money than there were things to spend on.

It was a game balancing issue. The more expensive items were far too easy to get. Remember how you could simply help yourself to a gem in the Balmora Mages Guild that was worth 1000 gold? That was then compounded by the fact that none of the merchants ever sold anything worth buying for higher level characters.

Yea, totally agree. There was a really good economy system, and you could sell really expensive goods to a trader if you have sold him some less expensive goods before. It seemed real, not like in OB. I got maybe level 6 or 7 (with +5+5+5 attributes bonus) in MW in about two hours using just steeling goods, selling them to that richie scump and training. The economical system in OB was a FAIL :down:

I thought Todd Howard said you would level faster in Skyrim because of perks?
Don't know where it was though.

Not sure I'm following you. As you leveled up, you actually got weaker. You were powerful at low levels, but as you passed level 20 you became the weak one. I didn't see much faster leveling in Oblivion over Morrowind. Of course, I also didn't pick certain skills that level quickly so that I could increase my levels insanely fast, I actually picked skills that I used, which is how you keep leveling to an acceptable level. In Skyrim this will be different. You will level pretty quickly at the beginning but as you level, it gets slower and slower, which is what leveling typically should be. Normally in Oblivion, level 25 is where your character would typically stall. In Skyrim, you stall at level 50. Sounds great to me, we have 18 major skills now, better than any other TES game so far lol. For all we know, 18 skills with the new leveling system will be equivalent to having 50 skills.

Frankly, Morrowind was the easy game. I had no difficulty at all going through Morrowind. I didn't really have any in Oblivion either but at least there were some puzzles that you need to do which made Oblivion's difficulty higher such as finding the art thief quest and having to find the clues or having to trick a Khajiit village into believing the apocalypse had come. Ah, those were the good times.



Umm what? The economy in OB was fine. Just because you can't get ridiculous amounts of gold as easily doesn't mean the economic system is fail, it means it's on the right track to being better. The economy would've been perfect if it wasn't for the level scaling allowing bandits to have daedric armor so you would get rich at the end of the game. Up until level 18, the economy is perfect in OB. MW had it's own interesting economy but Oblivion's was fine, it was especially fine when you couldn't empty your inventory sometime because the merchants didn't have the money. I would like Skyrim merchants to have a limited amount of money but it needs to be more money than was in MW and it needs to have the same values as it was in OB where they would actually sell off the merchandise you sold them and their cash stores would refill to even more than was previously the max, which they didn't do in MW but they sort've did in OB when your mercantile level got higher.

Turn the difficulty up?

It was mentioned in the Game Informer podcast

If you do that then you will die alot faster and make you weaker, the counter part to that would to have individual sliders like, your damage, enemy damage, level speed and so on

I've got to disagree. Oblivions economy was bad. Merchants having an unlimited gold supply, but having a limit on how much money they can pay for 1 item was ridiculous.

Although both games fail when it comes to having anything worth buying. They should really have some items that are very expensive, but worth purchasing, and available at all times. The closest Oblivion had was the unique enchantments that were obsolete by the time you could buy them.

But back on topic, you could level very fast in Oblivon if you spent a full day "practicing" your skills. I mastered my magic skills, other than restoration, before I even left the sewers. But was that the games fault? No, I chose to grind. And also, because of level scaling, you were far more powerful as a level 1, because the enemies scaled as you leveled and often surpased you at a certian level. I never got mauled by a ninja bear at level 1, but I could make a montage of it by level 45.

I hope they fix the level scaling. I think they should also use a typical rpg approach where certian regions have a higher level, the wilderness chould actually be dangerous depending on where you are. Bandits in glass armor has always been, and will forever be, my worst memory of Oblivion.
Im pretty sure this is one thing they will fix, its probably their biggest complaint from Oblivion.

Not arguing that Oblivion and Morrowind's systems have flaws. Every system has flaws. I said that Oblivion's was a step in the right direction. I even pointed out that they need to stop having infinite gold but the rest of the economic system was the right direction that TES economy needed to go in.

Well it was completely not logical, that made me sad. I agree, they had to make something to MW's one. But they could just make the goods you sold to a trader disappear (get sold) over time, and that would make it impossible for you to sell super expensive items

Yes, you basically described Morrowinds system + gaining more money.
I don't see what was fine about Oblivions system. Having hundreds of items worth nothing? Surely it would be worth 1 piece of gold. Or several items being worth less gold, such as glass armor being worth less than before. Of course that could be argued as a good thing.
The only difference between Oblivions and Morrowinds was items generally costing less, although some costed more, and the infinite gold. The economy wasn't dynamic, it didn't learn that you had sold them 800 grand soul gems, so they were now worth less than before. It was static, other than items being sold were slightly level dependant which is bad.
"No, we don't carry dwarven armor, come back when you are level 8 or higher."

Of course as much as I would like a dynamic economy, its not a game breaker. It would take their focus off of other things which are far more important. Its just sad that mods are needed to fix oversights. They have had all of this time to make all of the core systems work, you would think that by this time in development (although us, the fans, are always wrong about this. Thats probably why we don't make games) they would be adding the polish, not still working on the core systems.

Well then I fail to see the point. If you feel you are too powerful, then wouldn't having a difficulty slider to make you feel weaker counteract that? You don't need to modify those individual things at all because it's just redundant.

I never felt like I got too powerful too quickly in Oblivion, but that's because the game's level scaling made it so that you didn't really feel more powerful as you gained higher levels at all. Sure, you started finding better items, and the numbers for your health, skill and attributes got better, but when everywhere you went you encountered enemies that got progressively stronger even as you did, it didn't amount to much beyond enemies and equipment looking more and more impressive. Now, Morrowind, on the other hand, did suffer from this problem. Admitably, the game started out a little slow in this regard because at the start, you'd die a lot if you weren't careful where you went or what you did, but once you got to the point where you had a bit more freedom in regards to where you could safely go, you'd star getting more powerful much more quickly, eventually reaching the point where nothing could threaten you, it was usually somewhere around level 20, the exact time depending on the character you created and how you'd been playing. But ultimately, it would happen. Hopefully, Skyrim will be better in this regard, though. It's been said that 50 is the level characters are usually going to reach, I hope that I can find a threat that will challenge me even when I reach level 50, that doesn't mean I don't want to get more powerful as I gain levels, I want to, otherwise leveling up seems unrewarding. But I don't want to feel like there's nothing in the world I should fear as soon as I reach level 20.



I think you also level faster because you're likely to reach higher levels than in Morrowind and Oblivion, but yes, he did say you level more quickly, that doesn't mean you get powerful more quickly, though, as that really comes down to how much of a reletive power increase for your character each level brings, and what the maximum level in the game is, or the maximum level you're likely to obtain is, since in the Elder Scrolls, it's not really generally a hard level cap that limits you're level but rather your skills.