This topic is to discuss the presence of game exploits in Skyrim, a game exploit being something which is part of the game mechanic that the player can basically abuse for their own benefit, but somehow makes little sense to remove.

The duplication glitch is there because to me it also represents infinite quest rewards.

I am strongly in favor of "game exploits" being present in Skyrim, because it shows a certain amount of inventiveness on the part of the player. In Morrowind, for example, having a 2-point constant effect restore health enchantment didn't help you complete quests that didn't involve combat, while giving you an advantage in combat unparalleled by the NPCs. Weakness to magic was something the player could do in Oblivion to boost their own magical power, and it was defensive as well as offensive, which made magic the force to be reckoned with that it was. 100% Chameleon makes sense after using invisibility for the first time, and 100% reflect spell/damage gives the user an advantage in combat. None of these achievements are immediately obvious, or in fact easy to create, and seeing as enchanting appears to be a skill again it would be nice if we can develop our character into someone worthy of saving the world from a god.

My main argument in favor of these is that they take effort to achieve, even for those who heard about rather than discovered them. After all, life isn't about the destination, but rather the journey, and if someone wants to role play an overbalanced character then shouldn't the developers let them, but restrict their journey to becoming overbalanced? You could give characters the ability to make weak enchantments at low enchanting skill levels and stronger enchantment at higher levels, both in terms of magnitude and spell-effect

I also strongly believe that quests in Skyrim will be a reminiscent of Morrowind's investigative questing style, not a case of follow the quest marker until you reach your destination, with the difficult part being overcoming enemies, as this didn't work for me in Oblivion.

Enough about my opinion. What do you think?

Devs never leave exploits in on purpose. They are bugs and nothing more.

I could care less if they are in or not. Each player has the free will to choose to use them or not.

I hate exploits. Make the game too easy, and they're so tempting. Free Will be damned, what's easier, duping 50 expensive enchanted necklaces to get enough to buy Rosethorn hall or earning it slowly. Not to say that I like exploits, though, I don't use them.

If it needs effort to achieve it's no exploit. That's a legitimately earned reward. But all the things you listed plus many more that were present in Oblivion and/or Morrowind don't need any effort to achieve or very little effort. But no worries, looking at Bethesda's previous games I'm sure you will find more than enough exploits.

Most of what you descibe are not exploits but intented game mechanics.
When you know the game well enough to use its mechanics to its fullest, why not?
This is not a cheat or exploit, its clever gaming.

I want the duplication glitch to be in, there is really nothing more fun than a snake of shields or a whole bunch of watermelons which gets exploded all over the place

I hate them, just want to play the game without exploits or bugs in favor for me.

It depends. Glitches are one thing, but powerful game features are quite another. I have nothing against 100% chameleon if it takes enough effort to achieve. I have nothing against strong enchantments if they are, in fact, hard to make.

Dupe glitches never bother me because I didn't use them for anything other than fun. I duped varla stones because they were pretty, and watermelons because they were fun to watch fall everywhere. I didn't use it to get rich fast because I didn't care about getting rich that much.

Then again, I never really do. I'm not worried about my character having money, I just like him/her to live the lifestyle that would make sense for that sort of person.

I has only duped unique or very rare item before I enchant them so I have a spare if I want another enchantment.

Only abuse I have done with it was to dupe some ingredient used in the craftybit mod because I was unable to craft it because a bug, however after the bug was fixed the ingredient was still so hard to make that I continue to dupe.

I can understand people who dupe daeric arrows or other rare items, not dupe to get money as it’s easy enough to get.

i consider them to be the console's dev commands.

so i actually hope there are a few, if i feel like using them will, if not i won't simple as that.

Most of these are not really glitches, as it was already told here.

100% Chameleon was programmed to work specifically like this, weakness to magic, and resotre health enchantments can be used as a clever trick.

Duping on the other hand was a glitch and it has to go, there's no reason why it should stay. You still want to summon millions of watermelons and clone your favourite items? Use console commands.

EXTREME OPPOSITION to all game exploits cheats and console command thingy use (unless its a bug issue)

all the list AND u forgot the lame 100% resist magic (fire,ice...etc)

the OP alchemy spam......

I mean DAMN who would want to ruin the game for themselves!!!????? cheating/exploits = boring game with no challenge.

Then dont use them.
Do not petition to remove them thereby denying people that do like it the option.
Sellfish.
100% resistance is not a cheat or bug, its an intended game feature.

You need to add an option for the second poll for I don't want any exploits.

Yeah I am opposed to cheating in games. If other people do it I don't care but if they are there I would rather not know about them.

i didn't vote BECAUSE i don't care.
if i found an exploit (not sure i'm smart enough to notice) i wouldn't use it. i would do the MORAL thing (even though it's a game) and not abuse it.

Exploits and cheats? I could care less.

The console commands? Absolutely needs to be there for testing and using mods.

No exploits please, but...

• as mentioned above I don't believe exploits are things developers deliberately write in the game. They are oversights.
  
• the definition of "exploit" is questionable. It appears that one persons exploit may be viewed by others as legitimate features. Some of the items on the list are more features of "game balance" than they are "exploits", as I see it.

I'm strongly against any Exploit as I want a game to be hard not easy.

cheating is not a "right" that's why its called cheating if its an option then yes its an option, but cheating =/= freedom of choice.

its like" I cheat in chess don't deny me the right"... FINE but don't call yourself a chess player cause your not even "playing" the game, playing implies rules and boundaries that "allow" the game to be fun, if there is no chance of failure then its NOT A GAME.

playing a game requires you NOT to cheat its an oxymoron 100% immunity to any damage is a CHEAT in a game where finding ways to overcome challenge is the CORE of game-play

alchemy spam, 100% resist, 100% chameleon.... are all bad things that need fixing, they were not game options, Bethesda was just too lazy to fix them.

now you will say running backwards was not OP, Bethesda fixed it I want it back!!!! they won't bring it back because it was exploitable, also I'm sure that Bethesda will NOT allow 100& resist or 100% reflect or potion spam fest ever again.

I'm not selfish I'm just a good "gamer"

if you want cheats/exploits then mods will be you friends, mod a ring of god and put 100000000million gold in a barrel somewhere and have a blast, but I would like my vanilla game to be exploit/cheat free from the get go.

As a general rule, I'd say exploits in games are undesirable, and developers should try to prevent them where possible, now, I'm not against being able to become powerful in games, to an extent, but powerful doesn't mean invincible, when I can fairly easily create a potion that makes me effectively immune to anything that doesn't kill me in one hit because my health regenerates fully almost instantly and lasts for several minutes (Alchemy abuse in Morrowind.) or make myself completely invisible to all enemies as long as I have a specific set of enchanted armor equipped, then we have a problem. Using legitimate tactics to gain an advantage in the game is fine, but you shouldn't become unstoppable, and becoming powerful in a game is something you should have to earn through overcoming challenges, when you can complete the main quest in under an hour by simply creating a fortify intelligence potion, drinking it, then creating another, stronger one (Due to the bonus to your potion strength from intelligence.) and then repeating the proccess until you're so smart that you have to wonder why your character can't just spontaniously invent everything necessary to solve all the world's problems, and then use this intelligence to create potions that essentually turn you into a god, I think it's a sign that the developers need to work a little more on game balance. Although if there is a better solution, and often there is, I generally do not think that developers should remove exploitable features. So people are complaining that levitation is overpowered? Then change it so it's not overpowered, or make the AI smart enough to not be an easy target when you're levitating (Granted, the primarily cause blamed for levitation not being in Oblivion and presumably Skyrim is cities in seperate world spaces, but in discussions regarding levitation, the most common argument against it is the claim that it's overpowered, so I think it needs to be addressed.) 100% chameleon is overpowered? Then how about capping chameleon like Bethesda did with armor rating in Oblivion? Or making it so that chameleon, and invisibility, do not actually make you impossible to detect, but just prevent you from being seen, as the name of chameleon would imply, but still allow you to be heard? There's often a better solution to something being abusable than removing it entirely, and while said alternative may be more difficult, it's often worth it anyway.

It must also be said that usually, I don't think exploits are intentional, they're usually either glitches that can be used to the player's advantage, like duplication bugs, or oversights in the balance proccess that allow a certain feature to be used to make you more powerful than was probably originally desired, and I'd imagine that the more complex a game is, the harder it is to ensure that there are no potential exploits in the game, and I don't mean complex in the way people like to throw the word around here, when I say complex, I mean that the game has lots of different variables in all areas that go into making it what it is, lots of content and many different gameplay mechanics, which means a lot more room for something to go wrong or be overlooked, and in this regard, Elder Scrolls games are always fairly complex compared to other games on the market, so I don't expect Bethesda to make the game exploit free, the best they can do is eliminate what they can, but for those of us who don't want to rely on exploits to win, we're just going to have to keep ourselves from using them even if we know we can take advantage of them.

Personally I'm not opposed to most of the exploits that op mentioned however the ability to duplicate items should be completely removed, various "exploits" like 100% chameleon could potentially be feasible but the ability to duplicate an object is completely ridiculous.

What he said.

I don't consider bugs like the dupe glitch to be in the same category as "enchants that you think are overpowered if overused".



So, asking "do you want bugs and glitches to be in the game".... no, in an ideal world, there wouldn't be any bugs. Of course, it's a complex game, and some things will sneak through. And enterprising players will find them. But I seriously doubt that any "bugs" are deliberately put in by the developers for people to use.

Again, "Actual game features that you don't like and think are overpowered" =/= bugs, glitches, or exploits.




(For the record - I've played Oblivion for years. Never bothered with a 100% chameleon suit in the game, because it sounds boring. Never used any of the dupe glitches or other bugs, because I never read about them. Not that I'd have used them anyway. And never gathered together anything like a full suit of reflect gear because.... again, I don't read hint guides for Beth games. I have no idea where all the best unique items are, don't know which items are leveled & what level you "have" to get them at, don't know where all the FO3 bobbleheads are.... :shrug:)

Hah, bobbleheads. Never really bothered with them. Same with me actually concerning the dupe glitches and the best items in the game. Never bothered. Don't like being overly powerful in these games anyway, no fun that way. Never used chameleon either. Don't think I ever even used daedric armour or weapons because of their power and appearance.

I'm assuming this poll is for console players as there'll almost definitely be console commands. In fact, I'm positive there will be.

100% Chameleon ftw