Questions about Imperial religious beliefs.

Post » Tue Jan 19, 2016 11:13 am

Do Imperials recognize Talos as a god? I'm curious about their belief (as typical of the race as a whole) despite the White-Gold Concordat (what they say they believe and what they actually believe can be different).


Do they worship all eight/nine divines equally, or do they only worship one, and just revere them all as gods?


Is Alessia just a highly regarded historical figure?


In Cyrodiil, various cities have a single chapel dedicated to a single deity. Are the residents of each of these towns expected to choose the deity belonging to their city's respective chapel as the one they actively worship, or is the location nothing more than just location, and they're free to choose whichever they please?


Is there any available information about the symbolism of each deity's associated emblem? I.e. Stendarr's tipped over chalice, the triangle representing Julianos, etc.


Please add anything you deem important, or would just like to add.
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Brian Newman
 
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Post » Tue Jan 19, 2016 3:29 pm

1: Formally, no. However, I bet a Streisand Effect was kicked off by the Thalmor's banning. Unlike the (eastern) Nords, they're probably being more discrete about it.



2: Eight, now, but Nine in actuality accounting for the above.



3: Alessia?



4: Doubtful. It's a pantheon. Worshippers of Dibella aren't viewed as heretical nonbelievers by worshippers of Zenithar. There's even some synergy between Kynareth and Zenithar, for the bounties of the natural world (ores, skins, wood, etc) are the raw materials from which disciples of Zenithar create https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/artifact.



5: Akatosh: Hourglass. Time.


Talos: Sword. Conquest.


Dibella: Flower. Beauty.


Mara: Knot. Matrimony.


Kynareth: Hawk. Sky (referring to nordic aspect Kyne being the sky)


Julianos: Triangle. A concise and basic geometric shape that despite is simplicity has many measurable aspects.


Stendarr: Tipped chalice. Not sure on this one. In Skyrim, it's a tipped drinking horn.


Zenithar: Anvil. A sign of industry.


Arkay: A braided loop. Birth, life, death, rebirth. A cycle.

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JLG
 
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Post » Tue Jan 19, 2016 7:37 am

Before the White-Gold Concordant the Empire revered Talos as a god (hence the Nine Divines/Eight and One) but after the treaty it is "illegal" to worship him in Cyrodiil. Do note that this doesn't stop anyone from worshipping him in secret.


During ages past the entire province was generally very devout and even looked down on the belief systems of others (Nords in Bruma were considered savages with silly dragon gods). Every city had a chapel dedicated to a divine and those in authority had to at least appear devout or else be viewed with suspicion by the general populace (read the book series in TES IV called A Guide to [insert city name]. The author is super devout and judgemental of the populations of the cities who are not).


The Imperial Pantheon is generally the same as the Nord or Altmer Pantheon but with different views on the specific Aedra as well as different names. The pantheon views each divine as equal but symbolically they held Talos and Akatosh in highest regard (both are symbols of the Empire).


In the early times however the 2 sub-cultures had slightly different views that eventually melded. The Colovians kind of held onto the Nord way of thinking and the Nibeneans/Nibenese held onto the Ayleid way of thinking.


I recommend playing the Knight of the Nine DLC for Oblivion to get more Imperial views of the Divines. I hope any of this info helped
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Marcia Renton
 
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Post » Tue Jan 19, 2016 10:36 pm



So, after Talos' supposed apotheosis, the Imperials don't officially recognize him as a god? To clarify "official," I mean do they, as a race, recognize him as a divine, and believe him to be an equal to the other eight? White-Gold Concordat aside, as well as individuals with their own personal beliefs.


Interesting point about Alessia. If I remember a book correctly, she is viewed as a saint. Does this mean she's just highly regarded for her role in history, or do they actually associate her with a blessing of some sort?


Also, so they typically choose one divine to worship, rather than all eight equally, and they're free to choose whichever divine they feel represents them best?
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Big mike
 
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Post » Tue Jan 19, 2016 8:56 am

in a formal manner? no, but in reality yes.


in the late 3rd era (aka, the time during Morrowind and Oblivion) Talos was probably one of the most heavily worshiped deity's (probably only Akatosh was higher up), but during the 4th era they "pretend" hes not a divine because the treaty gave them time to rebuild.. but people still worship him, just not openly







all of them, you got to remember the whole "nine divine" thing is an imperial concept (as far as I know, no other religion reffered to their gods as the Divines), they are the Imperial gods after all and i think its the only pantheon that calls their gods "the nine" or "the eight and one".. alot of the other pantheons (such as the nord one) don't contain all of the same gods that are referred to as "the nine divines"







only person I can think of officially labeled as a saint would be Alessia.. however, people like Pelinal posses some saint-like respect..






not at all, they worship whichever divine they wish.. its a Pantheon after all, you don't just go "hey, i like Akatosh and you like Zenithar, get out!", they are all gods within the pantheon, they just each represent a different aspect of the world.. however, many people do worship multiple divines







no, they recognized him as a god from the very beginning (well.. he technically didn't exist as a god at all during Arena or Daggerfall, but he retroactively became one because Numidium shattered space-time again).. it wasn't until well in to the 4th era where they had to pretend they didn't..


i'd also like to point out, just because your an Imperial doesn't mean you worship the Imperial Pantheon.. just like you don't have to worship the Tribunal if your a dunmer, or the Nordic Pantheon if your a Nord (which is very true because in the game Skyrim, we see very little representation of the Nord pantheon.. everyone, and ever chapel seems to be devoted to the Imperial one.. Arkay doesn't exist in the Nord Pantheon as an example, and we see no shrines for gods that are in the Nord pantheon like Stuhn)



the religions in TES are not based entirely off of race.. they are based off of culture.. if you go play through Oblivion and Morrowind, you will find plenty of people who worship alternate pantheons..

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Pawel Platek
 
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Post » Tue Jan 19, 2016 10:13 am



There are legends regarding Alessia that attributes her to various divine events.


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Vickey Martinez
 
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Post » Tue Jan 19, 2016 11:09 am

This would be a lot easier to talk about if Oblivion didn't do such a poor job dealing with religion in any aspect. The Imperial Cult and the "standard" divines worship and practices in general are terribly, terribly lacking.



Veneration of Alessia in some form probably remains, if nothing else as a prominent saint along with the various hero-cults Cyrodiil has. Mohraius and Pelinal would also be likely contenders. Akatosh is still the exalted above the rest though, with Ysmir/Talos being far more important to the Nords then they are there. Cyrodrillic organizations like the Cult of Talos (who have a heavy presence in the Imperial Legion) and the Blades are notable exceptions to this rule though.

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Undisclosed Desires
 
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Post » Tue Jan 19, 2016 10:27 am

IIRC, there are some bones to pick amongst some of the devout in the Imperial City over Talos being the central statue in the garden district. Been a while since I played, and Oblivion's long since uninstalled...

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Ashley Hill
 
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Post » Tue Jan 19, 2016 6:13 pm

Same, I haven't actually played Oblivion in years. That wouldn't surprise me though, since Akatosh is still the preeminent Divine in Cyrodiil. The IC is also in the Niben, whereas Talos worship (Bruma now withstanding) is supposed to be more prevalent in Colovia. Don't quote me on that though.

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FITTAS
 
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