I was wondering if anyone knew in real life:

* How hard is it to hand make casings for different ammo types?

* How hard is it to make primers?

* How hard is it to make powder?

Does the system in Vanilla FONV seem realistic to you?

What mod would seem realistic? One that allowed you to melt casings and recast them? Ones that allowed you to make your own primer/powder?

Would someone be able to make all of them?

Thanks!

J

I'm not an expert in these things, but I think I can answer them to some degree.

Ammo casings are made to some very exact specifications. Without machining equipment and the skill to use them, I'd probably say it'd be nigh impossible to make your own.

Primers? They're small explosive charges that go off on impact. Again, you'd need the machinery to produce the pieces and the skill with explosives to make those, I'd think.

Making black powder isn't that hard. All you have to do is combine a few natural ingredients in the proper ratio. At least, that's the way it is for the basic stuff. The stuff used in guns these days is a bit more complex. Not sure what is in it, but it still just requires you to combine the proper ingredients in the proper ratios.

Does it seem realistic to me? Sure. You take your spent casing, you primers, powders and bullets and combine them. That's about all it takes, really. My one beef is taking any ole scrap metal and turning them into bullets like it's nothing.

Could someone make all of them? Sure, if they had the know-how and the right equipment.

Ammo casings - these are machined from brass to exacting specifications by manufacturers and would be very difficult to produce on your own without specialized machine tools. Reloaders collect their brass after shooting their ammunition, but it has to be reshaped to original dimensions in an ammo press before it can be reloaded, plus the mouth of the case has to be flared to accept the new bullet, and then the case has to be recrimped once the new bullet is inserted. Since this process "works" the metal, it causes the brass to eventually become brittle and unusable. Therefore you will get a limited number of reload cycles from a case before you have to discard it.

Primers - these are purchased for reloading centerfire ammunition (rimfire ammunition has the primer packed inside the case, and rimfire cases cannot be reloaded). They consist of an explosive that reacts to being struck by the firing pin of the weapon, placed in a metal cup that is inserted into the brass case after the old primer has been extracted. Again, these would be most likely only available from manufacturer, though it would be easier to "roll your own" primers than to make cases from scratch. Quite a bit of (dangerous) trial and error would be required.

Powder - black powder can be easily made from common compounds that occur naturally, but modern "smokeless" powder is made from nitrocellulose compounds (as well as various compounds to increase stability and regulate the burn rate of the powder). Smokeless powder would be very difficult to produce on your own without extensive chemical knowledge and specialized manufacturing processes. Black powder leaves extremely corrosive residue behind, so you have to religiously clean your black powder weapons after shooting them. It's also quite a bit less powerful per grain (7,000 grains per pound) than smokeless, so you'd have to use more of it to get the same ballistics as you would from smokeless. Impractical in handgun loads like 9 mm and 10 mm, since the charge of smokeless powder already just about completely fills the case.

Bullets - plain lead bullets are very easy to make on your own with minimal equipment. You'll need the lead, a melter and the molds for the bullets you want to make.

Vanilla New Vegas' system isn't totally realistic, but it's about the closest you're going to get in any game without turning the entire system into a complete PITA for the player. IMO.

About the only thing you can make yourself, as a courier who doesn't posses large amounts of manufacturing equipment, are the bullets. Even then, you cannot make jacketed bullets, which are what most modern ammunition types use. The reloading system in New Vegas is pretty nice, but there is no way in hell you could make casings from tin cans or use the same case 100 times over. I feel like i'm just restating what everyone else said, though.
That being said, it would be cool if you could put in orders with Gun Runners for large amounts of a certain type of ammunition and pick it up after a couple of days.

Typically you can use a case three times then you have to trim the neck. For many types of ammo that means the case is useless. .357 magnum is about the best for survival purposes. Use three times, trim neck and you have .38 . Use that 3 times, trim neck, and you have .38 short. Use that three times and then you trash the cases. Don't know if you can do the same or similar with .44 magnum.

9mm round casings were mass-produced in the early 40-s by the undercover arms industry of the Zionist movement in British Mandate-era Israel. It required machinery, but not modern precision machinery.

Black powder, which is relatively easy to make, would work for revolvers, manual-action rifles (bolt, lever, etc) and shotguns, but it would probably not work in automatic or semi-automatic weapons- because black powder is weaker, it wouldn't reliably cycle the action. It would also foul up the weapon's barrel and action and therefore require more maintenance. In FNV terms, I would suggest giving black powder rounds stats as follows: DAM x.75, CNDx3

Making simple smokeless powders would require a considerable knowledge of chemistry, but it is possible, I think. (I'm not talking about modern powders but rather those used at the turn of the 20th century- cordite, ballistite etc.). They're corrosive though, and they would degrade weapons faster.

As others have said, to actually make ammunition components (brass, power, primers) you would need a small factory...it's just not practical for a individual to do. Best course of action is to buy primers and powder from the Gun Runners and other merchants and reload the casings you have. But the basic equipment to reload doesn't actually take much room. Google "Lee Loader" and you'll see that a simple kit to reload one caliber ammo can fit into a large pocket. A realistic mod would be a "[insert caliber here] Reloading Kit" weighing 2 lbs that allowed you to reload any unlocked variation of a single caliber anywhere, as long as you have the components on hand. To be more realistic, you could have it take time...say 50 rounds reloaded per hour.

It's prety much impossible.

Would someone be able to make all of them?
Given you have the correct materials...Powder is easy to make...primers aren't exactly real and casings...if you have mold, a furnace, and the right type of metal it's pretty easy...but you'd be making like 1 a day...

It is possible to completely make your own ammo, but not for NV weapons. Remember, many old muskets didn't use cases, just powder down the barrel, bullet on top, powder on the pan, and you're ready to fire. The actual ignition of the powder is done by either holding a lit fuse (either in your hand or wheel locked) or you can use a flint lock to create the spark. Later weapons used paper cartridges and I think the minie ball stored the powder in a hollow rear in the bullet itself. Also, at least in theory, you can create an electric spark instead, or using Lorenz forces you wouldn't need powder at all.

-Gunny out.

The only components I can see the PC making are lead bullets and black powder.

The PC can reload ammo from purchased components all day long.

If you take care of the cases you might stretch them out closer to a dozen reloads,
making sure to clean, re-size, and inspect for damage.

BTW, a full set of dies for resizing and crimping could be purchased from gun runners and used at a reloading bench.

The only people I can see manufacturing cases, primers, modern powder, and modern bullets are the Gun Runners.
I like the idea someone had about placing orders from Gun Runners for ammo en mass.

Side note: Trickle charger + solar panel should equal recharged EC, ECP, & MFC.

I pretty sure Courier didn't make black powder for bullets because they doesn't sound or fire like them.

Very True. All the guns in game use smokeless powder.
But the courier could make black powder and lead bullets if the game would let him,
given the tech available to him.

Oh yes, and the cowboy guns would easily run black powder and lead bullets no problem.
Any doubts? Then look up cowboy action competition.

Side note: I wish the game had cleaning kits for sale:
1. Multiple uses
2. Restores CND to 100% if used before the CND drops below 75%
Would make more sense given the game says repair below 75%;
and maintenance above 75%.

Hell, alot of the guns in the game were designed for black powder. Here's a short list:
.357 magnum revolver (Colt 1873 SAA)
Cowboy Repeater (Winchester 1866)
Trailer Carbine (Winchester 1892)
Brush Gun (Marlin 1895)
Lever-action Shotgun (Winchester 1887)
Pump shottie actions are all essentially the same as the first Winchester 1893
Bolt action hunting rifles are essentially the same as the Mauser rifles from the 1890's
Most all modern revolvers differ very little in their design details from those designs at the end of the 19th century.
Semi-auto shotguns most likely still use the long-recoil action first designed by Browning in the 1890's.

Cartridges you could reasonably make into black powder:
.22LR
.357 Magnum/.38 Special
.44 Magnum and Special
.45-70
All shotgun shells
9mm (a bit of a stretch, but both the pistol and the SMG would probably still work, possibly with stighly weaker springs)
10mm (same as above. SMGs using blowback and pistols using recoil would still work, just might need a little tinkering)
.50MG (hey, it would work. I know: who would want it?)

I've probably missed a few, but basically, not only would some of the weapons easily handle black powder, they were designed for it. You could easily add black powder rounds, as the above poster suggested with a downwards DAM modifier and an upwards CON modifier. It'll be a real [censored] to redo all the firing animations to model in all that smoke on the battlefield though, so for that reason alone, I would not do it. Stick with smokeless.

-Gunny out.

Sure they can all handle black powder, but in game it doesn't seem they do.

Well, yeah, technically. You *could* shoot an M-16 with black powder loaded 5.56mm. You might even be able to get it to cycle the action. But the direct gas impingment system used on them means all that lousy black powder residue will clog up the rotating bolt in a very small amount of rounds. I also doubt there would be enough energy in black powder loaded 5.56 or 7.62 to correctly cycle the recoil operated larger weapons like the Automatic rifle. But you obstensibly could load one round at a time and shoot black powder through them. If the supply of smokeless powder was used up, and that's the only way you can make your weapons work, then you do what you gotta do. It's still better than throwing rocks.

-Gunny out.

Just read a copy of 'Guns and Bullets' and you'll learn all you need to know