Well in Oblivion in you got hit by an arrow it would go all the way through you and you would run around til the next cell with an arrow sticking out of your chest. Now, in real life if an arrow hits you and goes through you or penetrates more than and inch or so it has a large chance of killing you as opposed to only the first half inch of the arrow hitting you. What i would like wold be for arrows that dont kill to only go in about a half inch while killing blows will penetrate through them. Any iseas/responses.

That would certainly make sense! After battles with numerous archers I would often end up looking like Boromir at the end of Fellowship of the Ring, despite my best efforts--and the look on my character's face was along the lines of: "It's just a flesh wound."

While we're on the subject of arrows, I would also appreciate it if enemies hit by arrows did not fly halfway across the cell.

A very good point about immersion. I also had quite many of those Boromir moments. Its a tricky thing to get right.

yea
i once had ( guessing ) about 20 arrows in me at once. They were sticking all around me and went right through. Hopefully with this really stong arrows we wont have to worry about having more than 2 arrows in a body.

I like this, and a random side thought:
Would anyone else really like it if when you shot enemies like skeletons where arrows bounce off for the arrows to still be lootable from their corpse so you don't have to scan every inch of the room looking for your arrows.
sorry for the abundance of the word arrow in that sentence

is it really that hard to look on the ground for an arrow, but speaking of that do you think you should be able to loot all of your arrows that hit?

I had this old screen shot of never winter nights and my character looked like a pin cussion. lol.

Most games where arrows get stuck in people has this problem, seen it a lot in Mount and blade, even headshots with javelins who look far worse.
Possible to solve by reducing penetration in body and no in head unless it's the killing hit.

The throwback from arrows was a magic effect and only worked with bows enchanted with sigil stones or pre enchanted ones, same way as the bought fireballs caused an explosion.
But yes the effect was way overdone on large monsters like orges.

Why can't anyone spell "Ogre" properly?

And I liked the explosive magic effects... especially when the powerful spells sent foes flying. What I didn't like is how they only went flying once the enemy was dead... I'd rather have more dynamic combat, where powerful blows can move combatants around the room.

Really? I'm almost positive that I was tossing around smaller enemies with bows that were not enchanted with sigil stones or pre-enchanted. I say "almost" because I no longer have Oblivion installed on my system (had to take it off so I could get some work done!) and thus cannot check, but I played primarily ranged fighters, so I'm pretty sure that even non-enchanted bows did this. I got the impression that once you started doing far more than lethal damage, that damage would translate into flying enemies.

Of course, I could be wrong. Even if this is the case, flying enemies would only seem realistic to me if the arrow caused a magical explosion when it hit. I am certain that this wasn't the case in Oblivion--it always looked weird to see an enemy get hit by an arrow and then go flying for no apparent reason.

(I will admit that it was rather cathartic, though. :happy: )

So, the fact that someone just got hit with an arrow delivered with enough force to overpenetrate a Land Dreugh in Ebony Armor is "Going Flying for no good reason?" At those damage levels, you're shooting arrows with superhuman force behind them. Unfortunately, the slow projectile speed diminished that effect.

Either blowing enemies across the room, or holes corresponding to the 1-shot arrow's size (Complete with ludicrous overpenetration) should be implemented instead.

Um, yes. See below.



Superhuman acceleration, perhaps, which is only one part of the force calculation. The actual mass of the arrows, however, is quite low. The arrow would have to be going at ludicrous speeds to generate the force required to blow an enemy across the room. Which ties in with this...



You're right. I hadn't thought of that, but that's probably a big reason why the effects of non-magic missiles felt so fake to me. Had they been going significantly faster it might not have been that bad. Still, they wouldn't be going fast enough to have that much force. But, of course, then we have to take into account how much "stopping power" the target has, which leads us to this...



If we're talking ultra superhuman force, then yes--and overpenetration is the way to go. I know that bullet ballistics and arrow ballistics are not exactly the same, but in general ballistics are ballistics. What happens to a bullet that has more energy (force) than the target can stop? The bullet generally goes clean through the target. I say "generally" because you could of course have a very low-mass target (say, a beer can) be hit by a bullet and go flying. But if the target has sufficient mass (like a human), that target is not going anywhere. If the bullet can penetrate the target at all, it's going to keep going until it expends all of its energy. It's interesting to note, though, that even when a human is wearing a bullet-proof vest (meaning that all of the energy is expended at the point of impact), they never go flying. So even if an arrow was traveling at the speed of a bullet, it doesn't have enough energy to send an enemy flying.

Sorry, I'm getting a little bogged down here. What I'm trying to say is that, even assuming that the bows in Oblivion are imparting superhuman acceleration to the arrows, it would only make sense to have overpenetration--seeing the arrow buried in the middle of a large creature and passing completely through smaller creatures.

(And yeah, I do realize that I'm getting a little too picky and a little too realism-focused here. But you asked me to clarify my position, so I did. )

Not personally, no. Though I understand why its desirable.

**My own aside: What if TES did implement a version of FO3's crippled limbs, and you got one when an arrow pierced the PC?
(and where the arrow pierced the PC)

I tip my hat in your general direction good sir. F = m x a

Agreed, lets not have them just crumple in melee either...

Hopefully the finishing moves address this issue.

I'm thinking 50 - 75% of the shaft should still be visible when struck in the torso. Most arrows were designed so the head stops INSIDE the person, otherwise its a clean wound that does comparatively little organ and bone damage.

Obviously stuff like bodkin arrows should go right through a squishy.

Why thank you!

Hm. This makes me wonder if we will be getting different penetration/damage/armor piercing by different arrowheads similar to FO:NV different ammo loads...

bodkin = armor piercing (less damage, but ignores armor)
broadhead = hollowpoint (more damage, but more easily stopped by armor)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Cr%C3%A9cy-en-Ponthieu_24-09-2008_12-11-33.JPG

Maybe it could be a random chance for the arrow to go through you.