I won't mention any but anyone else feel like the new racial bonuses and skills break the consistency of the lore a bit?

Examples are the Redguards, Argonians, Altmer, and Dunmer. For various reasons. Others as well.

Edit: Probably...

How's that? Argonians still breathe under water, Bretons still soak up magicka like a sponge, Orcs can still open their cans of butt-kick. The only one that seems to have "changed" in any major way is the Dunmer, who've always been about the ancestral aid (at least since Morrowind), but each Dunmer has separate ancestry (up to a point); perhaps the Morrowind ancestors defended the PC from hostile environs, the Oblivion ones decided to take a more active role, and the Skyrim ones have all taken a play out of Red Mountain+Lie Rock's playbook, or maybe it's just all about the rituals used to interact with the ancestors (i.e., basically the same as already stated, only done at the bidding of the PC).

not the racials but the +5 skill points seem weird. I guess in 200 years different races picked different skills

Racials

Argonians no longer have poison resistance at all apparently. Ra Gada and Altmer no longer have disease resistance. Orcs no longer resist magicka. Dunmer cannot summon ancestor ghosts even though after the red year Sul did. Altmer are no longer weaker to the elements.

Skills

Dunmer are no longer spellsword types like they are famous for. They are now sneaky lightly armored mages according to skills. Ra Gada apparently now do not mistrust magicka and are proficient in Destruction. Nords get no bonus to heavy armor. Imperials now have big restoration bonuses. There is a slew of things that do not make sense.

I mean these are small yet important details of the game. Why would they not stay true to the lore. Hell if anything the Dunmer should have Conjuration(Biggest daedric affiliation and worshiped them), Destruction, Illusion, Stealth, Light Armor, and One Handed. Instead of One Handed and Conjuration they have Alchemy and Alteration. Why? Seems like they were just slapping mostly random bonuses to races to me.

Of course I am opinionated these are small things, and there is a possibilty of these racials being incorrect but hell, I would think they would try to keep the racials at least consistent with the lore of the corresponding races. Then again Nords had that shock resist in Morrowind...

Game mechanics for the most part.

Beat me to it, I never gave the racial bonuses and feats much thought outside game mechanics.

That was my thought as well.

But why though? Is it necessary for balance? I mean Orcs have a ridiculously OP racial power. Deal double damage and recieve half damage for 60 seconds? No word on cool down timer but I hope that is once a day. Why the poor choices of skill bonuses?

What Hellmouth said.

There were changes between Morrowind and Oblivion, as well (for instance, in Morrowind, Dunmer did not have the innate ability to summon ancestral ghosts; I can almost guarantee that there will be a similar spell in Skyrim, so it's not that far a stretch to imagine that the ghost summoned is an Ancestor). It's probably safer (from a nit-pick standpoint) to think of it as each of the CHARACTERS having different skills, not necessarily each of the races being innately proficient with the given bonuses (despite what the racial summaries say), just like each of the birthsigns have had slightly different effects (complete with pseudo-lore explanations in the guise of "Prime Aspect of Masser/Secunda" astrology-speak).

Or maybe things have just changed. We have no idea WHAT the Dunmer are into these days, and maybe after picking on the Orcs, the Redguards all decided that shooting fire from their hands was pretty darn sweet, and worth bending tradition for.

I found it extremely odd that Imperials don't have even a +5 to speech. That's like, their [censored] niche: social manipulation. What, did Nibenay just implode?

I think the edits are an attempt to rebalance, actually. Everyone knows how unbalanced the races were in Oblivion, especially the notorious Bretons.

EDIT: Could I have a link to the new racial bonuses? I'd like to see what I'm getting into here.

It is in the Skyrim Spoilers section. http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1251299-full-racial-abilities-continued/

That does not count as leaked info right? lol

Btw these could be wrong and I am hoping tis so. Not a big deal but I find myself caring more than I should. Straw that broke the camels back maybe? My Dunmer got [censored] over so bad in the 4E. Now they cannot even use weapons effectively? :cryvaultboy: :sadvaultboy: :swear:

maybe nibenay did, all thats left are the clovians in this dark world...

5 skill levels with a weapon is a humiliating disadvantage of... a starting dungeon and hapless peasant's worth of swinging (give or take a goblin or two).

:wink_smile:

Skyrim's too cold for a Nibanese man, obviously their representing the Colovian aspect, which is more noric anyway. #pulledouttamyassanswer1

Nonsense! They have long-underwear, made from Ancestor Silks! :teehee:

Hum. I guess they make sense, but I don't hold much against the rule of game mechanics

Bretons feel more witchy/sorceror
Imperials look like cleric ... paladin ... things. Imperial Cult!
Altmer seem like mindscrew powers now
Naked Nord barbarians
orcs are still heavy
Redguards are fencers
Bosmers, archers
Dunmer and Argonians are still a curious mix of magic. Nightblade/Spellsword/Battlemage things

I mean, Altmer used to be godpowered anti-magic everythings in Arena, right?

... still refuse to touch the whole poison/disease bit. I've slowly come to terms with disease being "old fashioned mystical maladies and influences." And argonians are quite mystical

Yeah. And then the Frost Fall Traitors signed the Concordat, forever tarnishing the reputation of Cyrodiil diplomats.

200 years have passed. Cultures have changed. Eugenics has progressed. The Hist have new needs. Et cetera. Its not that weird that the racial bonuses have changed.

My first thought was to call it gameplay and be done with it.

Yet the forum came up with a fiction once that races aren't really races but rather manifest cultures. One example would be the Altmer weakness to the elements. It did not come from a physical weakness but was due to a greater understanding of how magic works and what it does to them.

So supose that races represent culture rather then phisology, one might simply say that "Times have changed".

The Imperial representation would be off though, theres not one dominate culture in any of the 'races'. You have Forbears and Crowns in Hammerfell along with multiple Bedouin esque cultures throughout the desert and badlands, and in Cyrodiil you have Nibian and Colovian, neither of which are well represented by in game interpretations. If the races represent culture, then Beth's done a pretty poor job of embodying it.

There are holes. I guess it's stereotypical at best? If we were to call all Redguards swordsmen. Bosmer, archers. Maybe a mix of nature-nurture.


I remember wondering about that. There was a line about so-and-so game's dwarves that made them "hardy against magic, which also makes them terrible spellcasters." I think it was d&d, i can't remember. Relates to TES orcs though, with their former magicka resistance. Though i suppose it's backwards. I don't know if their warrior-culture created an anti-affinity, or if the lack of magic produced the warrior. Goes in circles!

Altmer would be the opposite extreme. They're so in tune that it hurts them, like The Apprentice sign.
But then bretons tick me off with having the best of both. I couldn't understand that at all.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heterosis. The best of Old Ehlnofey and Atmora, plus a little something extra.

Edit: Don't stone me, that was a mostly facetious answer.

haha, hybrid vigor. Haven't read up Mendel in years. I'll run with that

Yups. Wierd thought process by Beth. I can let it slide but I expected better tbh. Maybe it is just the fault of whoever made the bonuses when it was leaked. They could easily have gotten a number of things wrong or made it up. I will find out in about 4 days. Plenty of time to accept it if these are true. Pacific time zone, I live in Hawaii btw. Steam unlocks at 9pm here on the 10th I believe. Hehe.

Do we know that that those are the only bonuses? Perhaps, there are a few more. :spotted owl:

It was hinted that that was it. Could easily be faulty but we have no reason to doubt them other than how off they seem.