Do the guards operate under the same radiant system as the rest of the NPCs? If so, can we expect a Nordic guard (and as Todd has confirmed Nords hate elves and stuff), to look the other way when you harass or even murder a dunmer or some shizzz? Will the radiant system take into account a guards disposition towards a particular race and weigh it against his disposition towards you?

Discuss.

that would be sweet...

What are Nordic and Imperial attitudes towards Argonians at this point?

I certainly hope not. Guards of all people shouldn't let their racial discrimination overcome them.

Honestly, the demand for racism is a little unsettling.

That would add an interesting aspect to the NPC's, possibly some of them don't like [insert player race here] so they have a lower disposition towards you, and some guards will even harass you for no reason, or ask you to give them money or they'll throw you in prison, very interesting concept, I like it.

-Mr. Maric

But what about the Ordinators?

I would assume rather hostile given the random invasion of Morrowind. Who knows, Nords may praise them that they ravaged the terrible elves. :shrug:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fxVeAVl2I8&feature=player_detailpage#t=22s

i can see why you wouldnt want the guards to be racist, but it is a traight of the human mind so it would make sense to flesh out the world that way

That was more xenophobia than racism. My Dunmer Nerevarine was treated just as poorly as anyone else.

Some xenophobia is understandable, especially given the situation of Tamriel in the past few centuries. Flat-out racism where guards overlook murders of a specific race but not of another solely because of race is a little off-putting and without any good reason. Sure, Nords in general have reservations about elves, Dunmer and Altmer specifically, and with good reason, but not nearly enough that they'd want them all dead. That's overboard.

Well I assume their dispositions will differ towards different races and I think it was stated somewhere that if they like you they may take a bribe or something.

People used to be extremely racist, it was used as a tool by rulers to send people to war. You only need to look at some of the propoganda published by certain governments to realise that. I imagine the same would happen in the TES universe. Regardless of what guards should be they need to be realistic and representative of their culture. Guards don't even serve justice, just their Lord.
and people don't want racism, just realism that will add that extra bit of depth to the game.

And? They still do. Welcome to reality. And I know I know, it's a game. However it's trying to represent a believable Universe that is shaped largely off our own. Guards should be just as likely as anyone else of harboring racial and other prejudices.




*insert: sixually themes (cheap pun), decapitation/gore, naughty naughty words e.t.c.

What's unsettling is how people want to immerse themselves (forgive this now hated word) in Teletubby Land.

An interesting thought, it would add a whole new dimension to the game, but may make the game slightly unbalanced depending on the race you initially selected.

Having said that, I quite like the idea.

It's not very realistic, even if they don't like someone it would be silly to just let them get killed. They may treat other races poorly but letting you kill that bosmer merchant who pays taxes is a little insane for the average guard. As a quest or something sure but otherwise it's pretty crazy.

Badass Nord guards that hate elves?

Yes, very much so.

Not every Tom, dike and Harry in the Legion would really care about the death of a taxpayer. You're forgetting this is the act of a corrupt, racist indiviual. I agree with you it would be a little insane for the *average* guard, but why does it have to be the average guard? It could be 1/30 guards.

And I'm not sure how any of that is relevant to Skyrim. The King is dead. The land is at war between rebels and the Empire--neither are racially exclusive. The world is being threatened by dragons. The universe is at risk of ending. Where's the motivation for so many guards to be racist at a time like this?


I wish I could believe that, but no, people are all torches-and-pitchforks about their racism. Just look at the hundreds of threads about Argonian-lovers wanting all Dunmer to die, and vice versa. Sure, it's just a fantasy game, sure, a bit of racism adds depth, but it certainly seems like many people are most excited about the chance of acting out pure racism. I just don't get it.


And how much individual personality have we seen in guards in the past games? Absolutely none. Maybe the head of the guard has a personality and things like that, but the rest of the guards are always just clones of the next. If we get to the day where it's reasonable to expect every single NPC, right down to generic guards and bandits, to have their own personality, then yeah, sure, but that's not going to happen with Skyrim. It's kind of an all-or-nothing thing, and I see no solid reason to include racism, no more than including a guards food preferences or sixual orientation. If the head of the guard is racist, maybe those guards could be a little less favorable of certain races, but a guard-by-guard basis is not realistic.

The guards don't care, it's Skyrim, a totally different world. And "of all people"
is useless, no one should let any racial discrimination overcome them.

That would be fine, you happen to make friends with that one random guy who lets you kill another race he won't attack or fine you if it's him that arrests you. Would be sorta awesome.

The Nords will have seen their friends get killed by Imperials and see their land as being under threat as a result of the Empire, they are going to be a bit suspicious of Imperials thanks to this don't you think? And do you think a Legion Soldier is going to look kindly on a Nord when hes seen camps raided by them?

I agree with you on this though, although there are many good reasons for fleshing out the game with a bit of friction between cultures. Some people will want it in for the wrong reasons.

Friction between Nords and Imperials is far more acceptable in my book. It's just the OP mentions against Dunmer specifically which left a bad taste in my mouth. It just seems like another excuse for rabid Argonian fans to try to get away with murdering every Dunmer in sight, which will just bring out the rabid Dunmer fans with the same intent for Argonians.

I think the Nordic guards of Skyrim have more important things to worry about than Dunmer at the moment. I certainly can't imagine they have reason enough to discriminate against Dunmer to the point of just watching while an innocent Dunmer is murdered in front of them. There's just no reason for that, and that type of racism is just off-putting, even more so when it is specifically requested. Specific circumstances could make it fine and even expected, but just in general? Nah.

And? Because guards in previous games were clones that means there can be ABSOLUTELY NONE with individual personalities in Skyrim? Am I saying every single guard should have a lifestory complete with taste in soft furnishings? No, 90% of guards could still be clones, and then 10% could have individual traits.




I may be jumping the gun, it was recently revealed that you could be gay in Skyrim and you wear something (can't remember the details) and that shows others that you're interested. I think it's highly likely the only NPCs to be exempt from this will be the quest specific-ones. Though of course it's possible guards will not have a sixual orientation it's also possible their characters will be fleshed out the same way as 'generic' civilians that are commincable. Why I can't I pull a guard?



Oblivion had like 95% generic guards, and 5% guards with additional personality due to quest-relation. I seriously do not see why a few guards could not be made racist. You say you see no reason for Racism, yet Todd himself has specifically mentioned Racism on a multitude of occasions.

Actually, I'm pretty sure only a few NPCs will be able to join you in a relationship. They've already said not every race will have a potential relationship.


And those 5% were the ones I was talking about to say it was okay if they were racist. The average guard should not be, or at least not the point of allowing an innocent of a specific race to be murdered.

There's a difference between what you're suggesting and what the OP is suggesting.