I am expecting things like npcs standing under the heavy rain talking about some gossips....

i just hope i can live to see the day AI in games will be something really dynamic...

you mean when it starts trying to take over the world :user:

Maybe something a little less dinamic .

This was my thought as well. I do not think that they would have announced it after several years of production if they would not deliver this time

I can't see them making the same mistake twice. If they weren't confident that AI was in, they wouldn't have announced it.

Radiant AI is, in my opinion, functional in Oblivion but requires far more AI packages and Condition checks than they were willing to expend the time on.

I worry they'll have a similar issue here, but they may have hardcoded in some protections from the most egregious flaws.

Ican imagine they've spent several years on just developing the new engine, which is BUILT FOR TES. Skyrim will fully support radiant AI and I'm sure it'll be a groundbreaking AI milestone!

What you guys don't seem to understand is that they were making Oblivion for a game console that wasn't even made yet. They had many restrictions on what they could do.

THINGS THE DEMO VIDEO SHOWED OFF:
- NPCs talking to each other
- learning new topics from overhearing conversations
- NPCs eating
- NPCs reading books
- NPCs practicing skills
- NPCs sleeping
- NPCs alerting you that they're about to close up shop

THINGS THAT ACTUALLY HAPPEN IN-GAME:
- NPCs talking to each other
- learning new topics from overhearing conversations
- NPCs eating
- NPCs reading books
- NPCs practicing skills
- NPCs sleeping

was it embellished? yeah, it was. it was a tech demo, after all - they were showing off the different packages and the potential of the package system. is most of what they do entirely cosmetic in-game? yeah, it is. it's still a massive step up from standing around all day every day.

i didn't feel it was a disappointment. maybe by today's standards, yeah, but name another game released in 2006 where NPCs had actual schedules that weren't entirely scripted events - where they slept at night, went to work during the day, and pvssyd with each other a bit during their downtime. i mean yeah i felt it could've been USED MORE - there could've been more industry in and around the cities that required NPCs to go and do things, or they could've gone around shopping every once in a while - but the idea behind it was great and the execution was good enough. not as good as it could've been, but good enough.

i do think they'll use it better this time, though.

ed for anyone wanting to see what pre-toned radiant AI looks like - go into the construction set and delete every single faction. they're the only thing keeping everyone from killing each other over apples.

I have pretty big hopes.
I'm sure it will be great.

But at the same time I don't wanna get disappointed...

Anywho we'll just have to wait and see, won't we?

I don't think the AI will blow me away as such, but I don't think that they will exaggerate the AI this time round/announce something before they knew for sure if it would make the cut (I think they learned from that), so I voted for the first option. As someone who has no idea how these things work, my expectations will probably always be unrealistic in terms of implementation, but I don't think Bethesda would announce something they didn't know they could do this time either.

There's no such thing and never was as a fully Radiant AI as many people imagined seeing that well scripted video. It reminds me of the E3 presentation of Half Life 2 where the player would put an heavy object to block doors (which weren't blockable in the final game) and the soldiers would be smart enough to head to windows and shoot through them while a few of them try to force the door open. Well that was entirely scripted, despite the developers praising their awesome A.I.

Don't get hyped on the A.I., I expect something like Oblivion, only a bit more advanced... You can't just come up with a revolutionary A.I. today. There aren't many ways of doing it. It's all about adding more scripting to it to match more situations...

They explained why they had to remove it in the Making Of movie that was part of the Collector's Edition of Oblivion. Basically weird things started to happen i.e. some NPC would go around town and buy out every piece of armor leaving nothing for the player.

As for Skyrim I think they will put it in this time, not to the extent they say, but enough to blow at least me away :biggrin:

I think it will be better than Oblivion's, but I'm sure it's not going to be the golden egg of AI.

They could have easily fixed problems like that, but no they didnt have the foresight to come up with a solution.

Radiant AI was one of those things hovering over Bethesda looking down and laughing at Beth. I don't think they would allow it to shove their faces in the mud again so I don't think they would have mentioned it if they were not positive they could pull it off.

I was not at all aware they had a fire during the production of Oblivion.

The solution was also easy, but it was a huge timesink to add in all the necessary AI Packages and condition checks. As it is, a lot of AI packages are shared by multiple people, resulting in them attempting to do the same thing in the same space at the same time.

At most, in my opinion, the limiting factor of the technology was the amount of processing time that could be devoted to AI functions. The true limiting factor was probably the manpower that could be devoted to creating the unique AI packages for everyone, and the additional faction relationships needed for specific condition checks.

Oh wow... this thread just sparked a dream I had last night... saddened to say, I dreamt that Skyrim had the same AI as Oblivion.

But I believe we'll see a pretty good AI system this go around. They didn't have a set deadline when they began and they don't have to write all new code for a new generation of consoles. They played the game quite wisely so far, so I believe we have a good chance to see something worthwhile. It's way to early to say one way or the other but I'm sure the majority will be satisfied(until VI speculation rolls around then the complaints will roll in ) Overall I have faith, and am not worried about the outcome, we'll see what happens in due time.

My major concern isn't if it will be in the game, but is that it could become more annoying than amazing.

I can see one awesome thing that could come from the updated Radiant AI and the AI being able to pick up dropped items. It will just take them making a Sweet Roll item.....

I hope. With the new engine it may just be a little easier.

It was scrapped or dumbed down? How so? I'm sorry but I have to agree with "might be a couch" on this one; I see NPCs get up and get to work, go to lunch even, eat and drink, pvssyr among themselves, work at their stores, sleep etc. Adds a lot of ambient feel to Oblivion. I don't know what you expected, but I think I can say I got what I believed to be feasible. It will now be improved with "radiant story", which sounds nice, but I don't think it will be "the game changer".

My biggest concern is frame-rate rather than AI to be honest.

I do believe that they got it down. I hope it will blow my mind I really do. I'm very excited about the whole thing. However remember everyone, including myself, that if you see it's greatness as a magical pie in the sky it won't get you high enough to reach it. Keep your excitement in the sanity of it's going to be REALLY good really REVOLUTIONARY, probably the best RPG ever produced, but they will leave things out. It won't be as good as it could be and the reason, aside from time and funds, is they need to always make something better. So expect great, but don't over expect, I really don't want anyone's hearts crushed.

This is the only feature I'm very skeptical about. It reminds me of Spore's space stage.

Here's a short recap of what happened with Spore (I'm skipping the depth part of it):
It was said that in the space stage you could form a huge empire or a vast alliance akin to the Federation in Star Trek. What really happens in Spore's space stage is very different. If you form an "Empire" you essentially exterminate all of the other races. There is no ruling empire system to control multiracial planets. If you try to form an alliance it is nothing like Star Trek's Federation. What happens is how much your allies like you slowly depletes over time and unless they are passably friendly to begin with they will leave your alliance unless you pay them personal attention. But here's where this applies to radiant story:

Bad things can happen. A planet can get attacked. It can have an ecological disaster (that will somehow render the planet uninhabitable if left unchecked, eco-disasters are by far the most annoying thing in the game in my opinion). Once you anger the primary antagonists of Spore, you get attacked by them too. Can you delegate some nearby alliance planets to help with these things? No, something as simple as an ecological disaster requires your personal assistance. Ignore it and your ally will hold it against you, and while they can fend things off themselves sometimes often they are at a disadvantage without your personal help. You are the universe's only space nanny. Despite having enjoyed Spore, it fell far short of my expectations and I jokingly call the end game the Space Nanny Stage.

I'll finally get to Skyrim here:
Imagine you enter a town and a woman approaches you, asking for you to help rescue someone.

Imagine that this happens often.

Imagine that the citizens seemingly get no help from the guards and such, and that you are the only person that can help in Skyrim, always.

Imagine if when they come to your for aid, and you just plain want to do something else, you are treated as if you are mean or evil.

I see Radiant Story/AI as very possibly bringing the Space Nanny stage of Spore into The Elder Scrolls series. My goodness I do hope I'm wrong! That's the only worrying thing I have to say about the news thus far. I'm very excited about the game!