Join the Institute if you believe the Commonwealth is a lost cause and the future is underground, join the railroad if you believe that Synths deserve freedom from the institute where they are treated as servile robots and if you think the Commonwealth can be salvaged and can be defended by the minute men.

Well I turned on the RR and got the Institute ending. I'm content with that.

Awesome!

I'm currently approaching the point of the game where I'm going to have to choose between the Institute and the Railroad (I've already turned against the BoS and that svckED) and I'm 99% sure I'm choosing the Institute. It's interesting because my character's motivations will have nothing to do with her opinions on Synth personhood (though for the record, she does believe they have the right to make their own choices) or what she thinks of the RR (she thinks they're good people); no, what it will come down to is simply that her son is dying and is asking his mommy to make sure his life isn't a complete waste. Before hand, she was extremely on the fence about what to do- there could have easily been a scenario where she tries in vain to make Shaun see reason only for it end in tragedy- but the moment she learned about her son's illness she knew exactly what she had to do......no matter how much she might regret it. Plus, when the Institute is hers to control she will be able to turn it into a force for good instead of a source of fear for the Common Wealth.

I gotta hand it to Bethesda, they are making me AGONIZE over this decision.

I tried but just could buy it. I know blood's thicker than water and all that, but honestly this 'guy' who happens to have your DNA is a total stranger. Maybe if he had some kids (real kids, not Synth ones) I would do it for the grandchildren and then try to be a part of their lives. But no, no feelings for dying Shaun.

Not to mention, he's a grown man. He doesn't need his parents to support his every genocidal decision, and should live with the consequences of his actions. Like an advlt. That's what good parents do, especially since Shaun can't be talked into reason.

Since this is the spoiler board...I'd recommend siding with a faction other than the Minutemen, because the Minutemen survive no matter what. I originally chose the Minutemen, but then chose the Institute after I found this out. I got to keep the Institute, and also X6-88, an OP companion who looks like Blade.

I didn't like the BOS ending, but you can choose it to save Danse.

Can anyone comment as to whether the BoS, Railroad, and Institute can all survive once the quests are maxed out? (Some people are calling this the "5th" ending.) I got this outcome the first time I played after destroying the Institute. However, I read that this was simply a matter of not advancing the BoS quest line far enough.

You should also check the Director's personalities then. The Biotech Director is evil, as is Ayo (though he can be removed if you didn't join the Railroad). Madison is all about helping the Wastelanders, Binet is like his son and believes Synths are people while the last one is loyal and seemingly a good person.

When they get together, they may override your decisions. But mot of the time these people will have conflicting ideals so the decision falls on the Director.

The Robotics Director married a Toaster. He can call it an experiment, but when he walks around saying "Synths are people too!" you realize that it is NOT an experiment. And looking at how Ayo talks about him, it is pretty clear everyone knows he is married to a Toaster... and they still let him be one of their head scientists.

When you make the Isntitute's Radio speech, you can do the very opposite of deciding to leave the Wastelanders to themselves. "We are here to help" means the Institute's official stance, no matter what Shaun wanted, is to meddle in Wasteland's affairs.

Why would he need to be talked into reason? He makes you his heir even if you openly reject each of his beliefs.

The only things he forces upon you is destruction of the Institute's enemies that CAN'T be reasoned with. Minutemen are also his enemies (as they fought against them until Pinned), but as they can be reasoned with, he lets you deal with it however you want.

Shaun tells you his beliefs, but he only needs you to agree with ONE of them: "The Institute should be protected." Unlike Desdemona and Maxson, he does not force you to agree with his ideals or makes it a requirement to join his side. He may be the craziest and evilest of them, but is ironically also the most reasonable one.

Cause he believes that the surface dwellers are doomed barbarians, a frightening brood of beasts that threaten the survival of humanity - by which he only includes the Institute. Talk to him about the progress surface dwellers have made? Your son might as well have been raised on Enclave holotapes, and these irreversible beliefs aren't just what shaped the Institute's direction for the past few decades, they've become the prevailing belief of 'Stute personnel. What opinions to the contrary we hear? Crushed, shot down, minority. We cannot change that without massive paradigm shifts or revolt.

Yes, he believes so strongly in it that he kicks you out if you disagree. Oh wait,,, he doesn't.

Seriously, he can think what he wants, as long as he doesn't force YOU to believe in it. He doesn't force even the rest of the Institute to agree: Madison is a Wastelander and someone who believes the Institute should be helping Wastelanderers (something Shaun would strongly disagree with), and he made this recruit one of most powerful people in the Institute. He thinks that Synths are machines, but did that make him take down Binet from his position after he married a Synth or when Binet started saying that Synths are people? No, he allowed him to stay as a Department Director and one of his personal advisors (and maybe even made him one after the marriage as far as we know). After taking down Gabriel, it is also made clear that most of the citizens in the Institute are happy that Wastelanders were saved of that menace, suggesting he did not use propaganda to influence their beliefs either.

He had decades to spread propaganda in order to make others follow his ideals and replace everyone who isn't like him... and he did not do it. Unlike the likes of Maxson (who was revered by his subjects just like Shaun was by his), he did not abuse the fact that people revered him to make them be like him. Desdemona is no different either: as far as she is concerned, you either agree or disagree with her. Everyone who doesn't agree with her is rotten.

Shaun has his beliefs, but he doesn't force anyone to follow them. You can be his polar opposite, and he will still make you a big name in his organization (like Madison and the player) as long as he thinks you will do your job well.

So I ask again: why does it matter? He dies, he makes you his successor even if you are his polar opposite and the rest of The Institute does not follow his ideals (or any ideals at all).

Which makes me realize... Of all four factions, the Institute is the one with most varied people as far as personal beliefs are concerned. Another plus for them I think.

I guess a strength of the underlying story is that while I was fine with betraying the BoS due to so of the extreme views and attitudes of the leadership I regretted fighting the more reasonable brothers (and sisters). While we needed to stop the Institute's attacks on the wasteland and (imo) free the [level 3] Synths I very much regret the destruction of the institute and letting down my son. Finally, while I supported freeing the synths I disagreed with the RR's single minded desire to see the Institute destroyed...

My biggest reasons for turning on the Institute was not wanting to destroy the RR. I still don't know if I did the "right" thing or if i would make the same decisions again.

Except the BoS, they turned out to be rather unpleasant in the end and deserved what the got (well, most of them did)... and I have liked the BoS from Fallout 1 through to now...

That's not really true.

Understandable, that's the direction I was heading towards originally I think. The illness thing was just the tipping point for my character. Her "mom instinct" kicked in I guess.

I'm doing a Railroad play through right now. I think from now on the Railroad will die in every single one of my play throughs (maybe even this one if I switch to the Minutemen). Any faction that sends me all the way to one end of the map, into territory I have no business being in because my level is way too low (and under-geared), to pick up an item who's sole purpose is to tell me to go to the opposite end of the map (into territory that is too easy) deserves to die.

Are you sure you're not talking about the Minutemen?

"Help us from the big bad scary Ferals on the other side of the map!" "Mr. Abernanthy has been kidnapped for the tenth-millionth time! HEEELLPPP!!!"

The Minutemen have yet to send me into regions way over my level.

I believed it was level sensitive at least until I was sent way down south to that farm occupied by a guy and his two kids. Very annoying.

I would make a case and say that the Brotherhood is probably split just as much belief wise.* Scribe Haylen and others felt that Danse, despite his true nature, was Brotherhood to the very core. It's a damn shame they didn't include the alternative scenarios for the BoS with either Danse becoming Elder or the SS.

*Also consider that human/ghoul liaisons are a common enough occurrence among BoS members, that it warrants being asked during a medical examination. Seems like they like to tip toe the line in the sand quite a bit.

Thanks, Akul! I actually meant MM, not Institute - typo, sorry. I guess with the MM you don't have to destroy the BoS (I didn't), but I read that it would eventually happen if the BoS quest line were advanced.

Even the Elder, for all his zeal, can admit that a synth could be a force of good, and possibly a Brother. When the "humans only" group is the voice of possible tolerance, you'd begin to suspect that Shaun's had his head in the sand too long.

I guess the key issue with the 3 conflicting factions (leaving the MM out of this) is that the all "go to far"...

The BoS are trying to control the spread of technology to protect mankind and fight the dangers of the wasteland created by that technology. But they go to far by seeking to control/restrict all technology and seeking to destroy all perceived threats, i.e. not distinguishing between ferals and regular ghouls, wanted to kill all synths for what they are, not what they have done...

The Institute is trying to save mankind by keeping it safe underground and advancing the sciences to help it grow and remain safe. But it goes to far in how it deals with anything it perceives as any sort of threat and it's elitist views in differentiating between the mankind in the Institute and the expendable remnants of mankind out in the wastes.

The RR seek to free those they perceive as enslaved but do so even if it is to the detriment of others. They go to far when the opportunity presents itself as with the destruction of the BoS and the Institute. You also witness them lying to further further their goals.

I think one of the reasons the RR can be perceived as the "good guys" is that their atrocities tend to be reactive. You are often sent to rescue rather than destroy, at least at first. And when you are sent to assassinate it is either the highly dangerous (or at least they are supposed to be) coursers or cruel raiders who target and torture synths. By the time you are attacking the BoS and the Institute you have witnessed attacks by both groups on the RR, the Institute attacks in particular being total slaughters. This defensive and reactive nature makes them seem more victim than villain even if you think what they are trying to do is pointless, misguided or even dangerous...