how many of you guys think the idea's you put into this discussion might get chosen to be put into tha game?
or will they chuck an dragon age ea mistake and make a sequel to a good game not so good and just ignore every one?

Not many, becose people suggest so stupid things like: 1:1 timescale or making multiplayer for TES games...

Ignoring the fanbase is usually the way to go. To listen to a vocal minority when you design a game for the majority is a commerical suicide. There are lots of games that gone horribly wrong after they listened to a vocal minority, mainly MMOs like Star Wars Galaxies.

Not to mention that fans usually just ask for some specific features they would like to see with no regard of the overall design of the game. Seriously, game developers have plenty of designers working full time to come up with stuff, it's what they do.

Now it's too late to give ideas for Skyrim anyway. The design doc for Skyrim was made and finalised years ago. Right now they just following it very strictly and do what it tells them to do. You can't really keep adding stuff to the design doc, or you have a Duke Nukem Forever on your hands

that duke nukem what you said is funny cause its TRUE ahaha there was a reason why it was called Duke Nukem FOREVER

Here's the truth, most ideas posted by fans are terrible. Just...terrible. Many of mine are as well, I'm studying game design, I'm trying to do this for a living, many of my ideas are still awful. Bethesda is staffed by people that know what they're doing, I don't think anyone can reasonably disagree with that at this point, I don't agree with every decision they've made over the years, but I respect the fact that they do what they feel is right.

I know what a joke. How can that game be taken serious at all anymore? I know it's finally being released but it's as good as dead to many people anyway.

There can be only one Techno Viking

o REALLY

How can you study game design?

Anyway, you are right.. Most of the ideas posted by fans ARE terrible! The co-op suggestion, however, is fine.

Feature creep in an RPG will kill its chances of seeing a final release faster than listening to laymen fans will kill its coherence and artistic merit, not to mention the enthusiasm of its developers.

Only when your idea is met with mass opposition should you back down and fix something (cough, Oblivion's level scaling, cough); otherwise you're just obeying the whims of people who, since you're the one doing all the work, probably know less and care less about the game than you do.

So franky I hope Bethesda aren't listening too attentively. There are guys on these forums who could hold their own against or even best Todd and his crew at game design, but not many of them, and whether the final product would be better or worse in their hands is always going to be subjective.

Edit: Bethesda aren't EA, and The Elder Scrolls isn't Dragon Age, not by a long shot. Enough said there.

Of course they haven't and shouldn't listen to many fan ideas.

Just my ideas.

Uh... in what way is that implausible?

Playable Argonian and Khajiit in Morrowind is the big exception here.
Granted it was probably pretty easy to do technically but had huge impact wonder if it was some dialogue bugs who assumed the character could not be a beast race?

Oblivion level scaling did not require fan response to fix On the other hand the complain that Morrowind and Fallout 3 was to easy at high level was probably mostly from fans and other power gamers, fallout 3 would be far harder without the unique weapons.
To me many of the expansions to Fallout 3 looked like a huge fan service.
The pit, get all the .44 and sniper rifle ammo you need.
Broken steel, continue after endgame, higher level cap and high level content.
Pont Lookout, two perks who made it easier to kill the broken steel enemies
Mothership zeta. A lot of epoxy (repair hammers)

It's important to remember here that Skyrim is less than a year away from its scheduled release date, so that's going to limit the changes Bethesda can make to the final product. So there's a lot of ideas that, even if Bethesda might have considered them worthy if they were suggested at the start of the game's development cycle, would simply not be feasible to do now.

And just because an idea doesn't get put into the game doesn't mean the developers are ignoring their fanbase. Just because a select group of fans want something doesn't mean it would be a good idea to put it in the game, maybe said idea wouldn't go well with the majority of players, or just wouldn't fit in with the overall direction the developers are going in. And developers need to take these things into account. While from the perspective of a fan, it feels nice to know the developers care about what the fanbase thinks, if Bethesda were to add everything that their fans wanted, Skyrim would become an incoherent mess that no one likes, and that's if it doesn't fall into development hell due to Bethesda needing to constantly change things to satisfy the endless demands of the fanbase. While you'll often hear people say developers should listen to their fans, and I won't disagree with that, that just means they should hear what their fanbase wants, it doesn't mean they should always try to cater to those demands. Sometimes, developers just have to decide that this is what they're going to do, even if maybe some fans have other ideas.

That isn't to say we shouldn't post what we want to see in the game here, of course, after all, the point of these forums is to discuss Skyrim, this includes what we want or don't want from the game. It just means we shouldn't assume that just because we ask for something here means we'll get it, and that if we don't, then Bethesda doesn't care about their fans.



And I'm glad that Bethesda decided to listen to their fans in that respect. Morrowind was the game that introduced me to the Elder Scrolls and therefore, I would certainly have played it if Bethesda had not done so (Being as I wouldn't have known that we were able to play as them in past games.) but I probably wouldn't look on the series the same way I do now had it not been for that.



That does seem to be true about the Fallout 3 DLC, when you think about it. And I think Oblivion's level scaling was probably an answer to the complaint's of Morrowind's lack of challenge at high levels, and the problems with that do go to show that just because you try to adress you're fans' complaints doesn't mean the results will be better.

None, which is why I avoid posting my own ideas and only comment on those posted by others . If I really wanted myself heard I'd make a mod to illustrate my point.

In the same way you study anything else: you either listen to a seasoned expert share his knowledge and/or you research the topic yourself.

6 years in the making. For a game, that's a lot of love and care. Unlike BioWare who want to have Call of Duty's fanbase.

Fact is all those threads you see that go along the lines of "OMFG beth PLeasE!!1! includ speers an muskits andd teh hole world and multyplayer an let me play as a GoaST!!!!11!" are going to have as much influence on the game design as a kitten trying to push the moon out of orbit. The stage at which the community may have some say is after the game is released, when Beth will gauge what was popular or not so they can plan their next edition; however, this influence in indirect and the impact the forums would have then is probably anolagous to a rhino trying pushing the moon out of orbit.

Also, release is only a matter of months away and Beth are confident (almost certain) they're going to make it. Prolonging production to add spears (for example) in order to please a handful of forum posters (that are going to buy and I daresay enjoy the game anyway) does not make sense.

well from what I saw in the trailer and in the game coverage info

I think they have done a pretty good job, MANY improvements over OB mistakes and what I saw so far makes me happy like a kitten on a diet of sweet meats.

True. Done. End thread. All there is. :icecream:


Uh. Game Design School? Where have you been? :whistling:
Aaaand, no. Co-op is not fine. For me, anyway....