I'd like to hear recommendations about what you think the worst possible build is. I'm currently a 7th level Imperial playing on Master with my existing perks spread over Speech, Pickpocket, Lockpicking, Smithing, Alchemy, and Enchantment (1 perk in each). Is there a worse way to build a character than not putting perks into combat/archery/armor/magick/stealth and by spreading them out all over the place? Should I be putting perks into Alteration or Illusion or something else?

This isn't a troll thread. I'd like to test the complaints people are making to see whether or not the perks are unbalanced in such a way that it is possible to gimp yourself and make the game unplayable. Other than a bad character build, everything else will be played normally, so I'll use whatever weapons and equipment I find, magic, companions, etc., as intelligently and strategically as possible. So far I haven't had any problems but I'm expecting the difficulty curve to come up soon.

1 Perk in each skill means by lvl 19 you will be the absolute worst jack of all trades ever. hahah

A mage that mostly specializes and uses destruction magic.

Well, for the absolute worst character possible:

Lockpicking should be your first skill you dump all your perks in. This skill is absolutely worthless, since you can easily open any lock in the game without investing a single perk point.

(The only lock in the game that you will have a hard time opening without all the perks is the master practice lock in the thieves guild training room, since that lock resets its target zone with every pick you break.)

Pickpocket and Persuasion are also pretty damn worthless, though with 100 Pickpocket you could in theory steal someones weapons and armor and poison their pants before fighting them.

Your attack skill should definately be destruction, while it starts out the strongest, it ends up by far the weakest.

As far as clothing is concerned, robes are probaply the thing to go with. Robes in Skyrim have no advantage whatsoever, the only good thing about robes is that its relatively easy to get robes that carry a powerful enchantment from a vendor, but if you can make enchantments yourself you can easily get the same bonuses on any piece of armor. Of course your character won't be able to make enchantments because then he wouldn't be awful.


So, if we assume a character has 5 skills, then I'd say the most worthless combination of 5 skills would be Lockpicking, Pickpocket, Persuasion, Destruction, Restoration.

Restoration isn't really a crappy skill, but after the first 4 there is little to pick from that's really awful, and Restoration is absolutely worthless on a character with Destruction, since you'll be out of mana all the time.

I might end up doing that.



I'm not convinced that would be the worst build. Surely maxing out Destruction is at least somewhat better than having part perks in Speech, Pickpocket, and Lockpicking.



Thanks for the suggestions.

The only thing I'm going to intentionally gimp is the perk selection process. The point is to simulate a player who plays well, but ends up picking a terrible build for whatever reason. That way, all other things being equal (making best armor/weapon/spell choices, using companions, being cautious, etc.) it will hopefully throw some light on the perks themselves. I'm going to do my best to play well and restrict my character's stupidity to choosing perks. I'll still be enchanting, smithing, etc., but I won't be grinding anything, I'll just be using them a reasonable amount. At present, I've only been able to invest a single perk in any skill because none of these skills are high enough to let me invest more. Based on playing smart and following the main quest, there isn't a lot of use for these skills yet. It's mostly combat, though my Sneak and Archery are pretty high since I'm playing it on Master and don't want to get annihilated every few minutes. I'm still not investing any perks in these skills though.

Out of curiosity, what do you think is the worst attribute to invest points in? So far I've put all my points into Stamina since Magicka and Health have obvious benefits and Stamina is a little more nebulous.

Well, Stamina lets you carry more phat loot. But as long as you find a safe spot to dump your ingots and dragons bones/scales, even that won't improve your loot rate very quickly. Master with 100 Health? Sounds like the plan is never to get hit at all.

This. There's so many conflicting skills that this build would be so bad to pull off.

thats easy, pick every perk into the pickpocketing, lockpicking and speech skills



yeah... go get your noob mods m8

A High Elf with no armor, using duel-wield daggers in straight-up combat.

The irony? I'm going to make that.

Old Frozen Butt on the path to High Hrothgar was a one-hit killer for me. Died like 20-30 times before I figured out the right combination of scrolls, poisons, potions, spells, shouts, and moves to pwn him. I've never wished so strongly for the ability to high-five a companion as I did when we finally beat him. Still, that was the only battle I've had any trouble with. Beat him on level 7 playing Master with no combat perks and 100 health. And I do generally avoid getting hit whenever possible. I wouldn't be able to do it without Lydia, who tanks most things, even on Master. I have two basic strategies: stealth shot them from a distance or hit hard and fast and then run away when I'm up close. I'm actually having a blast, though I avoid two-handers like the plague and let Lydia deal with them.


That's what I'm starting to think, too. Still, I think putting any points into armor or weapon skills is going to be too useful. Let's see how long I can survive with 100 Health and no combat skills. All that Stamina comes from running away all of the time.

Speech, Lockpicking, Pickpocketing, Destruction

Tell me how you do on master w/ this

go full speech, smith, pickpocket, then one point in the rest...also only dump points every level into magic but never use magic

Naked Hand-to-Hand character.

I'm trying, but I have to use those skills more before it will let me spend any more on them. I'm not going to grind anything because that sort of defeats the purpose of this particular test, which is just to simulate a player trying to play the game the way they want you to play it but making terrible perk choices. Grinding is a separate balancing issue and I don't want to muddle the results.



Sounds like fun!

Again, I'm allowing myself to use the best weapons and armor I find and handling combat strategically. The test is just to see if you can gimp yourself through perk selection all other things being equal.

That's the plan!


No, I'm using magic as effectively as I can, I'm just not putting points into Magicka or magic school perks (unless they seem like better (ie. worse) choices). Dumping defeats the purpose of the test since it's not to play stupidly, just to see if bad perk choices will actually gimp your character. Actually, to see if there even is such a thing as bad perk choices. Maybe I'll find out that having all my points in Pickpocket, Lockpicking and Speech is the way to go!


:facepalm:

Don't use the perks.

I know you are doing an experiment to make yourself as bad as possible so you will spend perks but out of interest has anyone tried going through the game not spending any perks yet to see how difficult it is?

Well, the developers expect you to use perks. The test is just to see if picking the wrong perks makes the game unplayable, as many people on the forums suggest. And I'm not trying to make my character as bad as possible; I'm only targeting perks and attributes, the stuff you choose when leveling up. Everything else I'm playing straight.

read the complaint threads here on this forum. each one claims that there's a serious gamebreaking issue with builds or how the game works. I'm sure that in twenty minutes you'll have Gospel on 20 ways to make a bad character

A melee guy in robes using fortify barter enchants only.

Worst character build = don't use perks, wear armor, and punch everything with your fists.

Actually...wouldn't that be the Chuck Norris build, and thus the best ever?

A pure lockpicking, destruction mage.

Worst build= no combat skills whatsoever. Increase ONLY enchanting, alchemy, smithing and speech.

Edit: Argh, double post, sorry

Magicka is the worst atribute to invest in, because if you're really serious about fighting with spells it's much easier to reduce their cost to 0 than to overcome the massive in-combat regen reduction or build up a larger pool.

Smithing, Alchemy, Enchanting, Speech, Lockpicking and Pickpocketing.

No combat skills, no armor skills, no magic skills.

If you can beat the MQ or any Guild Quests with this build, I salute you.