[Stace]

I honestly never thought I'd make one of these... not because I thought I would never have a relationship to post about (Cuz dats naut true I getz tunsa ladyies), but because I never thought I would need advice on something like this from you guys. Well... I do. Oh well, I lasted a good year and a half or so...

So when I first moved to San Francisco for college back in June, I knew nobody. Now, luckily, I have a number of friends. One of my best friends is also one of the first people I met. For this thread, we'll call her, I don't know, Jane. At this point you're probably thinking "Omg Antibody likes his friend time to stop reading and post ask her out," but it's actually the exact opposite. She likes me. The problem being, I like her too, but only as a friend. When we first met we discovered that we had a hell of a lot in common. I actually started liking her romantically then, but my personal philosophy of "I'd rather have a friend than a girlfriend" suppressed those feelings. With those feelings suppressed, we quickly became really good friends, and any feelings I had completely disappeared. But I was happy because I had a great friend. In the past few weeks we've been hanging out a lot with our mutual friends, but even more so by ourselves, making each other laugh over stupid stuff and just having fun. But...

A week or two into the friendship I started noticing subtle hints that she liked me more than a friend. Just things in conversations that didn't really feel right. It wasn't long until she and her friends started hinting so obviously that it was impossible not to know she liked me more than a friend. The funny thing is, even before I realized this, I had been telling her I'm not looking for a relationship right now, and truthfully I'm not. I went on a date recently with someone, but she asked me out, so I figured I'd give it a shot. It didn't work out, but the point is, I didn't go looking for it. Once I realized Jane liked me I started repeating that line almost every time I saw her. But she just didn't get the hint.

It's funny, her and her close friends think that I'm this oblivious idiot who has no idea Jane likes him. But I do, and ironically they're oblivious to the fact that I clearly know. Last week me and Jane had a conversation where we were talking about the people we liked, yet again (she has this horrible habit of bringing this up constantly to get me to confess my love to her or something), and I gave my strongest hint yet after she told me who she liked. She didn't say who, but she described him, which was incredibly painful to hear because she described everything she liked about me. It was painful because I knew that I'd be breaking this girl's heart by telling her I don't like her more than a friend. But I gave her my strong hint and hoped for the best. The next day Jane's friend, who is also my good friend, asked me "So how are you and Jane doing?" I said "Do you mean what happened the other night?" And she said "Well, Jane told me on Facebook that "I think he knows." This made my heart sink. Why? Because she said "think," meaning she still does not get it. And this means that I'm going to have to tell her directly, no more beating around the bush. And I am absolutely dreading that conversation.

I know for a fact that I will devastate her by telling her this. She is really, really invested in this, I can't stress that enough. She has complained many, many times about past guys only wanting to be friends and how pissed she is about that. She also has a tendency to freak out. And she's one of my best friends in this city. When I look at her and talk to her, it's like I'm talking to a sister. Thinking about her romantically is simply not possible and to be perfectly honest kind of disgusts me, not because of her looks but because, again, I think of her like a sister. But I have a horrible feeling that no matter how much I explain myself about how I just want to stay friends, I'm going to lose a best friend in the process. I'm going to have a chat with our friend who told me about the Facebook comment later this week, as she said she'll tell me all the details about her feelings that I need to know as she's been venting to her for weeks about it. So that will help. I've been thinking about what I'm going to say to her, and while I think I know the best thing to say, I'm really dreading it. I feel like no matter what I say, it wont matter to her and all she'll think is that I think she isn't attractive, when it's much more complicated than that. But I have to tell her, because she will never get the hint if I don't, and even if she did, she would not understand why I feel the way I do.

So... yeah. I mainly made this topic to vent about it, and to ask for some support and advice. "Ask her out" posts aren't really welcome. I just need to talk to people about this because it's been on my mind quite a bit lately and fills me with dread every time I think about it. Thanks guys.

[OTTO]

OK, let me get this straight:

When you first met her, you were attracted to her. You like her. She likes you. You have a lot in common and enjoy each other's company.

Stop being a wally and ask her out!!

Seriously.

"I'd rather have a friend than a girlfriend?" Don't give me that crap! You can make a million friends in the world but a decent girlfriend is hard to come by - ask any of the other relationship-threaders on this forum.

I'll also tell you something else. I had a friend who was just-a-friend, and I'd drop hints that I wanted him to ask me out but he never did, for whatever warped reason of his own. Then someone else asked me out and I went out with them, and suddenly Mr-Just-A-Friend realised what an idiot he'd been, and went around with this facepalm-expression until my new boyfriend said he found it a little awkward and I stopped hanging out with Just-A-Friend. So, to sum up, he ended up with neither a girlfriend or a friend.

On the other hand, I once had this friend who'd always had a girlfriend, so we were genuinely just friends, but then he and his girlfriend broke up. So he and I decided that we'd waited long enough, and were going to date each other. We just kissed a few times, but after a day or two, we just started laughing and realised that any spark between us had evaporated the minute we were actually given the opportunity to do anything about it, and we went quite comfortably back to being friends without any regrets whatsoever.

I just don't think you have anything to lose by taking your girl-friend's hints, and everything to lose by pushing her away.

[KRistina Karlsson]

-snip

Was that the moderator version of 'Just ask her out' ?

But yeah I agree with the bunny lady, pretty solid advice imo ^

[Euan]

You know I'm gonna say it, buddy. ^^ THIS!! ^^

Simply put, if making out with her is awkward for you, it'll be awkward for her.

Trust me.

After a few dates you both might come to the conclusion that it's like brother and sis.. and that making out on that level of relationship is weird.

On the other hand, you might surprise yourself, and in forty years have grandkids :shrug:

Good luck.. and b.t.w. 'playah', :hubbahubba: ..this sounds like a luxury problem

[Juan Cerda]

OK, let me get this straight:

When you first met her, you were attracted to her. You like her. She likes you. You have a lot in common and enjoy each other's company.

Stop being a wally and ask her out!!

Seriously.

"I'd rather have a friend than a girlfriend?" Don't give me that crap! You can make a million friends in the world but a decent girlfriend is hard to come by - ask any of the other relationship-threaders on this forum.

I'll also tell you something else. I had a friend who was just-a-friend, and I'd drop hints that I wanted him to ask me out but he never did, for whatever warped reason of his own. Then someone else asked me out and I went out with them, and suddenly Mr-Just-A-Friend realised what an idiot he'd been, and went around with this facepalm-expression until my new boyfriend said he found it a little awkward and I stopped hanging out with Just-A-Friend. So, to sum up, he ended up with neither a girlfriend or a friend.

On the other hand, I once had this friend who'd always had a girlfriend, so we were genuinely just friends, but then he and his girlfriend broke up. So he and I decided that we'd waited long enough, and were going to date each other. We just kissed a few times, but after a day or two, we just started laughing and realised that any spark between us had evaporated the minute we were actually given the opportunity to do anything about it, and we went quite comfortably back to being friends without any regrets whatsoever.

I just don't think you have anything to lose by taking your girl-friend's hints, and everything to lose by pushing her away.

I liked her at one point, this is true. But like I said, I have absolutely no romantic feelings for her anymore and dating her now would be like dating my sister. I can't date her. A date with her would be the most horrifically awkward date in history. I would jump away when she got too close, I would cringe if she touched me and if she wanted me to kiss her I would only be able to muster up the type of kiss one gives to their grandmother.

I have, actually, though a lot about whether or not I'll become "that guy" who suddenly wants to date after she gets a boyfriend. But I'm confident that's not going to happen, I just do not feel that way about her and her dating someone wouldn't change that at all.

I know I have everything to lose by pushing her away. But the reality is I have nothing to gain by dating her except a forced first date and a super-awkward friendship after it doesn't work out. You would think a super-awkward friendship would be better than no friendship, however, as I said, she has been "just friends" with many love interests before and if the date fails as miserably as I know it will I'm afraid she'll think it's because of her, which it's not. That would result in a no friendship scenario anyway and I'd have probably hurt her more than if I just told her directly about how I feel about her.

[Lou]

I have, actually, though a lot about whether or not I'll become "that guy" who suddenly wants to date after she gets a boyfriend. But I'm confident that's not going to happen,

Yeah..... thats going to happen.

[Natasha Callaghan]

Yeah..... thats going to happen.

Do you ever get jealous of the guy dating your sister? Even if you don't have a sister, you should still get my point.

[Stay-C]

Do you ever get jealous of the guy dating your sister? Even if you don't have a sister, you should still get my point.

Why do you think of her as a sister, though? I mean, don't you treat your friends differently from your family? Do you actually have a sister to compare her to?

[Kieren Thomson]

I agree with Princess_stomper. Go out with her a few times. Make out with her. If all works out you'll still have a friend.

My wife and I have been friends since we were two. I never dated her before. We were just childhood friends. Went to the same school. Lived in the same town. Then I moved away to Colorado. But that only lasted a few years and I moved back to Jersey. We started dating and after a few years got married. And, she is still my best friend.

And she was "Just-A-Friend".

Don't be a fool.

Just ask her out already.

[no_excuse]

Why do you think of her as a sister, though? I mean, don't you treat your friends differently from your family? Do you actually have a sister to compare her to?

I don't have a sister to compare her too, but I figure it feels the same as thinking about a cousin that way, and I do have female cousins. All of my other friends-that-are-girls, I think of them as friends. If one of them wanted to try going out, I'd be willing to give it a shot, because thinking about them like that doesn't seem weird. But me and Jane have gotten really close, and I like her a lot, but only as much as I'd like a family member, and not in a romantic way. I don't exactly know why I feel the way I do, but I do. Thinking about her romantically simply does not feel right. It just feels wrong, like, as I've said already, thinking about a sister or a relative that way.

[Trevi]

Just ask her out.

Take it casual. If it doesn't work out, you can still be friends. Contrary to common belief, most people (especially at a young age), still talk after a break up. Hell, I still talk to my ex from way back who turned out to be Satan incarnate.

Not that you'd be breaking up, of course.


Friendship is the basis of any lasting relationship, not love.

[Shelby Huffman]

It's already been said multiple times, so I don't have to bother piling that part on again.

But I will say this- it doesn't sound so much like you know it can't work, but rather like you're working overtime trying to convince yourself that it can't work. Which suggests to me that it very well could. I've been wrong before...but then I've also been right before. :shrug: For what it's worth.

[Daniel Brown]

I don't have a sister to compare her too, but I figure it feels the same as thinking about a cousin that way, and I do have female cousins. All of my other friends-that-are-girls, I think of them as friends. If one of them wanted to try going out, I'd be willing to give it a shot, because thinking about them like that doesn't seem weird. But me and Jane have gotten really close, and I like her a lot, but only as much as I'd like a family member, and not in a romantic way. I don't exactly know why I feel the way I do, but I do. Thinking about her romantically simply does not feel right. It just feels wrong, like, as I've said already, thinking about a sister or a relative that way.

I think you are over thinking it. Seriously, you are over anolyzing your feelings. Stop thinking that she is a friend more like a sister you don't even have. Just entertain her and go out with her. You might find out that your feelings are wrong and what you are feeling are not those of friendship. Take a chance and go out with her. From your above post you seem to be contradicting yourself.

You say you have females as friends and you'd go out with them? Why not this chick? Doesn't make sense to me.

Growing up, I could count how many girls I dated on one hand. Any opportunity to go out with a girl I took.

If I were you. I'd take that chance. like it was said before, you both might end up staying friends and not pursuing it any further or you might find out that you do actually like her.

If you don't take that chance, you'll end up kicking yourself in the ass later.

[Alisia Lisha]

I think you are over thinking it. Seriously, you are over anolyzing your feelings. Stop thinking that she is a friend more like a sister you don't even have. Just entertain her and go out with her. You might find out that your feelings are wrong and what you are feeling are not those of friendship. Take a chance and go out with her. From your above post you seem to be contradicting yourself.

You say you have females as friends and you'd go out with them? Why not this chick? Doesn't make sense to me.

Growing up, I could count how many girls I dated on one hand. Any opportunity to go out with a girl I took.

If I were you. I'd take that chance. like it was said before, you both might end up staying friends and not pursuing it any further or you might find out that you do actually like her.

If you don't take that chance, you'll end up kicking yourself in the ass later.

I'm not convincing myself of anything. I know my own feelings. Should I start saying female cousin, just because I don't have a sister? It's the same basic idea, they're both female relatives. I didn't contradict myself, in fact what I said is the same as I've been saying, she just feels different. I wouldn't mind dating other friends, but I would mind dating her. Thinking about it truly makes me a little queasy. Now, that sounds like it's because of her looks, and it's not, but I just feel absolutely no attraction to her other than being friends. The reason, I think, I liked her at first was because I didn't know her. It's easy to like someone you don't know. But now that I know her so well, for some reason, I just don't think of her this way.

Let me say this once more. Anyone thinking about giving me advice, think about how fun it would be to go on a date with a relative of the opposite six. Fun huh? Yeah, that is exactly how I feel, and I am in no way exaggerating this feeling. Maybe if I could get rid of that feeling dating would be possible, but I can't. This isn't a problem that can be solved by dating her, unless you guys think it's wise to go on a date feeling queasy every time she tries to act like more than just a friend.

[Nathan Hunter]

First, I'm with the majority of the people here, I'd take her out and see how it goes... If it doesn't work out, then hey, at least you gave it a shot, right? There's no unwritten law that you _have_ to have romantic feelings before you ask someone out who is interested in you. They might come later, they might not. Thing is, if you don't give it a chance, you'll never know. Be honest and upfront with her about that. You'll not lose her as a girlfriend because you went out with her and it didn't work out, unless one of you is unable to cope with a mature friendship. (For the record: this doesn't seem to be the case; you seem mature and sensitive enough to consider the feelings of the other party involved).

My girlfriend and me were in the exact same position before we got together as a couple, only the roles were reversed. She was my best friend and we got along together absolutely great, I considered her a sister as well... Right to the point where we _both_ jokingly said it was a shame we didn't have romantic feelings for one another, since we'd have been a great couple. We both laughed about that. Later on, I did develop romantic feelings for her at a certain point, but I never diluded myself into thinking she was into me. She knew right from the start when I was getting into her romantically, but did not dare confront me. I, on the other hand, supressed my feelings, since I was not comfortable confronting her with them, and once I'd supressed them we talked about it...

Turned out, even though she wasn't interested romantically in me at that point, she was willing to take the step and see where things went from there on. We're together for over a year now, we're both madly in love with one another, we're both perfectly happy. If we hadn't taken that chance, we wouldn't be there.

I'm not saying this will be the case for you, I'm just saying that if you don't take the chance, you'll never know for sure. Feelings change.

Second, pardon my abruptness, but what exactly do you think you are accomplishing by not telling her directly you're not interested? Seriously, nearly everyone I know has, when someone is interested in them and it's not reciprocal, this - in my opinion rather immature and incomprehensible- tendancy to bury their heads in the sand and hope it will go away by itself. They dilude themselves into thinking this is the easiest for both parties involved, since no feelings get hurt, right? Wrong. If it's as serious as you say, it won't just go away... It will just get worse and worse, to the point where she will basically be begging for a straight-out answer. I needn't tell you this, you know this as well, you've probably been in this situation yourself. Subtle clues are to no avail here.

Basically, you're both being insecure about it, and I can guarantee if her feelings don't go away and you don't do something about her, chances are your friendship will be ruined anyway. You're afraid your friendship will be changed and things won't be the same, well, think about it: your friendship has already changed. Her feelings have been added to the equation. There is no chance whatsoever that you can go back to being like before. There just isn't. The only way is forward. What will you do about her feelings?

I'm not saying you should smash her every hope and ruin her life, as you seem to be thinking. Why do people always have such angst when it comes to talking about feelings? She loves you, you don't, big deal. If you're absolutely unwilling to go through with her romantically but wish to retain her as a friend, then talk to her about it in an honest, straightforward, and mature manner. Be understanding with her. If you lose her as a friend because of this because she can't cope with it, then she's not really mature (again, from your description it seems you both are, hence my point).

In this scenario, you're bound to hurt her feelings anyway. Please don't dilude yourself into thinking it will be easier for her if you just ignore it - which, from her point of view, you're already doing. I'm afraid subtle hints aren't exactly going to work here - she's probably so madly in love with you she ignores those herself, as you say. You know what it's like if you're in love with someone and it's not reciprocal, right? If you don't say anything, it will just get worse and worse until the point where it's almost unbearable.

Long story short: there's no going back to before all this, your friendship has already been changed. Only question is what you're going to do with it. You can either take the chance, or, if you're not willing, stabilize the situation by clearing the sky of any uncertainties. Either way, hoping she will catch the hint isn't going to work - she will just wind up hurt either way. Myself, I'd choose the short pain over the long, drawn-out one.

[Amelia Pritchard]

If she really is a good friend, then she'll respect your decision. Maybe she'll be upset or whatever for a while, but if she really is a great friend, then she should be willing to respect your decision on the no-romance thing.

If she just wants to get in your pants, then she'll be angry that you aren't obliging her. And that's not really what good friends do - it's the sort of thing manipulative/deceptive people do.

Disclaimer: I have no experience with relationships.

[stevie critchley]

-snip-

Thanks for typing this out. I admit that the fact that I've been pretending to ignore her feelings is rather immature but when I started doing it I didn't realize just how much she liked me. And now I've backed myself into a corner.

After reading your post, I am thinking that trying it out is more appropriate... note that I still really don't want to do that, at all, but you made a compelling argument for me not really having much of a choice. Your last sentence really convinced me, as telling her my feelings and having to deal with not having her as a friend anymore is worse than going on a single, incredibly uncomfortable date and her finding out herself.

I still have to talk to the friend I mentioned about just how deep her feelings run. I already know how strong her feelings are, unfortunately, but I need to make sure I'm prepared for just what I'm getting myself into.

[Lizbeth Ruiz]

I'm not convincing myself of anything.

But you are. See below.

Should I start saying female cousin, just because I don't have a sister? It's the same basic idea, they're both female relatives.

You already have it set in your mind that you consider her more your sister or cousin than someone completely unrelated to you.

I didn't contradict myself, in fact what I said is the same as I've been saying, she just feels different. I wouldn't mind dating other friends, but I would mind dating her.

Right. Because you don't want to ruin a friendship. Sorry, but you are already on that road.

Thinking about it truly makes me a little queasy.

Again, you are convinced she is "like" your sister or cousin. YOU ARE NOT RELATED TO HER.

I just feel absolutely no attraction to her other than being friends.

Feelings can be wrong. For example. I have a car that I bought brand new when I was younger. To this day I still own this car. I love this car. But I no longer drive this car. I tried selling it but was hung up on the fact that it was the very first car I bought. I am right now in the process of cannibalizing this vehicle to make money off of it. I swore up and down to my wife and friends it would never come to this due to the feelings I had for this car. Feelings changed. I still love this car. But I want a newer car now. I still say go out with her. If you truly don't have romantic feelings for her then you've lost nothing. The date wouldn't work out and maybe she'll get the hint. It'd be like two friends going out for dinner. Hell, when I lived in Colorado I had feelings for my dispatcher. I asked her out and she shot me down. I lost nothing. We were still very good friends. We still went horseback riding, to movies, out to dinner. It worked out.

Let me say this once more. Anyone thinking about giving me advice, think about how fun it would be to go on a date with a relative of the opposite six.

Difference here is knowing full well that you aren't directly related to said person. No, I wouldn't date my sister or cousin for that matter. But given the opportunity to date a girl that I consider "like" my sister knowing she isn't.

Maybe if I could get rid of that feeling dating would be possible, but I can't.

Can't? Or won't look the fact that you consider her a "Sister-Like" friend?

I'm not trying to piss you off. I just think you are making a mistake by not going out with her. Take a chance, put your feeling aside and see what happens. I really think you are going to regret not taking the chance.

I have to ask though, you keep saying it is not about her looks but I think it may have something to do with it. Is she ugly?

[Angela Woods]

I have to ask though, you keep saying it is not about her looks but I think it may have something to do with it. Is she ugly?

He seems to be implying she's a bit clingy and hysterical.

[m Gardner]

I'm not trying to piss you off. I just think you are making a mistake by not going out with her. Take a chance, put your feeling aside and see what happens. I really think you are going to regret not taking the chance.

I have to ask though, you keep saying it is not about her looks but I think it may have something to do with it. Is she ugly?

My brain knows I'm not related to her, but the queasy feeling in my stomach says otherwise. :shrug:

Anyway:

He seems to be implying she's a bit clingy and hysterical.

She's not ugly, she's pretty average looking I guess. But the reason I keep repeating that it's not because of her looks is because I know that it sounds soooo much like it is. No matter what explanations I give for my lack of romantic feelings for her, no matter how true they are, it sounds like I'm not attracted to her because of her looks. Imagine how much it will sound like it if I actually told her this in real life, without the benefit of being able to type it all out and post more details as we go along. She would be convinced it's because of her looks. As I said, she is average, and she has had many love interests before who wanted to be just friends. And at this point she's convinced it's because of her looks. It seems almost certain that whatever I say to her will be heard by her as "You are ugly."

[T. tacks Rims]

Sounds to me like the relationship, romantic and otherwise is destined to fail anyway. At this point then. You could try to just burn the bridge. If she is already thinking its because of her looks even though you say it isn't then whatever friendship you may have had with her is fleeting.

Dating her to confirm your feelings may not matter at this point anyway. You've already hinted to her that you don't have those feelings anymore and she doesn't get it.

I think you already know what needs to be done at this point and are just looking for someone to say it.

[Skivs]

My brain knows I'm not related to her, but the queasy feeling in my stomach says otherwise. :shrug:

Anyway:



She's not ugly, she's pretty average looking I guess. But the reason I keep repeating that it's not because of her looks is because I know that it sounds soooo much like it is. No matter what explanations I give for my lack of romantic feelings for her, no matter how true they are, it sounds like I'm not attracted to her because of her looks. Imagine how much it will sound like it if I actually told her this in real life, without the benefit of being able to type it all out and post more details as we go along. She would be convinced it's because of her looks. As I said, she is average, and she has had many love interests before who wanted to be just friends. And at this point she's convinced it's because of her looks. It seems almost certain that whatever I say to her will be heard by her as "You are ugly."

Just print this page and post it to her, it's the manly thing to do.


Answer me this though, if she was absolutely stunningly hot, would you be more up for dating her?

[Kari Depp]

Sounds to me like the relationship, romantic and otherwise is destined to fail anyway. At this point then. You could try to just burn the bridge. If she is already thinking its because of her looks even though you say it isn't then whatever friendship you may have had with her is fleeting.

Dating her to confirm your feelings may not matter at this point anyway. You've already hinted to her that you don't have those feelings anymore and she doesn't get it.

I think you already know what needs to be done at this point and are just looking for someone to say it.

I don't want to date her, at all, even to confirm my feelings. But dating her and having the date go as awkward as I know it will may be necessary if I still want to stay friends with her. But then there's the good chance that she will think it was awkward because of her looks, and not because I just don't think of her like that.

Just print this page and post it to her, it's the manly thing to do.


Answer me this though, if she was absolutely stunningly hot, would you be more up for dating her?

Not if I still had the feeling I do now whenever I think about her romantically.

[Leonie Connor]

So when I first moved to San Francisco for college back in

which colllege do you go to?

[BlackaneseB]

which colllege do you go to?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Academy_of_Art_University, for Animation.

Why?