Due to request by some esteemed members of the Fallout community, this project is now aiming to attempt to replicate the damage system of the original fallouts.

Yes, you will now be able to use multiple types of ammo with each gun. (when the script gets written )


http://www.fallout3nexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=9636

no known bugs: if you find em, tell me!




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In my attempt to make fallout feel more like an RPG, this mod will make it so all weapons have a specific damage type, and each armor has a set of resistances.
This mod also includes reductions in actor health values, increases in weapon damage values, and balancing in armor DR values (and of course a fix to the heavy power armor)

There will be DLC conversion packs available eventually

Explosive weapons will be buffed to more realistic damage (mines being able to 1 hit unarmored humans, rocket launchers that actually knock stuff down)

Weapons will be tiered into a few different tiers:

Tier C:
Dart Gun
Rock-It Launcher
railway rifle

Tier B:
all .32 cal weapons
all 10mm cal weapons
all Assault Rifles
all shotgun variants

Tier A:
all .44 magnum weapons
all .308 caliber weapon variants

energy weapons:
all energy weapons

explosives:
all explosives


with few exceptions, the higher the tier of the weapon, the less armors are resistant against it (since it is of course stronger)

armor will be tiered, in tiers of 1-4, with 4 being the strongest (PA only)
armors of the same tier share the same characteristics:

1: casual clothing; small amount of low caliber resistance
2: average travel wear: raider clothing, leather armor etc: medium amount of low caliber resistance, low amount of medium caliber resistance
3: combat equipment: combat armor, any other heavy-non power armors; high LCR, medium MCR, low HCR, small amount of energy resistance
4: power armor: duh; totally resistant to LCR, highly resistance to MCR, moderately resistant to HCR, semi low amount of energy resistance
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For actor stats, this mod removes the HP bonus from leveling up, this applies to enemies as well as the PC.
For DLCs (when released), it will fix those enemies with stupidly high HP while keeping them at their originally intended difficulty level (no need anymore to nuke a tribal to get a 1hko)

HP will still be affected by endurance, so the range of HP will be 110-200 (100 base + 10 per endurance)

stimpacks are nerfed to 1/2 hp

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For weapons, they are all either left alone completely or have increased damage

There are allot of interesting changes going on here.

One thing of note however, and I might be wrong so please correct me, is that if these resistances work in a linear progression rather than a rock paper scissors formula then you have merely reimplemented the already existing damage resistance formula.

edit: This is in regards to the armor tier system.

why not stick to the originals formula?

I find little wrong with the original formula for what it is.
However why establish unique damage types only to make it so power armor offers the best mitigation from everything exactly as it did before?



Think about a system where the damage types offer greater effectiveness vs targets in a non linear fashion. Armor piercing rounds ( .308Caliber ) go through power armor but offer relatively low damage vs lesser geared targets compared to weapons such as the shotgun. Its the age old rpg element of in order to gain effectiveness in one area you have to give up something else.

the originals did that too, with modifiers on the bullets. You had the FMJ, and hollow points. then the advanced types like 2mmEC and 4.7mm that had good penetration by themselves. I think the way they did it with shotgun shells in the originals was you got bonuses "to hit" and damage, but the target got a bonus to his DR. So in essence if you had Armor it would work better at absorbing the blow.

I thought it was an excellent system and was sad to see what gamesas turned it into with FO3. How they worked AP of FMJ in the orignals was they got big boni to lower DR and DT but did lower base damage. Like for example a HP version of the same bullet would to 2/1 damage ratio but have a +20 DR modifier a FMJ bullet would only do 1/2 damage but get -20 modifier.

what that would mean is hollow points would do lots more damage to unarmored targets than FMJ. Then on the opposite hollow points would do very little to no damage to armored targets, and FMJ's would do moderate damage to them. Not as high as HP would do to unarmored targets but lots more than the HP would to the armored target.


In tactics they further added, EMP shells, and sabot and various other types of missiles. All worked beautifully.

PA is the best "all round" protection, and that was it's whole point. However it wasn't the "BEST" at everything. Tesla armor was built to stop Energy weapons and it did it better and was lighter than PA IIRC. PA had a big weakness to pulse weapons as well. I liked how they balanced it out in tactics with big hits to stealth and fine motor skills like first aid and lock picking. PA is very much the walking tank style. The lighter styles would offer various levels of protection with various other pro's and cons. I would say that combat armor would be the best you could get with no real drawbacks.

That sounds really interesting. Would be amazing to see how that would be balanced in Fo3 too.
So in tactics, if I knew I was going up against the enclave my best weapon choices would be considerably different than if I was going up against something like talon company?

Depends on your choices in armor and the weapons your enemies are sporting. If the Enclave squad is outfitted with purely energy weapons, Tesla Armor (It's vastly different in the originals if you've never played them) would work wonders against the laser and plasma weapons. However it's just like metal armor against normal bullets. So wouldn't do as good as say you wearing combat armor or PA, if you fought Talon company with assault weapons. However as always you can just run around with a good all round protection armor so you don't have to micromanage your armor. (Also IIRC you couldn't swap armor in the middle of fights like you can in FO3.)

Weapon wise You'd absolutely need heavy weapons to fight PA equipped bad guys. You'd need high damage good penetration weapons to even inflict 1 damage to them, or you can get very lucky and score the "bypasses armor" critical to deal damage to them normally. Just try fighting Enclave patrols in FO2 with just normal weapons. They had laser,plasma, gauss, and pulse weapons of there own along with there APA mk 2. so it was virtual death if you didn't have the right weaponry/protection yourself. as it should have been. Non of this killing PA equipped soldier with your bare hands or BB's. :facepalm:

The way Armor worked in the Originals was much better aswell. For example one damage type was "normal" that encompassed all bullet weapons and melee damage you'd have a listing like 10/30. Thats is Damage threshold and Damage resistance. DT is the amount of damage it would outright stop. DR as it works in FO3 reduces whats damage left by a percentage by absorbing the blow. If you get hit with 20 points of damage after armor protection you'd only end up taking 7 Damage.


Then don't get me started on the criticals hit and failure table they dropped for the dumbed down flat damage bonus we have in FO3. I would like to see the return of item prices too. PA used to cost you upwards of 20K to buy.

Thats kinda why I was so disappointed when I heard gamesas picked it up after I saw the first few screencaps and interviews. I knew then they'd abandon the originals awesome system for the modified Oblivion on we have now.

HINT HINT to you modders out there, if yo ucan put this system back in you'd be worshipped as a god.

anyway look http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_2_ammunition and http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_2_armor_and_clothing for the tables with all the originals ammo and armor listings.

I think i have the way to do just that Andaius... but i have little to no clue how to script it.

adding the damage bonuses/penalties is easy with the scripting commands we have (check if the target is wearing such and such type of armor)

in order to make it so you can switch what rounds a weapon uses, you could do something like this:

Whenever you equip a gun in your pipboy, all alternate ammo forms will display beneath it. the scripting would run something like this psuedocode:

if player equips weapon, add all the alternate forms of fire to their inventory.
if player unequips weapon, remove all the alternate forms of fire UNLESS player is equipping one of the alternate forms of fire.

since only one set of alternate forms of fire will display at one time, all someone has to do is find out how to keep a specific weapon in the player's inventory referenced by the alternate forms of fire.

If someone can script that for me, i would definitely work on a mod aimed at making FO3 like the originals

Very cool. I hope some one steps up.

for now, i guess i can buff up the damage of certain low caliber weapons for balance.

(low cal better VS low armor, high cal better VS high...)

Is it necessary to allow multiple forms of ammo for each weapon?
There is enough verity in the styles of weapons and ammo types already present to make an effective system that holds true to the core principles that Andaius has described.

edit: sorry if I misunderstood what you were saying.

there are lots of weapons, lots of different weapons. With the scripting i proposed, you would be able to use one weapon with multiple types of ammo.

Any sane person would agree one gun with multiple ammo types is more realistic than someone carrying around 5 different guns just to have access to different weapon tactics.

There is also another scripting option that i would be willing to pursue:

using FOSE tools, i would create a hotkey that, when pressed, rotates through ammo types by removing the current weapon and add/equipping another one that is identical save for what ammo it uses (and stat details)

the upside of this is you can cycle during combat easily, the downside is you cannot change the fire type in your pipboy.


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For testing purposes, anyone want to request a weapon for me to try to add multiple fire options to? I believe i can script it

okay, now that i know how to use the FOSE command functions, i should have a working toggle script up soon.

when in pipboy menu:

pressing the toggle key (H for now) will shift your currently equipped weapon to the next fire setting, this means you 'lose' that version and 'get' a different version of the weapon with the same condition.

when in gamemode:

pressing the toggle key will remove your weapon (if it is one that can be toggled) and force equip the next mode of fire.

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this has so much application range aside from being used to switch bullet types. it can be used to switch an automatic to burst, etc.

Thats the next thing I want to see in a "back to the originals" overhaul. Single fire options and burst options on most of the weapons. sounds awesome keep up the good work!

The script for this keeps on crashing my computer... T_T

could an experienced scripter please help fix this?

Help Him please! >_< I need this mod for Le DLC's your mod makes it so satisfying being in PowerArmor....and so Wtf inducing tantrums when struck by a stray bullet with no armor

any news on this?

Uh...
Haven't read through, so it may have been already asked...
Why not a CALIBR version? FOOK and many other mods shall benefit from it.
That's the only reason I'm not using it :/

if anyone can make the stupid script work without having to display a menu, i will finish working on this project, until then, i shall be playing oblivion.

Is it the script in post 15? If so, I seem to remember that the game engine is not happy with scripts starting with numbers.

http://www.fallout3nexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=1446

This mod does what your aiming for so the creator of this mod said to just credit him and You can go through it and enhance your own mod.
http://www.fallout3nexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=4159

If you want any scripting help please pm me or email me.

unfortunately, the toggling still works as an instant crash button... even if i change the name of the script...

i can make it so it is a menu toggle, but everyone and their grandma hate it because it is slow and dumb. If enough people really want the mod, i could make the menued toggles and finish it that way. It all depends on how badly everyone wants it to be like FO1 & FO2

darmani, as to that mod you mentioned, it does nowhere near what i am aiming to do.

that mod just lets you toggle the ammo when you equip it. My mod is aiming to allow you to toggle the ammo in the field, when you already have it equipped. It will also be used as a toggle for firing types (burst on AR anyone?)

the game just seems to hate my toggles that go without popping up a menu

is anyone still interested in this?

i might give it another try now.

would people be satisfied if it was a change via toggle button? (press the button, it brings up a menu, you select what you want to switch to...)

dude try to make a FWE patch pls