Repairing the Cogs of Morrowind #16

Post » Sat May 28, 2011 2:44 am

Galsiah's Character Development does this.


No, it doesn't. It merely simulates it. As it should be obvious from one of the more recent patches, certain aspects of the game treat base skill and attribute values differently than magically fortified ones. Simply eliminating the 100 point limit at the executable level (or increase it to 200 or 255 if there are save game format limitations) would eliminate certain "shortcomings" of mods that try to fake a skill-cap remover.

For example, the cost of training a skill is calculated from its base value, not its fortified one. Also, the difficulty of training a skill through usage is calculated from the base skill level. That means that any mod which fakes a skill-cap remover has the problem that the learning curve for skill advancement flat-lines at 99 (or wherever the mod maintains the actual base skill level). Hypothetically speaking, improving a skill from 999 to 1000 should be ten times as hard as improving it from 99 to 100, but it isn't. As such, skills no longer reach any sort of "point of diminishing returns" because the effort to gain the next level is exactly the same as that required to gain the previous one.

Considering that Hrnchamd has already done so much in the way of adding new features, I wouldn't have suggested this idea myself, even though I think it's a valid suggestion. But while GCD may simulate a skill and attribute cap remover, to suggest that it actually DOES that isn't really true. Not to mention the fact that GCD has a lot of features that some may want, but others may not. Personally, I prefer the advancement scheme which the Bethesda developers designed... no offense intended to Galsiah. It would allow people to enjoy the benefits of a skill/attribute cap remover without needing a mod to accomplish it. Since GCD could continue to cap the skills at 99 and magically fortify them like always (unless Galsiah wants to include a patch to take advantage of a new feature), and since it changes other aspects of character development that a genuine skill/attribute cap remover would not substitute, the suggestion would neither break nor obsolete a mod which is a favorite among many members of the Morrowind community.
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Queen of Spades
 
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Post » Fri May 27, 2011 11:21 pm

I read in the readme that it is scripted to get harder to level past 100. I do know there is a way in the editor to change the difficulty of training manually.

I wonder if anyone will make a patch for GCD if Hrnchamd actually changes the level cap, which would be better than GCD's handling of it. Unless that function can be turned off (I'll have to read the readmes again).

There are other level cap "removers" though. GCD isn't the only one. I think there's a couple on PES.
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Sam Parker
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 8:57 am

First, thanks a lot Hrnchamd for your fabulous work on this !

Second : I also love to see any remove (200 or other number) of the 100 points skill limit if that is possible !
I've already suggest this some weeks ago.
I use myself a tuned version of GCD (to avoid @@bla bla errors and to learn scripting - just for fun !!!) and a such patch could save a lot of scripting in GCD.
With a such patch, I'll still continue to use GCD (with some modifications) to have other great stuff.
Moreover its always better to do a such thing in the exe instead of doing this in scripting.

Note : all cap removers need to keep each base skill under 100 and not only GCD (which keep them under 96).
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Mandi Norton
 
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Post » Fri May 27, 2011 9:41 pm

demoralize/rally/turn undead propose fix:

partial discussion here -> http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=1041313

this proposed change for these effects is to change the magnitude effect from directly changing flee AI, to akin to the command spell, where the magnitude determines the level of the NPC/creature it will effect. this way, these spells will work and have use at low magnitudes, and thus bring use to these ignored spells.
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Shirley BEltran
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 6:42 am

I believe the intention with this mod is to remove bugs and increase stability of Morrowind, not to alter game play. I personally don't want to see the 100 cap remover, I know it is optional so I won't say to the modder to not make it.

I hope but not demand, that more stability and bug fixes can be brought to Morrowind. But as others have said, no rush and if you don't continue I won't be upset as you've already such a marvellous mod. Well done.
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Lilit Ager
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 2:09 am

Just popping in for the drinks... And the file. ;)
Nice job, Hrnchamd. I envy your skills. :)


+1

Maybe someone else can help out with the soulgem quandary another day.
http://www.gamesas.com/bgsforums/index.php?showtopic=1009853&st=10

:flamethrower: :sadvaultboy:
:dancing:
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zoe
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 8:29 am

I aplogize if this has already been fixed by the current version, since I have lost track of the changes., but the feather effect seemed broken in Morrowind last time I used it, since the basevalue was 5 times higher than the more useful fortify strenght. So I would like it changed so that the spell/enchantment was actually useful. It should be cheaper than forrtify strenght (at most ? the cost of fortify strenght).
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A Lo RIkIton'ton
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 8:33 am

I aplogize if this has already been fixed by the current version, since I have lost track of the changes., but the feather effect seemed broken in Morrowind last time I used it, since the basevalue was 5 times higher than the more useful fortify strenght. So I would like it changed so that the spell/enchantment was actually useful. It should be cheaper than forrtify strenght (at most ? the cost of fortify strenght).


Personally, I would consider that to be somewhat inefficient, but hardly "broken". I agree that fortify strength certainly does seem more useful, I wouldn't agree that something is broken merely because it's less useful.

The values and effectiveness of various spell effects are part of the game data, not part of the executable. If you want feather to cost less to cast, set its base cost to be less in the construction set. By default, the base value of feather is the same as the base value of fortify strength (NOT 5 times higher), but you can easily change that if you like. You could set it to 0.01 if you wanted. I even created a quick mod to test that it would work just so I wouldn't end up sticking my foot in my mouth if the game engine didn't accept decimal values, but guess what...

After setting the value to 0.01, I was able to put 400 points of CE feather on a single extravagant belt, so it definitely works. That makes feather considerably MORE potent than fortify strength if your concern is only carrying capacity. It just becomes a matter of preference on what value to use to make the effect more useful without tipping the scales too far the other direction.
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Valerie Marie
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 10:09 am

Excellent work as always. Take a break and that drink!
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Maeva
 
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Post » Fri May 27, 2011 8:05 pm

My internet connection dies for a week or so, and I come back to this. Great work Hrnchamd. *proceeds to dance and get drunk as requested* Now go and play the damn game!
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Jeremy Kenney
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 7:30 am

I aplogize if this has already been fixed by the current version, since I have lost track of the changes., but the feather effect seemed broken in Morrowind last time I used it, since the basevalue was 5 times higher than the more useful fortify strenght. So I would like it changed so that the spell/enchantment was actually useful. It should be cheaper than forrtify strenght (at most ? the cost of fortify strenght).


What Toccatta said. You may like the changes in http://www.hiredgoons.net/MWFiles/, which makes Feather a lot more useful (from 1.00 to 0.17) among a lot of other tweaks.
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Beulah Bell
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 10:34 am

Personally, I would consider that to be somewhat inefficient, but hardly "broken". I agree that fortify strength certainly does seem more useful, I wouldn't agree that something is broken merely because it's less useful.

The values and effectiveness of various spell effects are part of the game data, not part of the executable. If you want feather to cost less to cast, set its base cost to be less in the construction set. By default, the base value of feather is the same as the base value of fortify strength (NOT 5 times higher), but you can easily change that if you like. You could set it to 0.01 if you wanted. I even created a quick mod to test that it would work just so I wouldn't end up sticking my foot in my mouth if the game engine didn't accept decimal values, but guess what...

After setting the value to 0.01, I was able to put 400 points of CE feather on a single extravagant belt, so it definitely works. That makes feather considerably MORE potent than fortify strength if your concern is only carrying capacity. It just becomes a matter of preference on what value to use to make the effect more useful without tipping the scales too far the other direction.

The basevalue might be 1 for both spells, but in reality one pts feather enable you to carry one pound more, while one point fortify strenght enables you to carry 5 pound more, which makes fortify strenght 5 times more efficient (besides what it adds to your attack). Therefore feather is completely redundant with Morrowinds own values, eventhough it could be useful. So I consider it broken.
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Bek Rideout
 
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Post » Fri May 27, 2011 8:24 pm

:dance: :dance: :twirl: :celebration:

:cryvaultboy:

(That last one was hangover.)

Thanks very, very, very much, Hrnchamd!
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LADONA
 
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Post » Fri May 27, 2011 9:50 pm

I believe the intention with this mod is to remove bugs and increase stability of Morrowind, not to alter game play. I personally don't want to see the 100 cap remover, I know it is optional so I won't say to the modder to not make it.

I hope but not demand, that more stability and bug fixes can be brought to Morrowind. But as others have said, no rush and if you don't continue I won't be upset as you've already such a marvellous mod. Well done.


I hope as well. As far as bugs and stability are concerned, Hrmchand (sp?) himself increased the limit on spells and decreased their maximum duration which gave me reason to hope that he would be inclined to raise the limit on attributes and skills as well. I do believe that the maximum is 255 and increasing the cap to somewhere around 250 would be perfectly fine.
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Phillip Hamilton
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 6:00 am

A request for when you're feeling up to poking around again Hrnchamd. I've been getting the "please enter name" glitch when I try to create potions a great deal lately. It's a fluke when I actually get to try making something. As far as I can tell there's no real cute for this. If I"m wrong someone, please tell me, I'd like to actually use the skill.
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Jessica Thomson
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 3:43 am

A request for when you're feeling up to poking around again Hrnchamd. I've been getting the "please enter name" glitch when I try to create potions a great deal lately. It's a fluke when I actually get to try making something. As far as I can tell there's no real cute for this. If I"m wrong someone, please tell me, I'd like to actually use the skill.

I have noticed this issue myself, or my fiance has (as I almost never use Alchemy in the game myself).
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Nicholas C
 
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Post » Fri May 27, 2011 10:48 pm

Actually, there is a fix/trick to get past that problem.

ummm. I can't remember it though. Searching my memory and the forum...

I'm sure the code patch could make a permanent fix, but I know that there is an original way to get passed that somewhere.
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Svenja Hedrich
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 7:24 am

The alchemy bug can be very annoying, when I use alchemy.

Another issue which might be within the scope of the code patch is related to lockpicks and probes. I usually put them on my quickkeys, when I have a character who uses security. But if I have 10 picks, it doesn't use one lockpick up before using the next picks. So I will instead end up with 10 halfused lockpicks at some time, which is a little messy. I don't know excactly how it works though.

I suspect that this also happens with repair hammers, where it besides being messy could lead to a lot of excess weight from partly used hammers.

I have never seen anyone mention this. But I see it as a bug.
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Daniel Lozano
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 3:58 am

The alchemy bug can be very annoying, when I use alchemy.

Another issue which might be within the scope of the code patch is related to lockpicks and probes. I usually put them on my quickkeys, when I have a character who uses security. But if I have 10 picks, it doesn't use one lockpick up before using the next picks. So I will instead end up with 10 halfused lockpicks at some time, which is a little messy. I don't know excactly how it works though.

I suspect that this also happens with repair hammers, where it besides being messy could lead to a lot of excess weight from partly used hammers.

I have never seen anyone mention this. But I see it as a bug.


Probably not the solution you're looking for, but I select a used lock pick and probe for my quick key, and it always selects the correct one. However, when your lock pick or probe gets used up, you'll have to do it again.

The reason is that a new lock pick or probe is a master object, while a used one is a reference object. The first time you use one the game engine assigns a reference ID to it so it can keep track of how many uses it has left. Since your quick key is set to the new pick or probe's master ID, that's what it'll try to use as long as you've got them. But if you assign it a used pick or probe, it'll store the reference ID and keep selecting the same one each time until it's used up. I've never put a repair hammer on a quick key, but I presume the same trick would work.
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suzan
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 4:41 am

Regarding the Alchemy glitch, I saw this in the general thread:

Not sure ablut the sun but when I get the alchemy glitch I just quicksave then reload and it works fine.


Haven't tried it myself and it's of course no fix, but if it works it might save some frustration.
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Mr. Ray
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 12:41 am

Well im again asking to fixing refmaps on psyhiqued meshes
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GabiiE Liiziiouz
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 8:06 am

Well im again asking to fixing refmaps on psyhiqued meshes

It's been done. Ref maps, aka gloss maps are no longer culled and haven't been since ver 1.4.
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Allison C
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 1:25 am

It's been done. Ref maps, aka gloss maps are no longer culled and haven't been since ver 1.4.


I ment the other bug, the one that ref/env maps dont appear on skinned player/npc meshes
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Roanne Bardsley
 
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Post » Fri May 27, 2011 8:48 pm

Thanks, Hrnchamd. As always, excellent work :thumbsup:
I don't want to see any more requests in this thread. Just dancing and drunkenness and setting fire to the undead.
Oh, http://content.ytmnd.com/content/7/3/f/73f2c91b70202f43147b7417d16e7eec.gif. But I think http://www.sportsposterwarehouse.com/catImages/ezsurfer03sl-1.jpg enjoys it...

:foodndrink:
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tegan fiamengo
 
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Post » Sat May 28, 2011 2:02 am

I would like to report that the bug I and aparently a few others had with the game not properly taking things from your inventory that you have, yet still subtracting the weight anyway, is caused by a dirty save.

If you have a save that, in Wrye Mash, is not purple or doesn't stay purple it will cause this problem. Only recently have I learned how to properly and thoroughly clean and fix a save (that kept turning orange again no matter what I did) and the problem hasn't turned up since, or at least has become so uncommon that I've yet to see it after cleaning the saves thoroughly.



Edit 10-3: Uncommon, but it just did it again.
10-5: It isn't an even uncommon problem. It's very annoying having to restart Morrowind all the time because Bethesda couldn't even code their game right.
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Angela
 
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